(Site is a graveyard - How can boards save itself?) Any update?

Leg End Reject

Posting to get the next page to load.

EmmetSpiceland

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122484187#Comment_122484187

You know, 20 users could report this post and, guess what? Nothing would happen as it doesn’t break any “site rules”.

Mods don’t get browbeaten into “sanctioning” posts. A post is reported and the mod/admin looks at it. If they see it has broken any rules they act, if not, they don’t. No amount reports changes that.

The users of the site have been asked, by the mods/admins, that, instead of engaging with posts in breach of the “site rules”, they report them. This is due to the volume of posts, and scope of the site, where the mods, and admins, can’t, realistically cover themselves.

Once again, for the most part, it’s not what you say, it’s how you say it. When users, continually lose their temper, attack posters, ignore mod instruction and break “site rules” it’s not the mods having a, simple risible, bias it’s the fault of the user themselves.

When you post within the rules you’ll have very little “interaction” with the mods and will, generally, be happier for it. Continually moaning about a, fictitious, bias and claiming persecution by “The Left” is just getting tiring, at this stage.

Leg End Reject

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122484221#Comment_122484221

I'd say @uptherebels is a perfect example, they're still demanding I prove a statement after I've quoted them and posted it.

Sudden Valley

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122484187#Comment_122484187

Have you reported the posters that you feel are goading/ trolling? The numbers supporting their position doesn't save a poster from being threadbanned. Modding is not a popularity contest.

There is alot of accusations being thrown around this thread but without any examples , which I would say itself is hard to gather as banned posters tend to have their posts deleted, it is hard to judge if complainants have a genuine grievance or just dislike mods for banning them.

odyssey06

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122484244#Comment_122484244

And unless you are following a thread very closely and are ahead of moderator action … you're not necessarily going to know why someone was thread banned because an egregious post likely would be deleted.

Flinty997

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122484221#Comment_122484221

I think it's bad netiquette to just mic drop buzzwords into thread without explanation or context. Never mind complaining if asked about it.

Flinty997

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122484237#Comment_122484237

Yeah I don't see how you could be sanctioned for not breaking the rules.

Though I'll say how the rules are applied can be oddly subjective and or selective at times.

Flinty997

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122484354#Comment_122484354

Or they've been thread banned because they had two warnings on the same thread months apart.

...asking for a friend....

uptherebels

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122482793#Comment_122482793

so you were able to find something when you needed. amazing isn't it.

Now you have linked to what was said. You need to explain the gymnastics you used to arrive at

" It's the continuous reporting of posts that disagree with others to control the narrative by getting the poster with the minority opinion threadbanned or site banned. We all know that most mod actions now are responding to reported posts"

taking into consideration post no. 150 and no207. in the thread that you linked to.

Im sure you read them originally for context. and you also replied to at least one.

uptherebels

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122484238#Comment_122484238

ive already addressed your post. Not the proof you think it is.

uptherebels

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122484216#Comment_122484216

i can only address your posts one at a time🙄

uptherebels

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122483235#Comment_122483235

you reassurances would be worthless anyway, so that you cant is immaterial.

MisterAnarchy

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122484244#Comment_122484244

If you want examples here are a few recent ones.

Tell me which ones you consider appropriate or uncivil.

"You are a sad troll"

"You just sound bitter and extremely weird"

"You're making an absolute fucking show of yourself."

"It would take more than simple minded trolls for my blood pressure to rise or for me to take the day off."

You're not "too much" by any metric. You're just pathetic and sad.

"We have forced this simple minded persons hand"

"Since some users are still politically concussed into last month I’ll just repeat the question I asked last month"

"You’d almost be better sticking to the shyte you were previously spewing then dig this new hole."

"Can you keep your dishonest narrative straight for more than an hour please"

"I don’t know what you’ve been smoking but he absolutely can

"This is all they have folks, petty insults and insinuations. A terrified bunch, love it."

"It really was not back seat modding. I just wondered why people were still engaging with the individual, when his/her agenda was clear. "

"Let's face it, anyone who still supports Trump is just in it for the racism and fascism. Anyone who says different is a moron and a liar.

"I'm guessing JAQ-off "both-sides", "neutral", "genuine" posters will become rarer as they are being sent to the frontlines in Ukraine and even more so after the elections."

"Everyone is well aware of how you pretend to be a "centrist"..

"I hope she gave you some extra lunch money for school too"

Flinty997

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122484476#Comment_122484476

I have to say while I don't agree with Leg Ends argument. I personally, don't need this level of forensic detail to understand his argument....or invalidate it.

Leg End Reject

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122482157#Comment_122482157

My last post to you - you claimed to be shocked I couldn't back up my claim. Now you won't accept that proof was given.

Maybe try your luck with others who have said the same thing because I won't be wasting any more time engaging with your whataboutery. If you're going to claim some kind of "gotcha" I hope it gives you a nice buzz.

uptherebels

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122484511#Comment_122484511

that's a very low bar for what you consider "forensic".

Arguments should be based on facts, dont you agree?

con747

Maybe some here should take it to PM before they get the thread shut down.

uptherebels

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122484537#Comment_122484537

you dont know what whataboutery is.

no "proof" was given just assertions by you, and now disappearing when you are asked to stand over them.

If you want to claim bias, and silencing of minority opinions then you need to show it.

MisterAnarchy

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122484542#Comment_122484542

That is arguably the goal of some.

Big Bag of Chips

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/2058363635/posting-in-feedback-forum

This thread is for feedback on Boards.ie. Any one who'd like to spat with other posters are welcome to take it elsewhere.

Warnings and forum bans for off topic posts, personal abuse etc will be applied in this thread just like any other.

Please note the thread linked above.

Ezeoul

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122484244#Comment_122484244

A thread ban does not mean posts are deleted.

con747

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122484553#Comment_122484553

Can you clarify if Moderators are able to ban new accounts for 6 months as an ex Mod told me a couple of months ago? I have asked a few times now with no response.

Flinty997

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122484540#Comment_122484540

Only if required. In this instance IMO they are not. Certainly doesn't require post after post about it, or debate. IMO.

Big Bag of Chips

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122484563#Comment_122484563

On the old system moderators had the option of "9 pointing" an obvious spam poster which meant they could be sitebanned until an Admin got to deal with it properly.

The same function is available now. But Moderators are encouraged to use it sparingly. Reserved mostly for obvious spam - crypto, Asian language, pharmaceutical etc.

New accounts won't necessarily be banned unless they are exceptionally problematic, spamming, abusive etc. They will usually be reported for an Admin to investigate.

Spear

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122484563#Comment_122484563

Are you referring to sitebans or forum bans? For forum bans, there's options for time limited bans including 6 months and permanent, but that applies equally whether an account is new or not.

con747

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122484608#Comment_122484608

Thanks, would that be useful for Moderators who are reporting spam in the spamming thread to be able to just nuke spam posts on threads instead of reporting them and then posting the details in the spammers thread to be dealt with by someone else?

Spear

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122484627#Comment_122484627

Mods can do so for the obvious spambots, though I suspect many aren't aware of this. Anything borderline or unclear goes to the admins who can make a more informed decision, e.g. with IPs/geolocation etc.

con747

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122484637#Comment_122484637

I was thinking it was a lack of awareness ok, can they all be informed of the option if possible to save doubling up on work for you all deleting them in the spammers thread and other obvious trolls. The DRP is there if someone gets nuked by accident.

MisterAnarchy

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122484354#Comment_122484354

But moderators largely dont follow threads, they cant, there arent enough of them and there are too many threads.

This has been mentioned multiple times.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122102438#Comment_122102438

So in effect what you have are a certain group of bigoted posters with too much time on their hands who are seemingly constantly online and have little interest in any sort of balanced discussion essentially doing the moderators screening job for them.

These posters spend the majority of their time reporting others in the hope they get banned when they post material that isnt likeminded.

The moderators then act on these reports and issues warnings/bans.

The system is seriously skewed in this manner.

Sudden Valley

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122484493#Comment_122484493

Did you report these posts? If so, the mods should have acted on these. If not,why not?

con747

Posting because thread is stuck.

MisterAnarchy

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122484689#Comment_122484689

Can I answer that without someone accusing me of backseat moderation ?

Yes I did report them.

Nothing was done.

Sudden Valley

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122484750#Comment_122484750

That is definitely wrong then. I don't think it is backseat modding to say you reported it and disagreed with the outcome.

MisterAnarchy

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122484759#Comment_122484759

Only one post was removed, the lunch money post, guess who received that warning.😄

Overheal

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122484759#Comment_122484759

it’s not bsm in feedback, “post reported” etc. in most all other forums is not really allowed afaik nor is on thread arguing with mods/moderation

awec

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122481005#Comment_122481005

To clarify on this.

If you pick up 5 active warning points you will be automatically sitebanned by Vanilla itself, without any intervention from mods or admins.

Unfortunately, due to how Vanilla works, it is possible for mods to ban users without having accumulated those 5 points, sometimes unintentionally due to a confusing UI.

However, we have been clear with mods that site banning users is not within their remit (unless it's the auto site ban for 5 points). Site banning (permanent site bans) are something only admins should be doing.

If a user thinks they've been sitebanned by a mod without picking up those 5 points they should email us or re-reg and open a thread and their ban will be lifted immediately.

awec

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122480726#Comment_122480726

Yes, I have overturned plenty of warnings and bans.

JP Liz V1

Do warning points stay for a certain time period or for life @awec

Appreciate your responses too @awec and @Spear

awec

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122485090#Comment_122485090

They expire.

If you get 1 point warning it expires after 1 week and 2 points after 2 weeks. Therefore you'd need to accumulate the 5 points within a relatively short period of time to trigger the automatic site ban.

When I say "expire", I mean they are no longer active, but they still appear to on your record. If a user's record is bad enough to come to our attention then they can be given a warning that further mod sanctions will trigger a more severe ban.

E.g. if a user was consistently picking up sanctions but not quite at the rate required to trigger an automatic ban they can still be given a manual (and usually temporary) ban by an admin if their record was poor enough over a sustained period of time.

Leg End Reject

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122485090#Comment_122485090

You can see how long they're active for on your profile. Click on your avatar, select view profile and scroll down to the bottom, you'll see an option called Moderation. That will have all your warnings, the points, how long they're active for or if they've expired.

It was clarified that a mod might be less lenient if you've accumulated loads. I think it was Beasty, but I'm not searching for it or arguing over it. 😁

ETA - Awec saved me the trouble!

awec

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122485128#Comment_122485128

Yes though again, to be clear, mods should only be less lenient if you have accumulated loads of sanctions within their forum. A user having 50 sanctions in CA should have zero influence on what sanction they get in the Soccer forum, for example.

Assessing sanctions across a category is the remit of a cmod, and assessing sanctions across the site is the remit of admins.

Of course this is speaking generally, there are caveats to this but this is by and large how it should work.

Leg End Reject

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122485137#Comment_122485137

I didn't know it was that detailed, but it makes sense.

Flaneur OBrien

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122485128#Comment_122485128

I never knew that, thanks.

(14 warnings in 15 months! Jaysis... And some say lefty posters are never warned...!)

Leg End Reject

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122485187#Comment_122485187

Ah, but how many would you have if you were right leaning?

*That's a joke, I'm not looking for evidence either way. 😂

Flaneur OBrien

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122485203#Comment_122485203

Gimme 15 months....

:P

Goldengirl

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122484750#Comment_122484750

How do you know nothing was done?

I believe from past Feedback the mods don't have time to report back to the person reporting a post whether they actioned them or not ...and I don't believe they have to either .

Maybe they did warn the poster but did not feel those posts were offensive enough to remove ?

The old system where yellow and red cards were given on the thread while a bit basic certainly was more of an indication of moderation and warning to others .

But you are arguing that people should not be reporting others , are you ?

Or are you upset that those you reported have not been removed ?

Which is it ?

Asking because I thought a few were nasty , some were funny and clever but quite a few would have upset the person they were directed at , which was the intention .

I liked the lunchmoney one and the concussed into next month have to admit ;p

pjohnson

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122484681#Comment_122484681

I always find this argument hilarious and I"ve seen it crop up repeatedly in all the incarnations of the "mod bias/censorship" threads.

What upsets people so much about the supposed amount of reports made?

Jequ0n

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122486427#Comment_122486427

Because it’s bullying if it’s used to get people removed from discussions.

I recently received a warning for having agreed with another poster. I queried why I received a warning when the other post remained on thread. Neither mod nor cmod could be bothered to explain this inconsistency and it took an admin to reverse the warning. I can only assume that my post had been reported, and that the other one had not.

Obviously people will report others, and mods will act on these reports without checking full context as they have confirmed that they lack capacity to do this. There are undoubtedly cases where people go out of their way to misinterpret and misrepresent posts though just to be able to report them.

What’s unacceptable is the refusal to engage with evidence when a decision is being queried or challenged. It’s therefore unsurprising when posters, who have been on the receiving end of this, suspect certain bias to be at play.

EmmetSpiceland

Is “context” important if I break the rules? If I reply, in kind, to someone attacking me, and my post is reported, I will get a warning. If the, initial, rule breaker is reported, they will get a warning. If not, it’s all on me.

If I start blubbering at the mod ‘but…but…but…they did this!’ it means nothing, I broke the rules and will get punished for it. Expecting mods to read over every thread and forensically analyse every post to garner some sort of justification for breaking the rules is pie in the sky stuff.

The site is struggling, that’s plain to see, the mods, and admins, are spread thin and they have asked us, the users, to assist in the “policing” of the site through reporting, not engaging, with rule breakers.

Instead of taking “pot shots” and criticising the mods, for giving perfectly valid warnings, and constantly wasting their time with, spurious, appeals in the “Dispute Resolutions” forum maybe users could adjust their aggressive, and angry, posting style and work with the mods, and admins, for once.

suvigirl

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122486746#Comment_122486746

Surely, if a poster gets banned for 'off topic posting ' as a result of trying to stand up against bullying, then that's a valid reason to argue your case?

Surely you should be able to ask the mod to read the posts replied to, and apply some fairness?