City Boundry Extension Discussion

limerick_man

I live in Raheen and I'm really proud of being from Limerick City.

But what the hell, now there saying it looks like it'll become a town unless people buy these appartments and live there rathar then rent them to boost the population?

I was just thinking what could be worst then being slagged because of the "Stab City" thing well could you imagine "Stab Town" for god damn sake.

The County Councel should just let Limerick Coroperation extend into Raheen and Castletroy. I mean we're are University City but we dont have a uni in are city???

The county seems money mad, what do ye think?

billy the squid

The county councils greed is only part of the problem in my opinion. as you may have noticed the businesses of the city centre like keily electrical are moving out into the county juristiction. This is because the council rates for business in Limerick are one of the highest in Limerick.

businesses cannot do business properly in limerick because they are bearly breaking even with the high rates the city council is charging them.

businesses will object to a boundry extension because the rates in county council areas are far more competitive.

jbkenn

limerick_man wrote:

I live in Raheen and I'm really proud of being from Limerick City.

Limerick County

The county seems money mad, what do ye think?

Have you seen the the map of the proposed boundary extension? it looks like the City Council want to hoover up every piece of ratable property in counties Limerick and Clare.

as you may have noticed the businesses of the city centre like keily electrical are moving out into the county juristiction.

Kiely's are still in Limerick City, the county boundary is the Groody river.

jbkenn
p.s. I am in favour of a boundary extension.

Dave

Jaysus "limerick_man" that post was painful to read.

limerick_man

City Councell have high rates because they dont have as many tax payers, if they got the bondary extension, no doubt they would lower the rates.

billy the squid

I dont know it will take more than a boundry to clear the 18 million they owe.

1huge1

Lately ive heard a lot of people from galway saying that galway will be bigger tha limerick and cork within 10-15yrs.But I think they are not counting the greater limerick city area like they are with Galway
Is it true that it will be bigger because at the moment it dosnt even deserve to be called a city.

billy the squid

the trouble with limerick is that the population is staying the same but its turning into a donut shape just outside the city boundry. If limerick were not to get its boundry extension the only option would be to lower rates and start building up instead of out.

bazz26

1huge1 wrote:

Lately ive heard a lot of people from galway saying that galway will be bigger tha limerick and cork within 10-15yrs.But I think they are not counting the greater limerick city area like they are with Galway
Is it true that it will be bigger because at the moment it dosnt even deserve to be called a city.

Yes if you were to include the populations of Raheen, Castletroy, Caherdavin, Shannon Banks and Westbury as part of the city then Limerick would be considered more populated than Galway.

When Galway city looks for a boundry extention it gets it.

Karmafaerie

What gets me is, everyone, informed in the situation, the whole country over, knows that Limerick needs the extention.
In fact, it's the mid-west as a whole needs the extention, but when it's blocked time and time again, nobody say's anything!
The people of the city, should realise that it is us that this is hurting, we need to show our support for the extention, rather than just sit around and complain about not getting it!

oceallachain

I think at the moment Galway is already considered to be bigger than Limerick. In 2002 Limerick had a population of 55,000 compared to Galway's 65,000. http://www.cso.ie/statistics/popnofeachprovcountycity2002.htm

Is this accurate? No, it's so misleading. Anyone who ever visited both cities would know that Limerick is far bigger and more populated than Galway. We need Castletroy, Raheen and Caherdavin inside our boundaries now. We will probably never get Shannon Banks or Westbury due to them not even being inside Limerick County's border so I won't even go there despite everyone living in these Clare parts are either working or being educated in Limerick.

Greater Limerick Area is probably 100,000+. I mean U.L. alone has about 12,000 in student/staff numbers to add to our already 54,000 srong population.

1huge1

Id say 120,000+ easy but what possible reason do they have for not extending them? there taxes going to the county and not the city surely they dont want that

billy the squid

all down to money really, just emagine the amount of money limerick county council would loose if it were to give up raheen and castletroy.

bazz26

oceallachain wrote:

I think at the moment Galway is already considered to be bigger than Limerick. In 2002 Limerick had a population of 55,000 compared to Galway's 65,000. http://www.cso.ie/statistics/popnofeachprovcountycity2002.htm

Is this accurate? No, it's so misleading. Anyone who ever visited both cities would know that Limerick is far bigger and more populated than Galway. We need Castletroy, Raheen and Caherdavin inside our boundaries now. We will probably never get Shannon Banks or Westbury due to them not even being inside Limerick County's border so I won't even go there despite everyone living in these Clare parts are either working or being educated in Limerick.

Greater Limerick Area is probably 100,000+. I mean U.L. alone has about 12,000 in student/staff numbers to add to our already 54,000 srong population.

Agree with you on the Shannon Banks/Westbury thing but it is amazing how many people living there register their cars in Limerick. The amount of of 04/05 L cars out their is unreal. I know a good couple of people out there with Shannon Banks/Westbury, Limerick as their postal address. But that is another debate.

Yes its all down to revenue, similar to the suituation where we have a motor tax office for both the city and county. No way either wants to reduce this to one as the revenue loss is huge.

limerick_man

What the only real solution would be if Limerick City Councell and the county councell would be to create a finacial partnership wherein they would have one big fund which both would use.
This would be the only real way of saving Limerick from everything!!!
But county councell would disagree because they're not that thick, they know they are the richest councell in the country while the city is one of the poorest with huge debts.

bazz26

limerick_man wrote:

What the only real solution would be if Limerick City Councell and the county councell would be to create a finacial partnership wherein they would have one big fund which both would use.
This would be the only real way of saving Limerick from everything!!!
But county councell would disagree because they're not that thick, they know they are the richest councell in the country while the city is one of the poorest with huge debts.

Must be all those traffic lights they bought recently...

billy the squid

bazz26 wrote:

Must be all those traffic lights they bought recently...

were you not there when there was a thursday special on traffic lights in Lidl

they stuck them on hyde road and on the yellow road roundabout.

limerick_man

Galway has a larger population because of bondery extensions but Limerick has over 100,000 people living within the same radius which is alot more than Galway!

Jammyd

no in fact if a boundary extension was got limerick city would have a population of 85000 and that includes all the suburbs and near out as far as shannon. galway cities pop is over 70000 (68000 in 2002) and dis does not include its suburbs of bearna which has well over 5500 and growing by the day and greater oranmore which has over 9000 a bowling alley cinema etc + galway is now building a town known as ardaun which will cater for a further 15000-20000 people most of which will be in the county not city borough so enough about this boundry c***.

Victor

Look at "Census 2002 Volume 1 Population Classified by Area" (CSO) http://www.cso.ie/census/Census2002Results.htm

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Limerick

Clare County (contd.)
Limerick Suburbs (pt.)(b) Ballyglass* 3,851

Limerick County and City
Limerick Limerick City – 54,023
Limerick Suburbs (pt.)(b) Total – 29,124
Ballycummin* 12,382
Ballysimon* 8,380 3
Limerick North Rural* 6,427
Limerick South Rural* 959
Roxborough* 544
Ballyvarra* 432

Total 86998

---

Galway

Galway County and City
Galway Galway City – 65,832
Galway Suburbs Ballintemple 331

Total 66,163

---

Cork

Cork County and City
Cork Cork City – 123,062
Cork Suburbs Total – 63,177
Douglas* 15,286
Ballincollig* 14,591
Lehenagh* 7,969 9
Rathcooney* 6,066
Caherlag* 5,221
Inishkenny* 4,563
St. Mary’s* 4,088
Riverstown* 3,506
Carrigtohill* 599
Whitechurch* 571
Carrigrohane Beg* 494
Bishopstown* 113
Blarney* 101
Monkstown Rural* 9

Total 186,239

---

Waterford

Kilkenny County
Suburbs of Waterford Total – 2,142
Kilculliheen* 2,042
Aglish* 85
Rathpatrick* 15

Waterford County and City
Waterford Waterford City – 44,594

Total 46,736

---

Naas-Newbridge-Kidare

Kildare County
003 Naas Urban 18,288

Kildare County (contd.)
Naas No. 1 rural area 62,640

Total 80,928

Victor

Jammyd wrote:

no in fact if a boundary extension was got limerick city would have a population of 85000 and that includes all the suburbs and near out as far as shannon. galway cities pop is over 70000 (68000 in 2002) and dis does not include its suburbs of bearna which has well over 5500 and growing by the day and greater oranmore which has over 9000 a bowling alley cinema etc + galway is now building a town known as ardaun which will cater for a further 15000-20000 people most of which will be in the county not city borough so enough about this boundry c***.

Oranmore had a population of 2,385 in 2002. Barna is part in / part out of the city and most of the population is included in the city part, which had a population of 66,183.

Now one could add the Galway rural for another 31,901, but this is clutching at straws as it includes the Aran Islands, Claregalway, Furbogh, Oranmore, Spiddle, etc. which are in no way contiguous with the city.

Galway County (contd.)

Galway rural area 31,901
040 Annaghdown 1,551
041 Aughrim 865
042 Ballintemple (part) 1,096
043 Ballynacourty 1,050
044 Barna (part) 2,476
045 Belleville 462
046 Carnmore 1,989
047 Carrowbrowne (part) 756
048 Claregalway 1,635
049 Clarinbridge 2,092
050 Deerpark 1,069
051 Furbogh 1,272
052 Galway Rural (part) 131
053 Inishmore 1,280
054 Kilcummin 1,298
055 Killannin 831
056 Lackaghbeg 947
057 Liscananaun 1,112
058 Lisheenavalla 780
059 Moycullen 1,402
060 Oranmore 2,385
061 Selerna 1,299
062 Slieveaneena 649
063 Spiddle 1,253
064 Stradbally 854
065 Tullokyne 1,367

Jammyd

oranmore does have a populaton of over 9000 and bearna over 5500 its just when census was taken in 2002 the boundary's of these settlements had not been redrawn regardless of the huge housing estates in these areas + that was also 3 years ago with many new estates after coming on stream. if this was not the case they would not have 4 shopping centres between them which are kept going by the many local's. im not saying galway is much bigger than limerick cause there basically the same size regarding popultion. but id just like to get the point accross that galway is growing faster than limerick and 90% of the growth to take place including a new town of 20000people will take place in county galway.. yet ya dont here people in galway giving out.......

billy the squid

you will need to start providing sources for your claim jammyd, victor has done so now it is your turn.

Jammyd

my sources come from the cso website which is a huge site and not entirely up to date as victors figures are outdated and where compiled 4 years ago.. also in a recent edition of the connacht tribune it stated the population of the oranmore area was over 9000 not including the rural area.. however i cannot post the address as the tribunes website does not have an archive facility. i think ive made my point regardless of having proof.. just check the growth rates on the cso webpage..

limerick_man

Look above Jammyd ... There's the proof!

limerick_man

Belive me think of all the rents from the cresant and Raheen Business Park and Mungret Bussiness Park and, well everywhere.
Hell that Dundrum Shopping Centre brings in €20m a year for Dun Laorigre (spellt wrong) council!

Victor

Jammyd wrote:

my sources come from the cso website which is a huge site and not entirely up to date as victors figures are outdated and where compiled 4 years ago.. also in a recent edition of the connacht tribune it stated the population of the oranmore area was over 9000 not including the rural area.. however i cannot post the address as the tribunes website does not have an archive facility. i think ive made my point regardless of having proof.. just check the growth rates on the cso webpage..

Actually, it would appear Banra has a population of 13298 (10822+2476). Maybe you got you figures mixed up?

Kindly note that April 2002 to March 2005 less less than 3 years, not your "4 years".

Jammyd

i said 4 years because most of the data compiled in census2002 was collected in 2001 for your info.. i have relations in the cso who told me that... :rolleyes: by the way thanks for prooving my point bout bearna's population being in accurate..

1huge1

I find it very hard to believe that Limerick cities population is under 100,000 there must be something were not taking into account

limerick_man

Offically it is under 100,000, hell its well below that, but that does not take in suburbs of the city, the bondary is so tight that really only the city centre is covered.

If like most places in Ireland they were to take in the rest of the suburbs the pop would be over 100,000.

Thats why the 3 councils have to work together when doing anything to improve the city!

Victor

limerick_man wrote:

Offically it is under 100,000, hell its well below that, but that does not take in suburbs of the city, the bondary is so tight that really only the city centre is covered. If like most places in Ireland they were to take in the rest of the suburbs the pop would be over 100,000.

So which suburbs are missing from my total above?

Karmafaerie

You mean besides Castletroy, Raheen, and Dooradoyle?! Let's not even mention Corbally!!!
I could be wrong, but I didn't see them mentioned.

Victor

Karmafaerie wrote:

You mean besides Castletroy, Raheen, and Dooradoyle?! Let's not even mention Corbally!!! I could be wrong, but I didn't see them mentioned.

It would appear that they are included in other townlands.

My geography of Limerick isn't the best, how well do the above match up with the other areas listed?

limerick_man

Yep none of the above are listed plus others (just cant think of them)

Victor

OK someone mark each of the above of this map.

billy the squid

Victor wrote:

Look at "Census 2002 Volume 1 Population Classified by Area" (CSO) http://www.cso.ie/census/Census2002Results.htm

---

Limerick

Clare County (contd.)
Limerick Suburbs (pt.)(b) Ballyglass* 3,851

Limerick County and City
Limerick Limerick City – 54,023
Limerick Suburbs (pt.)(b) Total – 29,124
Ballycummin* 12,382
Ballysimon* 8,380 3
Limerick North Rural* 6,427
Limerick South Rural* 959
Roxborough* 544
Ballyvarra* 432

Total 86998

---

Galway

Galway County and City
Galway Galway City – 65,832
Galway Suburbs Ballintemple 331

Total 66,163

---

Cork

Cork County and City
Cork Cork City – 123,062
Cork Suburbs Total – 63,177
Douglas* 15,286
Ballincollig* 14,591
Lehenagh* 7,969 9
Rathcooney* 6,066
Caherlag* 5,221
Inishkenny* 4,563
St. Mary’s* 4,088
Riverstown* 3,506
Carrigtohill* 599
Whitechurch* 571
Carrigrohane Beg* 494
Bishopstown* 113
Blarney* 101
Monkstown Rural* 9

Total 186,239

---

Waterford

Kilkenny County
Suburbs of Waterford Total – 2,142
Kilculliheen* 2,042
Aglish* 85
Rathpatrick* 15

Waterford County and City
Waterford Waterford City – 44,594

Total 46,736

---

Naas-Newbridge-Kidare

Kildare County
003 Naas Urban 18,288

Kildare County (contd.)
Naas No. 1 rural area 62,640

Total 80,928

Ballycumin is further out than raheen. it is the neighbouring area on the side of raheen opposite the city.

a map which has the names of the places on it



all areas to the best of my knowledge are built up as far out as at least raheen, castletroy, and coonagh. it could be further out, its not a part of the city i frequent.

as well as that I thought Roxborough was in the city boundries. its between Rathban and southhill

billy the squid

actually here is a better map

billy the squid

ive also just noticed that AA roadwatch's map of limerick is six years out of date.

Karmafaerie

I can see my house from here!!!

billy the squid

http://www.limerickpost.ie/dailynews.elive?id=6207&category=Daily-Thu

the boys and girls of both the city and county council are still at it.

but to be honest I blame the Department of the Environment for being slow to deal with this issue. of course they escape critism in the above mentioned article.

limerick_man

Ok so some new news ... no bondary extension!

The reasons Co. Co. gave were They'd lose money, rates would increase, and council housing would be put in Castletroy and Raheen. City Co. have not denied that but said they will press on! Co. Co. also said City have enough space for the next forty years of development

As a big supportor of an extension... i never thought council housing would be put in my area! I knew rates would probably go up a bit!

What do people think now about the extension are ye still supporters or do ye wanna shut it down!

At the moment i am unsure but if City Co. would say they would not build council housing around established areas they i would support them again!

billy the squid

the poor have to live somewhere. would you prefer workhouses to council houses.

Karmafaerie

billy the squid wrote:

the poor have to live somewhere. would you prefer workhouses to council houses.

Zeig Heill!!!

billy the squid

Its just that to reject the idea that there should be a boundry extension simply because they would build council houses in castletroy is a sign of the NIMBY (not in my back yard) syndrome.

limerick_man

Well casteltroy esepically is considered an upmarket area of the city!

We need some places to remain scumbag free!!

you wouldnt happen to live in castletroy would you. or are from castle troy.

in that case then Ballinacurra Weston should be considered upmarket too.

billy the squid

not all people looking for social housing are scumbags. alot of people looking for social housing nowadays are working people who have been outpriced by the housing market.

and since when was castletroy scumbag free

1huge1

well if it would lose the city money maybe they shouldnt

jonski

iirc there has to be over 50,000 people living here for it to be called a city , atm there are only 52/3,000 people . Time is running out , lose the city status and lose all the EU funding that goes with it .

why do you think they are banging up 14 and 15 storey apartment blocks.

and their living over the shop campaign. what a failure that was. people dont want to live in rented apartments, they want to own their own places, but the prices in urban areas are too high, hence the reason they are moving out to places in the county and commuting into the city to work.

billy the squid

just a note I've merged the two threads on boundry extensions

limerick_man

What are you talking about the 'Living over shopping' scheme is only one year in and already the city is full of high rise apartments from the thing at the shannon bridge to the restoration of that building on henry street!!!

The problem with it is that people are buying these apartments and renting them out to people who come from other areas... so in actual fact the owner says he lives in his house ...(not the apartment) and the resident says they live whereever they came from!

billy the squid

Actually its running 4 years not one year almost to the very day
http://www.limerickcity.ie/services/planning/pl_development_LOTS.html

Liemrick corporation themselves have said that Living over the shop scheme was not as successful as originally hoped.