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Boxster or S2000…?

  • 11-09-2024 10:43am
    #1
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,244 ✭✭✭


    Rather than boring old pensions, I’m trying to look at other ways to at least track inflation with something you can enjoy and look at on the driveway… (I’ve convinced myself of this anyway)!

    If you could buy either, which and why? Not against 986 or 987. S2000 I’d rather an AP2 (mid-ish 00s version).

    Someone said to me you’ll never have to explain what a Boxster is to someone, the S2000 you will. I’ve lusted after both for a long time and in some ways, the Honda actually excites me more but a Porsche will always be a Porsche.

    Ideally I’d buy in NI to avoid all the additional charges but that can be difficult particularly in the case of the Honda due to a limited market.

    Two examples of the cars…




Comments

  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,291 ✭✭✭kdevitt


    You'll get into a tidy 987 Boxster for less money than the S2k these days. I'm still a bit of a Honda fan-boy at heart, but the Porsche is where I'd be putting my cash. My Cayman was sublime - Boxster won't be much different. The Honda is also renowned for putting people into hedgerows, backwards - its part of the appeal I suspect!



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,334 ✭✭✭w124man


    Honda all day long! Cheaper Porsches are overrated and common as muck and a good standard S2000 is a rare beast. If you have to explain what an S2000 is then you're talking to the wrong people!!



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,244 ✭✭✭MarkN


    Yeah the Honda really has gone to dizzy heights. The time to buy was probably a few years ago from a price perspective. The Boxster does not seem to have gone that way - yet!



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 586 ✭✭✭Justjens


    BMW Z4 3.0L coupe, or roadster? Not many around, bomb proof engine, all the fun you need 😉



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,291 ✭✭✭kdevitt


    Yeah they're probably slightly overpriced for what they are - I was considering one a while back but I think I'll go NSX now, or something cheaper - like a Ferrari 360 :D .

    On the flip side, the Boxster is probably still slightly underpriced - prices are definitely stiffening up now though. You still get people suggesting they're not a real Porsche, or they're overrated - but frankly thats completely and utter BS - normally spouted by someone who saw Clarkson slag them once. I would take a Boxster or Cayman over the equivalent periods 911 all day long - might not beat them in a straight line, but they're a far better handling car imo. Was talking to one of the instructors at Mondello a while back and he said similar - they're so well set up out of the box.



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,244 ✭✭✭MarkN


    Ah anyone who slags off cars like the Boxster is just a moron. Same with the MX-5. I've had one or two mates make hairdresser comments… the way that thing turns into a corner or even takes a full on corner, there's nothing like it for the money!

    Z4 - maybe a few years ago. I sort of get my fill of nice BMWs through work now. An S2000 or a Boxster are both a thing of the past for me which adds to the appeal.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,334 ✭✭✭w124man


    So people are morons for expressing their opinion? That makes you a moron then!



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 692 ✭✭✭Whatwicklow


    Dont role out a Japanese inport, both the porker and s2000 will have plenty of choice available over there.

    Any of the sourcing companies will locate your reffered colour milage condition and spec and find the car you want.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,244 ✭✭✭MarkN




  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,291 ✭✭✭kdevitt


    Get some insurance quotes before hand too - last I worked with had 2 S2000s, both off the road for a good while because he couldn't insure them. Think he finally got sorted with a classic policy - but also bear in mind that some classic policies don't cover JDM cars.



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  • Registered Users Posts: 1,302 ✭✭✭daithi7


    This is such a lovely choice - well done OP!! As life is about choices, we should all make more choices like this one imho. :)

    I've also lusted after both of these cars for a long time tbh. I test drove both back in the day, when they were current models, but ended up buying a Mercedes SLK instead back then, which I simply adored tbh.

    So S2000 or Boxter, I see what you're saying about the Porsche being a 'Porsche', but it's S2000 the for me by a whisker....

    What a car,what a gem, what a choice!!!

    Enjoy!!!

    P.s. the S2000 is/was also more reliable I suspect (check the reviews) which becomes even more crucial with a classic.

    P.p.s. Let us know which you go for & your experience with it. (I would like to live vicariously on this one)

    Post edited by daithi7 on


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,244 ✭✭✭MarkN


    Altered my Aviva policy online with a Boxster and it was fine, didn't try the S2000. Also, I'm now old at 42… :)



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,291 ✭✭✭kdevitt


    Likewise, I had no issues insuring the Cayman S - was with allianz fully comp for €500 or so - I don't see any issues insuring a Boxster as you said. Point was more about importing an S2K - some companies just won't touch them. I was adding my CRX to my classic policy in and around renewal time, and some companies refused to insure it if it was an import (it is!) - a UK one was fine.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,244 ✭✭✭MarkN


    If anyone wants a nice MX-5 anyway…. Cough!



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 65,799 ✭✭✭✭unkel
    Chauffe, Marcel, chauffe!


    @MarkN - in your video you seem to say that you like the car to be a bit under the radar. If you want to have fun driving an S2000, you would need to be high up in the rev range. This would make the car very loud, attracting attention. I've never driven one, but they seem overpriced for what they are. Not sure if they are a wise investment. Not sure either if they would add much to the driving experience you have had with the MX-5

    I owned a 986 for 5 years, the base 2.5l and it wasn't particularly fast (0-60 in a bit over 6s iirc, which is probably similar to S2000) but it drove superbly. I was lucky to have bought at the very bottom of the market in 2016, but they haven't gone up that much really, you can still get a decent one for 4 figures. When I was looking for a car at the time (after selling my totally boring to drive Audi TT), it was a toss up between a Z4 and a Boxster, which won the contest on pretty much all counts. Always hanging over your head is the IMS issue on the M96 engine (of all Porsches of the late 90s and 00s really). It didn't bother me too much at the time, but I got the car cheap.

    Or keep most of your money in your pocket and buy an MG-F? A few around on DD in the €2k range. Don't worry about a thing and drive it like you stole it. A bit slow like your MX-5 but these are great wee drivers with the mid rear engine setup and RWD if you push the rev happy K-series 😁

    Or for something completely different? Lotus Elan turbo from the early 90s. These use an engine and turbo from Isuzu which are very reliable. The €56 vintage motor tax is a nice benefit too and the car has aged quite well imho. Here's a pic of mine taken last month at Newcastle Aerodrome classic car show

    Post edited by unkel on


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,244 ✭✭✭MarkN


    Interesting to hear your thoughts with your car history, Unkel.

    That Lotus is gorgeous! I think it’s hard to beat the all roundness of the Porsche to be honest. Low down torque, gorgeous noise, timeless looks, probably a bit of an investment too. There’s some really mint S2000s in the UK but rust is also a concern with them.


    I had the chance to buy this a few weeks ago. I was too slow and was overthinking it. Rang to put a deposit on it and it was gone 30 mins earlier.




  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 65,799 ✭✭✭✭unkel
    Chauffe, Marcel, chauffe!


    Are Porsches on the VRT calculator now? Back when I bought mine, they weren't. So I would be very careful on a car like that or be prepared to bring the lube when you go to register it.

    I also wouldn't have a lot of appetite any more for paying €1808 motor tax for a weekend car. I paid full whack year's tax up front on the Boxster once, just a 2.5l but still €1080. When the year was over, I reckon I took it out maybe 6-7 times 🙄 Getting a dog soon after who gets nervous in a loud combustion engine car didn't help, but you get my point - things in life rarely work out as you plan them

    And maybe I read you wrong but you seem to be interested in the investment part of the car? If that's the case and you could afford that 987, you could also afford a half decent 996. The Boxster will be marginally better / more fun to drive, but it will go down in value. The 911 will go up.

    I agree with you about the all roundness of the Porsches, be they any Boxster, Cayman or watercooled 911. All superb cars and better than anything else really



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,244 ✭✭✭MarkN


    Investment is a bonus I suppose but I certainly don’t want to lose a chunk hence only a handful of models are on my radar. I much prefer the 997 to 996, there’s a few in the high 20s sterling but as you say, it’s an unknown with VRT. Neither are on calculator or S2000, they know what they’re at. I figured the Boxster would be a less painful experience if something goes wrong compared to 911 and also the fact that they are that little bit better to drive but a 911 is always going to be just that. Fully agree on the road tax, if a 993 was going, that’s around an extra €18,000 in the budget versus road tax at the full rate for 10 years…!

    There’s always the S&P 500 I guess but I can’t drive / admire that :)



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 65,799 ✭✭✭✭unkel
    Chauffe, Marcel, chauffe!


    Boxster and 911 have the same engine. If something goes wrong it will likely cost the same. Also you do not want to play the VRT lottery. Say you buy that late 20s sterling 997. Revenue says value here is €55k, so that'll be €20k VRT please thank you very much. You can fight it after you pay, but do you really want to go down that route?

    I would concentrate on Irish reg cars. Or wildcard - an aircooled '94 or older (so just €200 fixed VRT) via the new NI route (skipping VAT / duty) if your budget is high enough to consider the above car.

    But that is investing quite a lot of money altogether. Personally I would play it safer with a 4 figure 986 already on Irish plates. There is simply nothing much to lose there. Agree with @kdevitt that these are still probably undervalued. Have your cake and eat it. My own 986 over 5 years cost me less than nothing total cost of ownership, including a good bit of maintenance and all tax, insurance and fuel…



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,244 ✭✭✭MarkN


    Problem is just the selection here is so low. I should probably look at a few Porsche club forums etc to see. 993 would be the dream but as you say, big money now. Did spot a gorgeous 986, again in the UK but was 13k.



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 65,799 ✭✭✭✭unkel
    Chauffe, Marcel, chauffe!


    It's not too bad, you need to be patient and give it a few months to see what comes up. Look on DD every day. Good ones for reasonable money sell very quickly! This was different when I bought in 2016, even the good ones were for sale for quite some time back then. Despite the market for buying and selling being a lot healthier back then than the tough market we are in now. Another sign that the 986 Boxsters are undervalued



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,291 ✭✭✭kdevitt


    The 2.7 Boxster is its own thing really though - as in not prone to bore score, and less likely to have IMS bearing issues - and its probably the sensible choice. Lower tax, close enough on power to the S, but a good step up from the 2.5 (222BHP for the last 2.7 986's v 258BHP in the 986 S and 205BHP in the 2.5, and 242BHP v 295 in the 987).

    Think over 90% of VRT appeals are successful by the way.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 65,799 ✭✭✭✭unkel
    Chauffe, Marcel, chauffe!


    Yeah I did a good bit of research at the time and the smaller the M96, the less chance of IMS bearing failure. With my 2.5l at about 2-3%, to put things into perspective. It's not like of all these engines are failing at all. Also average mileage is good. Low and high mileage are bad. And it helps if the car has been tracked.

    The figure of 90% successful VRT appeals is meaningless unless we know original demand vs settled value. It's hardly any better if your €20k bill is dropped to €18k, is it? A car bought on Irish plates would turn out to be much cheaper.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,244 ✭✭✭MarkN


    I did hear of someone who appealed and won and then received a tax audit.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 65,799 ✭✭✭✭unkel
    Chauffe, Marcel, chauffe!


    I appealed VRT and won (got every cent back) on my first Tesla Model S, but never got a tax audit thankfully 😀



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,244 ✭✭✭MarkN


    don’t know why they just can’t have these cars on the VRT site, they were present for years.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 194 ✭✭flyer_query


    s2000 and rust, advise googling it



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,291 ✭✭✭kdevitt


    Haha - so do I - was a big ticket item Porsche afaik.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 65,799 ✭✭✭✭unkel
    Chauffe, Marcel, chauffe!


    Were they? I regularly had a look at the VRT calculator for many years until I bought my 986 in 2016 and no Porsche had ever been on it until then.



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,244 ✭✭✭MarkN


    Yeah, M3s, S2000s etc … then they all disappeared so they can pluck numbers out of the sky!



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,244 ✭✭✭MarkN


    A 2.7 987 popped up over the last few days, looked ok in the pictures. Went to view today and absolute dirt in reality and looking for strong money. Corroded alloys, faded headlights, filthy interior with wear and tear marks all over it. Damn Brexit.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 65,799 ✭✭✭✭unkel
    Chauffe, Marcel, chauffe!


    Sorry you wasted your time. You'll be paying big tax on a 987 for a long time. Would you not aim for a 986 instead? The early ones will go vintage tax in just 2 years time, this will very likely raise their value too.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,244 ✭✭✭MarkN


    Not against a nice 986 at all. In fact I kind of like that they’re the first Boxster ever.



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