Insignia advice needed

soups05

Hi all

A couple of years ago I purchased a 2010 insignia, posted here and got loads of really useful advice. (HellRaiser if I remeber)

I followed all the advice and had many happy miles of motoring, except for a clutch problem but thems the breaks.

So two weeks ago I am driving home from work (appox 35 kms) and the temp gauge went from 90 right up to max and the car died as I pulled into the hard shoulder. I popped the bonnet and the coolant was literaly bubbling into the expansion tank.

After letting it cool for a while I limped it home. Did some research on youtube/co worker who had the same car. diagnosed a thermostat jammed closed. Replaced it and had the same issue. Car will sit at idle for 45 mins at the correct temp. No coolant lost. Oil level perfect. No milky coolant/oil.

But everytime I test drive it the temp shoots up fast. If I let it idle at the side of the road it cools down to normal. Fans work, radiator seems fine. tried 4 different mechanics and all were "too busy" once I described the issue. Finally a mechanic advised that the waterpump is probally gone but regardless the engine is shot since it overheated once.

Any suggestions or am I looking for a new car? I love the siggy and spent a lot maintaining it but don't want to fall into a sunk cost mistake.

blackbox

If the water pump was gone I'd expect it to overheat when idling.

soups05

Interesting…so there may be hope yet.

standardg60

Water pump was my first thought too, do the vents blow progressively warmer inside the car as it reaches temp?

If not that would be another sign. When was the timing belt/pump last done?

soups05

vents blow cold air constantly since it overheated. Timing belt and pump were done just before i bought it about two years ago. My previous mechanic checked the belt a few times while doing other work and declared it fine. But due to other issues I changed mechanics lol.

I had thought the AC was on the way out in dec as the windows randomly steamed up sometimes while driving on the motorway but that issues stopped over xmas before I could get it looked at.

That being said the clutch was replaced early 24, would the belt be done as part of that?

Esel

@Hellrazer 😀

Hellrazer

Change the expansion bottle and cap first. Well known issue. When you take the old one off it will more than likely be cracked and leaking under pressure.

If that solves it you'll be good to go. But take my advice and buy a genuine one..the spurious ones are useless. If it doesn't post back here.

honda boi

Had a similar issue with my avensis.

Idling everything was fine. Coolant level stayed the same.

But when any load was put on the engine, as in driving, the coolant would p**s out the overflow pipe.

Was the head gasket leaking on the exhaust side so no coolant mixing with oil.

But as hellraiser says, try the expansion tank first. As it's a hell of a lot cheaper then a head gasket repair

soups05

I replaced the tank with a febi bilstein one last year after the old one started leaking. I can certainly replace it again. The thing is I am not losing coolant at all. apart from refilling after I changed thermostat the levels have been fine….juat boiling :(

soups05

The cap, I missed that part of your post. A bad cap could cause issues but I just realised I never replaced the cap last time.

DublinDilbert

Nothing specific to this model as such, but I have seen in the past with water pumps with a plastic impeller, where the impeller cracks. The water pump still operated when the car was idling, but when the RPM went up it would start to slip and wouldn't shift enough water. The only issue is you need to pull out the water pump to check it.

soups05

I am hopeful it's the cap, not that my luck is that good lol. ordered it and will fit it saturady and report back. fingers crossed but I am open to any and all suggestions.

monseiur

I'm with DublinDilbert post 11. The timing belt was probably changed just before you bought it but chances are the water pump wasn't and now it's showing it's age. Those about to sell just do the basic minimum repairs - just enough to get the car over the line so to speak.

User1998

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123345171#Comment_123345171

Nobody changes their timing belt when they are about to sell. That’s probably the last thing you’d do.

Hellrazer

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123344425#Comment_123344425

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123344591#Comment_123344591

Dont just change the cap - the bottle will have hairline cracks underneath it - buy a genuine Opel cap and bottle - the febi ones are sh1t.

monseiur

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123345216#Comment_123345216

I'm not in the motor trade but, in my limited experience, lads selling privately tend to fit new timing belt if it's due or overdue at time of selling (with detailed receipt from garage of course) also if there's is less than two months of NCT left some run it thru the test. New timing belt, fresh NCT, car valet etc. always pays when selling especially if car is over the €8k bracket with above average miles

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123348545#Comment_123348545

There's a huge difference of replacing the timing belt or putting a car through the NCT.

User1998

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123348545#Comment_123348545

In my experience of buying cars, there’s a small cohort of people who will bring their car to a mechanics before selling it and end up spending hundreds in routine maintenance getting it ready for sale. Then theres people who just happened to do some maintenance a few months or a year prior to selling. But most people can’t even prove that they ever serviced the car. I usually buy 10+ year old cars so my experience might be skewed slightly

Hellrazer

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123349207#Comment_123349207

Very true - which is why whenever I buy a car first thing I do is service it even if Ive been told its "just been serviced" - Im kinda obsessed with it to the point that Ive even changed a timing belt on a car that was "supposedly" done a month ago - a bit overkill but its peace of mind for me.

In general Irish drivers arent the best at keeping up services and service records. What I noticed in being in main dealers is that the car is usually serviced while inside warranty at the dealers but as soon as the warranty expires they go elsewhere for maintenance. Ive no problem with that - I drop my car to Indys all the time for servicing but the records for these services / maintenance is sketchy at best.

TheChizler

Going through something similar with my '09 Vectra, noticed coolant bubbling and overflowing, diagnosed with a stuck thermostat which was replaced but blue liquid test showed engine gasses in the coolant. Mechanic threw a bottle of Steel Seal into it as it wasn't worth replacing the head gasket.

After a week or two of driving around the bubbling sort of stopped, then I replaced the coolant cap, then tank, and it stopped completely. I'm still losing coolant but after doing another engine gas test it seems the gasket is sealed for now, looks like the water pump is leaking so I've ordered a timing belt kit which I'm going to do myself (I've done it before).

Moral of the story is a stuck thermostat can cause all sorts of knock on effects.

soups05

As promised, reporting back. It's been a wierd old day but here goes.

Had to go to a shop for a bday present. No heavy traffic, not stop/start. Temp went to 90 and stayed there. 20 min there, 30 min inside,20 mins back. no issues. Got home to a replacement cap, fitted it and left car on drive.

2 hrs later, drove to the grandkids party, 20 min in the car started to overheat. had to park to cooldown on the way.

But here's the funny thing, gauge was reading 130. expansion bottle was hot but still able to touch it. coolant level ok, no leaks, bubbles as it was returning via the top tube in the tank. car was parked at party for 2 hrs.

drove home, same route. car did not overheat.

both ways i drove the same style, easy on the revs. steady speed. On the return trip the temp stayed at 90 most of the way. went to 100 then back to 90 three times as i got closer to home.

I left it running in the garden and temp returned to 90.

felt the hose where it comes from the plastic mount of the thermo valve and it was hot. 3 inches lower it was cold??? I thought that was the feed to the radiator so it should be hot.

Can anyone give me the exact location of the in and out feeds and which one should be hot and cold? This is making no sense to me.

CMOTDibbler

That seems to me as if the thermostat is closed and the heat for the first three inches is just heat transfer from the engine side. May be opening very slightly also.

The other possibility is a blockage in the cooling system. Maybe some oil got in there at some point? I'm saying that because of the heating vents blowing cold all the time. A blockage or airlock could be responsible for that.

If it were me, I'd drain the cooling system (you won't get it all), replace with water with a basic dishwasher tablet (not one of those fancy seven in one types and definitely without the dissolvable wrap on) dissolved in it. This is a non sudsy detergent which is extremely good at getting oil out of your cooling system. Run it for a few kms (10-20 watching the temp like a hawk) to get it fully up to temp and circulated and then drain it all again and replace with the correct coolant.

soups05

I just replaced the thermostat. I was thinking heat transfer on the pipe too. nice idea about the tablet, i have never heard of that trick before. Surely the pipe would be hot coming from the thermostat to the radiator though? I am wondering now if i somehow messed up when fitting it. Going to pull it tomorrow and check the lower hose while i am at it.

My wife and (grown up) kids want me to move to a newer car but i love the siggy (plus am brke :P)

CMOTDibbler

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123350852#Comment_123350852

Yeah, the dishwasher tablet works great. Had a car with a failed oil cooler that Audi was supposed to clean out for me and never did. Took a couple of goes with the tablet, but it flushed it out perfectly.

You might have the thermostat in upside down, it happens.

on_the_roots

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123350619#Comment_123350619

Have you checked the charging voltage from alternator? I believe an alternator's crazy output (I have seen 20V+ in a few cases) may mess up the thermostat's readings as it is a simple resistance. It may be intermittent though, so worth checking with a voltmeter connected while driving/iddling.

Hellrazer

Did you check the bottle? Its still number one on my list - take it off and check it for cracks. It might not look like you are loosing coolant but it drips down behind the battery / fuse box and cant see it until you actually take the bottle off. Dont rely on the bottle as the level can change.

If not it sounds like its air locked - and these are an absolute b**tard to bleed out. Ive seen the lads in the workshop take over an hour to bleed them out.

Best way to do it is to remove expansion bottle cap. Run the engine making sure heater in the car is set to max. While doing all this squeeze the 2 radiator feed pipes - that will force coolant through the system - every time the coolant drops below max even if its only a small bit- top it up. Should eventually stop needing to be topped up - Then take it for a 20 minute drive and check the coolant again.

Rinse and repeat until you dont need to top up.

Hellrazer

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123350619#Comment_123350619

Can anyone give me the exact location of the in and out feeds and which one should be hot and cold? This is making no sense to me.

Just follow them from the rad - you dont need to check any of the other ones.

If its bled correctly they should both be the same temperature - assuming the thermostat is working as it should.

soups05

Time got away from me yesterday but here a belated update.

traced all the pipework so I am sure exactly what I am looking at. Removed cap and squeezed the top and bootom hoses to Radiator. Did the ones going to heater core too. Run the enigine and contuined this for a few mins. Eventually the coolant expanded to the point where i had to replace the cap or lose it all through the opening.

Kept squeezing and managed to get the hoses to have heat going through them. The one from the Thermostatic valve is heating about half way while the other seems to heat the full way.

The upper one going to the heater core is hot almost to the core while the lower one is cold. If the core was blocked or air locked would this be enough to effect the rest of the system?

Took it for a drive and seemed ok at first, then temp shot up to 130, stayed there for 30 seconds, back to 110, back up etc

gotta go to work now but thinking of flushing the core this evening.

Thank you all for the help and advice,

soups05

Final update. The car remains the same. nothing I do changes the overheating, plus now there is an odd clicking/ticking from somewhere near the belt. I am guessing the water pump was the fault all along so bye bye siggy.

On another note I went looking for a new car. Found a beautiful suv type, ideal for my bad hip. lots of bells and whistles and looks fantastic. quick check on boards of course. no,just no, run away very fast. so no mazda cx 5 for me after reading those posts.

also a post from 2008 predicting suv types were just a fad that would die out pmsl.

Thank you again everyone for the advice and for simply taking time out of your day to help.

Esel

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123363870#Comment_123363870

The Mazda cx 5 was diesel then?

soups05

yes it diesel. I was chatting to a delivery driver in work today and he had one new 2017 till last year. He swears they are a great car, lovely to drive, never gave a mins trouble etc. his was diesel too. Guess everyone has a different view but I am bound to get one that goes boom lol.