By-pass causing congestion in village.

political analyst

The road that lets drivers going from Dublin city by pass Navan and Kells ends at the village of Virginia in Co Cavan. That leads to congestion in Virginia itself.

How can planners not have envisaged the likelihood that a by-pass would cause congestion in a village/town where the by-pass would end?

Why was the by pass stopped at Virginia?

Why could it not have built as far as the other side outside the village?

Charles Babbage

You can't build everything at once. The Virginia bypass is being designed at present, likely Eamon Ryan slowed it down.

joebloggs32

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/2058404340/by-pass-causing-congestion-in-village

Then the next town will get the congestion. This is always what happens when there is a bypass.

political analyst

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123304881#Comment_123304881

But why was the bypass from Dublin not designed to go past Virginia when it was planned? It would only have been a few extra miles.

political analyst

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123304898#Comment_123304898

The congestion would have been less serious if the bypass had been designed to end a few miles outside Virginia on either side of the village.

suvigirl

There has been a bypass for Virginia planned for years, it's currently under construction. The planners did see it and planned for it.

suvigirl

Its called the N3 BTW.

dxhound2005

The Ardee bypass has been held up for decades by objections. That could be a factor in Virginia as well?

https://www.dundalkleader.com/2025/01/15/bogged-down-ardee-bypass-project-faces-further-delays-as-environmental-group-lodge-appeal-in-supreme-court/

political analyst

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123304975#Comment_123304975

As I've already said, the planners could have designed the Navan & Kells bypass to also go past Virginia, couldn't they have? So why didn't they?

political analyst

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123304980#Comment_123304980

In terms of the environment, the countryside outside Virginia is hardly any different from what existed outside Navan and Kells before the original bypass was constructed.

dxhound2005

It has a thread running for a few years in the Infracstructure forum, so it is probably not a simple matter.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/2057826803/n3-virginia-bypass-route-options-published

alias no.9

All projects have to be finite in their scope, a Virginia bypass could have been added but why stop there, why not motorway to the border, or even all the way to Ballyshannon.

I'm not sure how far back planning for the M3 goes but it was held up by protest and legal battles. It's likely that it started planning as a Meath Co Co project so the scope incorporated the N3 route through Co Meath.

political analyst

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123305085#Comment_123305085

The congestion would not have been as bad if the original bypass had ended after drivers coming from Dublin had passed Virginia. Then, Virginia wouldn't have had as serious a traffic jam as it currently does. Did the Meath & Cavan local authorities not co-ordinate the original bypass with their Dublin counterparts?

alias no.9

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123305110#Comment_123305110

I'm merely making an observation that the M3/N3 section in question is entirely within Co Meath and the scope of the project probably derived from being within a single local authority area, I'm not trying to justify it.

User567363

Your saying that if we bypass Virginia there would be less traffic in Virginia, sounds like a plan, i have a shovel, will we start on monday around 11am?

political analyst

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123305151#Comment_123305151

I didn't claim, explicitly or implicitly, that you were trying to justify it. I just think that it was idiotic of the planners not to envisage the likelihood of a traffic jam being caused by the Navan & Kells bypass ending immediately before the main street in Virginia.

alias no.9

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123305161#Comment_123305161

It ends at the county bounds between Meath and Cavan. When it started, the expectation would have been for the Virginia bypass to follow soon afterwards but things went tits up for the country before it was finished.

gipi

The M3 was built as a public private partnership (hence the tolls). I reckon the private investors had no interest in extending the road via Virginia (unless they could put a third toll on the M3), so it's up to Cavan Co Co to find the funding and sort out a route

Hurrache

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123304881#Comment_123304881

Jesus Christ, he's long gone but still living in your head.

Seth Brundle

So all of this is really asking why a new road has caused congestion upstream when it is common knowledge that any new road improvement will always cause an increase in traffic on that road? It is called "induced demand"!

suvigirl

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123304991#Comment_123304991

But sure they did. It's been planned for years.

Charles Babbage

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123305247#Comment_123305247

It is perfectly reasonable to mention one of the reasons that the Virginia bypass is so delayed in a thread discussing the lack of a Virginia bypass.

Peregrinus

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123305161#Comment_123305161

And I think it's idiotic of you to imagikne that the planners didn't envisage this. There alway tends to be congestion at the point where a by-pass or similar upgrade ends. What makes you think the planners didn't know this?

If the by-pass had been extended beyond Virginia, then the congestion would have been experience in the next village. Would you then idiotically assume that the planners hadn't envisaged that?

The ultimate solution to this is to upgrade the entire length of the road until the point where there are no destinations beyond it that anyone wants to travel to. That may well be the long-term plan. But these things are always done in stages, for reasons which are too obvious to require explanation.

CardF

Virginia, Co Cavan.

How bad can the congestion be? Like 10 cars.

peckypiper

Usual tail backs over 3km in evenings more like 4km on a Friday evening

suvigirl

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123305411#Comment_123305411

You could be 40 minutes getting through the town

Dr Turk Turkelton

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123305409#Comment_123305409

If Virginia had been bypassed there isn't another town or village until Cavan town which is about 40km from Virginia and already bypassed.

Would have been a place where a bypass would have been ideal.

magicbastarder

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123304902#Comment_123304902

You mean if the bypass had stopped short of Virginia, the traffic would be lighter? How so - there's still just as much traffic to handle in the town?

elperello

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123305363#Comment_123305363

Fair enough, but in apportioning political responsibility for delays it's worth noting that the bypass has been planned since 1968.

https://www.meathchronicle.ie/2021/08/28/mixed-feelings-as-n3-bypass-route-selected/

Charles Babbage

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123305864#Comment_123305864

In earlier years few places were bypassed, but by 2020 most places were. The previous government made little progress on the N2 and N3 although these routes were still totally unimproved in place and had villages along the route. Yet you could not that people should use public transport since these places had no railways and any bus ran along the same slow routes.

poppers

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/2058404340/by-pass-causing-congestion-in-village

Plain and simple local objections to the Virginia bypass have stalled it happening there have been plans to bypass it for over 30 yrs but every route put foward has met with some lobby group objecting and the poject going bak to square 1 again.

its the only town not done on the N3 between dublin and the donegal town in the republic.

See below for local buisness man in the anglo celt from 2012 advoacting for no bypass.

that hotel is now closed.

https://www.anglocelt.ie/2012/04/11/does-a-bypass-necessarily-help-a-town/