How much will I save when I go EV?

forumdedum

I spend €3650 per year on diesel. Forgive me if this has been asked before but how much would I save by going fully Electric please? Thank you

Gumbo

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/2058399473/how-much-will-i-save-when-i-go-ev

Budget for new car.
Motor tax for existing car.
Annual mileage.
Can you install a home charge point.
Approx. Annual maintenance costs currently.

Buddy Bubs

Taking cost to change out of equation, I am finding charging my EV costs about 30% of the diesel or petrol i used to buy. Daytime electricity rates of about 20c per kwh. You can charge cheaper than this.

So somewhere in the region of 2000-2500 in fuel savings would be my estimate, but it is only an estimate depends on how or where you charge. Possibly more in these overnight charging windows with a very cheap tariff if that suited.

Motor tax is cheaper than anything else at 120 per year

Maintenance costs is an unknown but I'd back an EV over an ICE in most cases to be cheaper to maintain but it's no guarantee.

CMOTDibbler

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123237532#Comment_123237532

New EVs are dropping in price, lots available now in the thirties rather than forties. If you take your 25k a year at about €2.50/100km, your annual cost would be about €625. That's very conservative.

oinkely

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/2058399473/how-much-will-i-save-when-i-go-ev

many years ago when we first changed to an EV i did a calculation based on vs a 1.4 petrol that we had at the time. As i recall it was in the order of a 75% saving overall, including servicing tax and fuel.

A while after that i compared the cost of buying and running a cheap ev vs commuting in my diesel van to the office - and i concluded that it was cheaper to buy a €5k ev and insure and tax it than it was to drive the diesel to work in traffic. i recall that the running costs of a cheap ev vs the 2.0 diesel renault trafic were in the order of a 90% saving. This was fuel and servicing savings, i discounted tax and insurance savings as i was keeping the diesel anyway as it has it's uses.

So we have two evs, and a diesel van that rarely moves.

Badger242

I do about 23,000k km per year with a lot of motorway driving on my commute. When switching to EV I worked out costs versus my diesel corolla that was doing 5.6l/100km at the time.

Based of an EV efficiency of 20kWh/100km at a night charging rate of 12.41c per kWh - 100km journey costs about €2.50.

Based on my 5.6l/100km corolla and current diesel cost of €1.80 - 100km journey cost is about €10.

So fuel savings for me are every

-100km = €7.50

-10,000km = €750

-23,000km = €1,725

Fuel savings will vary depending on factors such as your electricity cost, EV efficiency and current diesel efficiency.

CivilEx

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/2058399473/how-much-will-i-save-when-i-go-ev

The year (2023) before I went electric I spent approx. €2,500 each year on diesel (BMW 520D) and another €2,200 on maintenance (total of €4,700 for 26,000 km p.a.). My energy and maintenance costs in an EV (Ioniq 6) last year were approx. €1,500 (I did 30,000 km), so the savings in going fully electric are about €3,200 per year for me.

forumdedum

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123237511#Comment_123237511

Thank you. Yes, new EVs are pricey. Current Tax €270 per year. I drive 25,000kms per year. Yes I can install a home charge point. Current car needs repairs worth 1/3 of it's trade in value and because mileage is so high I'm not sure it's worth it.

forumdedum

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123237552#Comment_123237552

Great info, thank you

BrianD3

Your existing car is doing 8 litres per 100 km or 35 mpg, not great for a diesel in CO2 band B1. Are you doing mostly motorway or a lot of heavy traffic, does the car have stop+start.

With home charging you'll save a considerable amount of that 3650. How much will be influenced by the type of driving you do and what sort of EV you go for. E.g. if you drive motorway you'll save more with a Hyundai Ioniq 6 than with a Hyundai Ioniq 5. Whereas in heavy traffic, there won't be much difference.

forumdedum

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123237689#Comment_123237689

I drive motorway 3 days a week minimum for 30 miles. There are heavy traffic moments too and yes it has stop+start.

CMOTDibbler

This thread is pretty weirdly borked. The first seven posts are all marked #1 and on the main page, the last of those is listed as the latest, despite there being 4 more posts after that one.

Edit: This post has fixed that, but when you go into the thread it takes you to the first one rather than the latest.

forumdedum

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123238070#Comment_123238070

I'll have to google the word borked as I've never seen it before

Bhail

How Do count the cost of the new car in this? Reminds me of the tax change of 00s when lads would have a car paid off, spend €20k on new diesel to save on tax. If your car is paid off, and you are about saving money, is sticking with what you have the better option for most people

CMOTDibbler

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123238120#Comment_123238120

Not in this case where the op is facing large repair costs for his current car.

turnfan

I drive similar mileage and took a conservative calculation of €2000 per year fuel savings in my 2019 Ioniq 28kwh.

Are you looking for the savings to fund the buy outright? that's my 15 year plan for my yoke , I roll any additional savings into other projects that also save money (solar, smart heating controls etc etc)

monseiur

You must be driving a 3.0L diesel if you're just getting an average of 35mpg. All my cars were & are diesel for longer than I care to remember and only a Toyota Landcruiser jeep I had fell below your average mileage - 45 to 55 mpg is what you should expect on long motorway journeys if you cruise at under 70 miles per hour.

Regarding saving money if you go electric - rest assured that will not happen. The only way you could possibly save money is if someone gifted you an electric car and took away your current ICE car without any money changing hands.

Say the value of you current car is €9,000 and repairs would cost €2,000 to make it roadworthy and pass NCT etc. Diesel costs + repairs = €5,6550

Buy an electric car for say €40,000 - the minute you drive out of the garage forecourt the value of your car will drop at least 10% - that €4,000 of you finest euros. That saving alone would pay for your diesel for 14 months! and that depreciation will continue - the percentage annual drop will depend on the market, the economy etc.

If you have to borrow to purchase new there's the added costs of interest rates etc. on the other hand if you have €40k in savings and invest it wisely it could earn you an nice nest egg while your current car does the business and owes you nothing by now except fuel & service. Bear in mind that your all new shiny tin box with an electric motor will require service & repairs too.

The moral of the story is that it's the original capital outlay that's expensive in the long run and not just the fuel & service. If you decide to get rid of you current vehicle my advise is to buy a good used model with lowish mileage, let some other fool, who has more money than sense, take the hit on the new one and believe it's a big financial hit.

But at the end of the day and in the final analysis it's your hard eared money and how you spend it is entirely your business.

Baseball72

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123238201#Comment_123238201

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123238201#Comment_123238201

I’m thinking the same question myself, except, asking my company for an ev company car (I’m currently supplying my own 1.4 petrol Honda Civic). Company mileage 5k approx p.a.

User1998

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123237532#Comment_123237532

All new cars are expensive now. EV’s aren’t particularly expensive anymore.

fits

I’d say OP could save 3000 euro in fuel if they installed a home charger and got into a night rate. We do 30000 km a year in the EV and save about that on fuel. Previous EV car depreciated 6000 a year but hopefully things will improve in that regard.

CMOTDibbler

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123238201#Comment_123238201

Regarding saving money if you go electric - rest assured that will not happen. The only way you could possibly save money is if someone gifted you an electric car and took away your current ICE car without any money changing hands.

This and similar arguments get trotted out every time somebody posts about changing their car. And although on the face of it, it seems to make sense, in actual fact it doesn't.

Firstly the OP has a big repair bill coming on his existing car. If he keeps it, that has to be paid and there's no guarantee there won't be further big bills down the road. There comes a time when it's not economic to continue and the OP has decided that this is the time.

Secondly, we all know that cars are depreciating assets. It could be argued that they're not assets at all and actually liabilities with constant expenditure and depreciation. At some point a new (either new to the OP or brand new) has to be purchased to replace the existing one. That's just a fact of vehicle ownership and there's no escaping it. How often that happens is down to the individual owner and their particular circumstances.

There are things the owner can do to mitigate some of the costs. Buying second hand is one way; a one year old low mileage or ex-demo is one way of doing this. But once the decision is made to change (for whatever reason), trying to mitigate costs is valid and possible. EVs will reduce running costs (all else being equal), so it's a valid question to ask how much of a saving in those costs can be made.

It's been pointed out on this thread that the OP could make an annual saving of ~€3,000 pa on diesel v electric, there's also road tax savings and likely service and maintenance costs (many EVs come with free servicing for the first 3 years). So at the very least, the OP could see a saving of ~€10k over three years vs his current car.

blackbox

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123238861#Comment_123238861

Is there still zero BIK on a company electric car?

tom1ie

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/2058399473/how-much-will-i-save-when-i-go-ev

Do you own the diesel or do you have a loan/PCP finance for the diesel or is it debt free?
Will you be getting a loan/PCP finance for the EV?

fits

The cost of ownership for my owned outright diesel that does 10000 km annually is roughly:

Fuel 1250

Tax 750

Repairs and servicing 1000 on average

so roughly 3000 euro. Plus hassle of trips to garage and NCT centre and fuel stations.

Cost of EV that does 30000 km

Electricity 700

Interest 0

Depreciation: unknown but say 6000

Tax 120

Repairs and servicing 0

Hassle 0

and it’s a brand new car versus a 15 year old one with up to date safety systems etc.

Buddy Bubs

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123239937#Comment_123239937

First 45k is BIK free this year (35k for EV plus 10k temporary exemption to all cars)

First 20k next year unless the government policies change in the meantime

At least they are in the lowest band possible

Buddy Bubs

deleted…wrong thread

monseiur

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123239913#Comment_123239913

Had the OP posed the following question ''I am about to buy an new car and have a budget of €40,000 should I buy ICE or electric?'' - then it could be argued that you have made some valid points. But his/her major concern was the annual fuel cost of current diesel vehicle and pending repair bills. Of course all cars that have clocked up high mileage will incur some high repair costs - the fact that the OP's car will cost a third of it's value to repair is not, on it's own, a reason to bin it. Spending say €2k on a car worth €6k should prolong it's life for an extra 3 to 6 years with just the normal service & minor repair costs in between. Diesel engine cars, provided serviced regularly, can clock up 250,000 to 350,000 miles without major issue - based on the OP's annual mileage, his/her car should be motoring away for 15 to 18 years. In the meantime had the OP purchased a new vehicle be it ice or electric it would have depreciated considerably in that period.

As an aside the average lifespan of the battery in an electric car is from 9 to 12 years and the cost of fitting a new battery would be 4 to 6 times the value of the car depending on model etc. But after the first 3 years the range of the battery decreases incrementally as the range anxiety of the owner increases !

CMOTDibbler

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123241503#Comment_123241503

Had the OP posed the following question ''I am about to buy an new car and have a budget of €40,000 should I buy ICE or electric?'' - then it could be argued that you have made some valid points

The OP specifically asked what fuel saving he would make. You're the person who dragged the cost of the car into the equation:

Regarding saving money if you go electric - rest assured that will not happen. The only way you could possibly save money is if someone gifted you an electric car and took away your current ICE car without any money changing hands.

And you've made a lot of assumptions. All unsupported. Like:

Spending say €2k on a car worth €6k should prolong it's life for an extra 3 to 6 years with just the normal service & minor repair costs in between

No guarantee that there wouldn't be equally expensive repairs needed in that timespan. €2k is nothing in costs these days. And:

As an aside the average lifespan of the battery in an electric car is from 9 to 12 years

Unsupported. There are already 12 to 14 year old Nissan Leafs (with the worst battery chemistry and management) still going today. No real average can be arrived at when the majority of EVs are aged less than 10 years old, but studies of battery degradation are showing that losses are averaging 3% per annum. And:

the cost of fitting a new battery would be 4 to 6 times the value of the car depending on model etc.

Firstly entire battery failures are very rare, usually some modules fail and can be replaced at much lower costs than the entire battery. Also battery costs are dropping significantly with the price expected to go below $100/kWh this year. Lifespan of batteries is expected to exceed the lifespan of the car.

I also didn't recommend he buy a new car. I specifically recommended a low mileage 1 year old or ex-demo.

Jrbeire

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123241503#Comment_123241503

The real-world battery lives of EVs are proving remarkably resilient. I wouldn't worry about that at all (and indeed I don't having now switched to fully EV with 2 cars - and having researched it in detail). As one example, Richard Symons recently plotted UK real-world data to show this on his YouTube channel - nothing under c. 90% including cars with >200k miles

MojoMaker

30yr+ lifespans predicted these days.

Monseiur (sic) is FUD spreading, who knows why 🤷‍♂️

joe1303l

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123238045#Comment_123238045

That’s a substantial saving but if you hadn’t traded down and bought the equivalent BMW i5, it would be a different story.