Electric Picnic - no RTE coverage. BBC are all over Glastonbury

RoTelly

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123766085#Comment_123766085

I they really going to be "editing" take a look at what they have on that channel, its mainly promos, gript happened to where I found it but there are about 5 others etenders form other news sources, that one happens to stand out.

You now just defending RTÉ… with they have a responsibility… I never suggested otherwise.

You'd think that RTÉ would have in-house staff that could manage that role.

I haven't say no matter the cost, I have have said within their cost base and I said everyone is entitled to criticize the production, but you can't criticize something that isn't there.

RTÉ could utilize EP coverage across all social media channels also, while the broadcast/stream can be shared with 2FM and RTÉ2.

RTÉ have a responsibly to produce content full-stop. They cut funding to Children't Content by 75% between 2015 and 2017, while it just 2% of their over all budget.

RoTelly

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123766125#Comment_123766125

Do read any of what I type, I literally in my first post on this tread stated that many act may not want to be broadcast and it might be in their contract.

There are too many factors that we are not aware of to fully blame RTÉ.

AndrewJRenko

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123765942#Comment_123765942

Have you heard of 'rosters'?

Fanirish

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123766126#Comment_123766126

In this thread you keep coming up with examples of what you believe is wasteful spending by RTE, yet you want RTE to waste a lot of money on a EP tv broadcast. They did it for years and it was widely critiqued as rubbish yet you want them to have another go and waste more money?

RTE can’t utilise EP coverage across social media and broadcast streams when it won’t have rights to the main artists. No one will be pleased tuning into rte2 broadcast and it only being the Irish acts and none of the big international names

RTE have a mandate to produce high quality content covering Irish culture including the arts whilst balancing for value for money and viewership/listenership. This does not mean they have any obligations to carry out TV broadcasts from a Live nation festival.

poppers

Today Fm have a massive tent down there for yrs and broadcast some of their regular shows from there over the weekend.

i assume they have some sort of deal signed to keep other broadcasters out.

Fanirish

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123766407#Comment_123766407

2fm have their outside broadcast truck down there and are broadcasting from down there with interviews with artists and odd acoustic performance from Irish acts.

RoTelly

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123766390#Comment_123766390

You understand that any of the expenses that I mention you won't see as content or relating to content.

Where as if RTÉ commission, produce or broadcast a piece of content that they have invest in you see the resulting product.

You understand that if the finished product is not to your liking you can criticize the product.

But if RTÉ waste money in areas that are unexplainable waste you can't criticize that.

I'd rather RTÉ produce a content that I can say "you know they did a good job there well done" or "no, that was shite typical RTÉ"… but at least they have something even if its not great.

I'd check out RTÉ's sporting podcast on YouTube and see if you agree that they have missed the mandate to produce high quality content.

There are plenty of examples of content that does not show this mandate.

I am not saying that RTÉ have any obligations to cover a Live festival, as I said

There are too many factors that we are not aware of to fully blame RTÉ.

sprucemoose

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123765942#Comment_123765942

you do realise working from home is different from not turning up to work? i dont know who that person is but there's a good chance that these people are perfectly capable of working from home for most, if not all, of the time

RoTelly

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123766667#Comment_123766667

They don't turn up during August :)

RoTelly

https://www.breakingnews.ie/ireland/rte-set-to-spend-e755000-on-market-research-over-next-three-years-1606051.html

https://www.irishmirror.ie/news/irish-news/cash-strapped-rte-spend-15-32355618

https://gript.ie/rte-say-who-wants-e250k-to-manage-our-kids-youtube-channel/

https://www.independent.ie/irish-news/rte-announces-its-hiring-fair-city-photographer-for-60k-a-year-after-dgs-shock-over-reported-80k-bill/a2030009355.html

https://www.irishexaminer.com/news/arid-41470018.html

https://www.independent.ie/irish-news/rte-tenders-for-corporate-travel-for-840k-over-the-next-four-years/a272054141.html

I work these out to cost in the region of €6m over 5 years.

Almost every item on this list RTÉ employees people in house to work on, why the doubling up?

Fanirish

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123766697#Comment_123766697

no doubling up at for any of those

• RTE needs to collect market research data to inform its content and ensure its meeting its public service remit. Hiring market research firms to collect market research data is very reasonable. Rte has an audience unit who use and analyse market research to inform the orgs decisions
• RTE had enormous scandals about its financial practices, governance and controls. To rectify thus it needs to hire experts on those topics to consult on new practices, control mechanisms to ensure those bad practices do not return. It doesn’t have that expertise on staff.
• again with this tender for kids YouTube channels editing, production and social media management. Evidently RTE does not have resources in house to carry this out hence the tender.
• Fair city is leading soap and requires promotional photos to be taken on a daily basis for use across media channels and outlets. It tenders this out to a suitable professional photographer.
• RTE commissions programs internationally with partners, it is involved in Eurovision and many other pan European broadcasting initiatives, it needs to meet agencies/companies involved in advertising. These require corporate staff to travel outside Ireland hence a corporate travel service like any medium sized firm with hundreds of employees who travel on a regular basis.
  
  
  

Fanirish

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123766579#Comment_123766579

RTE previously invested in broadcasting from EP. It was widely hated as they little or no rights from the major acts. But they keep saying the ought to bring it back.
shall rte commission upwardly mobile again even though it’s seen as worst comedy they ever commissioned.

RoTelly

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123766833#Comment_123766833

RTÉ has an in-house market research team. How does it prove that it is meeting it's public service remit, you seem to believe that RTÉ is a good public service broadcaster. As you point out they must fit their needs, either keep it in house or reduce numbers.

Your right about the financial however most of these tenders and I think this one is up for renewal, so they had this during the time of their mistakes in governence, while they have a well paid leadership team.

Have you looked at the Youtube channel, the channel is file with promotions, that are produced in house.

RTÉ once had a stills department, then they got a photographer in on this contract, and the photographer is now consider staff, was anyone in RTÉ given a written warning on this issue?

Again you have to cut costs.

Your just defending RTÉ, do you working for them.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123766857#Comment_123766857

Maybe if RTÉ had reduced their tender numbers they might have had happier audiences.

Can you name a good comedy from RTÉ, surely with all that market research RTÉ would know good TV.

RoTelly

https://www.youtube.com/%40RTEKids/videos

The last video posted is a clip of a new series called holt, a gap of 9 days between the previous one, 1 video a week!

Over the last month they have uploaded a total of 15 videos, that's 2 a day. all clips or promos, their is a promo dept in RTÉ and staff to do this.

In fairness just less than one video a day for the last 52 weeks.

But one video of largely clips and promos, that are most like give to the uploader by RTÉ themselves, not sure about the shorts looks like patch updates on them

Live was the Home school hub from 2020. and 2 podcasts from RTÉ in full not much editing their.

L1011

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123766989#Comment_123766989

Have you ever considered that you are dangerously obsessed with RTÉ?

RoTelly

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123767013#Comment_123767013

:) I have haha

Fanirish

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123766989#Comment_123766989

RTE does not have a market research team. It has an audience insight team. Not sure why you are lying about that. Having an audience insight team doesn’t exclude the need to tender a market research company to carry market.
Why are you asking me about how RTE meets its public service remit?
I never said whether RTE is meeting its public service remits or not.

so previously RTE had paid employees in a stills department, it disbanded this unit and relies on freelance contractors to fill this need? How is this doubling expenditure? An in-house cost was eliminated and an external freelancers were hired?

RTE has enormous Revenue issues with incorrect classification of freelancers who ought to be have been treated as employees. .

I have not defended RTE, you made allegations that all of the above was wasteful. I merely pointed out that a public service broadcaster with the size of RTE they all appear to be legitimate and pertinent expenditure.

the tenders are for legitimate expenditure that the organisation needs to incur from a quick review.
as you said yourself either RTE hires in-house staff to carry out this work or tender for a private company to do the work.
tendering would likely be the cost beneficial option rather than hiring in-house staff permanently with pensions etc.

RoTelly

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123767067#Comment_123767067

IMO (must I start that with everything I say on an opinion board) RTÉ is wasting money on the things I have listed and much more. That is an opinion. I also believe there is some doubling up of much of what they do in RTÉ and some of these tenders.

There are other tenders (e.g. a tender for vehicles for 2RN (their networks)) which are required.

I would assume since they have carried out their market research into their public service remit that this is available.

I believe it to be wasteful, you can defend it as necessary if you wish, and so can RTÉ, but going on the past I see nothing worthwhile in these tenders for RTÉ. Much of research will fall on deaf ears and be presented as RTÉ doing their job.

You seem to believe that RTÉ understand cost benefits.

Just to get this back to the EP broadcast these are my points.

1. RTÉ 2 has nothing better to show
2. There are a huge number of rights issues and contracts before RTÉ could even begin to broadcast the festival
3. RTÉ has the money to produce/broadcast such a programme. (Perhaps I should put IMO on this, but really I don't believe the cost of production to be an issue).
4. Clearly RTÉ has to make a decision on public service and commercial aspects of this and both have to be weight up.
5. The audience numbers may not dictate the public service part of their remit
6. Yes, RTÉ might be criticize for the broadcast, but they also may not be, they might also be congratulated for doing a good job.

Fanirish

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123767115#Comment_123767115

• rte 2 evidently has better things to show cause it’s showing them
• You acknowledge that broadcasting EP is an enormous administration drain/waste on the rights and contracts aspect alone. An organisation that’s going through a massive headcount reduction.
• A 3 day outside prospect that would involve 30 plus RTE staff and involve covering accommodation/hotel costs. Taking about a Six figure cost at least for a cash strapped entity.
• EP coverage in 2014 only had 100k viewers across the weekend of coverage. An average League of Ireland match gets similar numbers per match.
• RTE were heavily criticised for prior EP coverage as substandard and disappointing given lack of coverage of top artists. There is no way this could be avoided in the future

techman1

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123766667#Comment_123766667

we are talking about an outside broadcast from EP, that can't be done from home. I was surprised that an organisation by its nature a state broadcaster seemingly had so many employees not even on site. I suspect similar to other state bodies that they havn't returned to normal work patterns since Covid and that explains why they can no longer carry out broadcasts they used to do before Covid, the new WFH pattern has been set in

amacca

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123597591#Comment_123597591

Who is that prick?

RoTelly

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123767170#Comment_123767170

1. Did you read the schedule that I posted? they don't.
   https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123765486#Comment_123765486
2. RTÉ has numerous staff and they have people involved in both music rights and in programme rights. as I say they spend 8m on music rights and 25m on programming rights. (I would not mind but I admit this point to you, you seem to think that I really think RTÉ should show EP).
3. As I say they spend six-figures sums on things that have little to do with content.
4. Outside of sport RTÉ2 gets little more that 100K in terms of audience for any show*.
5. You can make improvements but as I say RTÉ2 has no discernable Irish programming on the air outside of Sport.

*last week just 128k adult viewers tuned to RTÉ2 for the Ladies WRC (Ireland V Japan), this excludes online and the +1 channel). The top show outside of sports was The Simpsons with 53K, No Irish programme outside sport had more than 32K (though you'd be lucky to find an Irish programme on the channel that week or any other week), Home and Away Lowest audience was just 33K it highest 48K. Only 8 of the top 20 shows for last week were non-sports programmes, and only one programme had over 100K. If RTÉ2 is there to predicted the death of TV, its doing a good job.

This figures are Live broadcast for RTÉ2 (not including +1 or Player figures)

L1011

Music rights in Ireland are automatic. Send your playlists and a very large pile of cash to IMRO and PPI. Done.

Red Silurian

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123767329#Comment_123767329

Would RTE even need to pay for these music rights?

L1011

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123774589#Comment_123774589

They do.

Fanirish

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123767329#Comment_123767329

that only radio play and snippets being used for interludes and during programming.
broadcasting footage from a festival have to be negotiated individually with each artist. They have to agree compensation, usage rights and timelines.

An artist may allow rte to broadcast 15 mins on terrestrial tv but no streaming rights and not allowed to put any up on YouTube etc.

bbc Glastonbury footage is prime example. Full sets up for set period on iplayer, a song or two per act up on YouTube then all removed after timeline exhausted.
It’s all time consuming for organisers /bbc to negotiate with artist teams.

L1011

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123774671#Comment_123774671

That's the rights to the actual performance, not the music licence; I was responding to someone claiming that RTÉ had people arranging music rights when they don't - because they don't need to.

Broadcasters are well used to negotiating broadcast rights for specific content including maximum repeats, length of time on streaming etc - as they do that for absolutely everything they show or produce.

It really isn't a major reason to stop RTÉ showing EP - the production cost is what would kill them.

RoTelly

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123774671#Comment_123774671

But you admit that RTÉ have a team of people working for them on Rights and copywrite and it is possibly are large team that work on this for the organisation.

In saying this EP and the artists at EP may simply not be providing any rights for coverage of the event.

I believe that TG4 did in the end air Kneecap Beo on Saturday.

Fanirish

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123774723#Comment_123774723

ah apologies.
tbh RTE don’t negotiate a lot, they buy so much content in from international tv distributors with set terms.
For its own in house shows that feature music performances like the late late it will have a boiler plate agreement for exploitation of that performance.

Look at Neil young and Glastonbury this year, ge quit it over tv rights and then walked it back.
the back and forths with headline talent on broadcast eat up so much time for legal and agents.
Big acts rightfully wanna control what professional footage is out there and who can exploit it and for how long.

a festival like EP has no power in that situation and big acts like Chappell roan, Sam Fender and Kings of Leon would rightfully either not allow footage to be recorded or put such terms on it that it would be useless. Someone like Chappell might have a Netflix concert special deal happening so not going to allow rte within a million miles of them.

Fanirish

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123774731#Comment_123774731

RTE has a legal team, yes RTE has developed legal disclaimers for musicians appearing on its programs to assign rights to RTE to exploit that music performance under set terms.
would RTE have a team working on copyright or negotiating rights on a daily basis for music rights? No.
RTE is making 400 staff redundant out of 1700, already a 100 staff have gone in last year. Where do you think RTE has the resources to devote legal staff spending weeks/months negotiating rights for a 3 day festival?

Great that Kneecap gave there rights to TG4. Irish artists assigning tv rights for electric picnic was and never is the issue.