Manchester United Thread 25/26 - Teamtalk/Transfers/Gossip Mod Note in OP 26.09.24

Zeek12

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122984976#Comment_122984976

I like most of Mitch’s selection but would definitely have Maz in the side and Garnacho out. I don’t think he’s a good fit playing in one of the No. 10 roles

Mitch Connor

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122984976#Comment_122984976

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122984996#Comment_122984996

I just genuinely forgot about him! Mazraoui in for yoro or martinez.

Imo our general plan should have at least one wb as an overt attacking threat - I don't like both sides being somewhat traditional fullbacks (even if their tactical instruction differs)

Nigzcurran

United in the championship would be hammered, they are even more hungry and determined down there and we wouldn't be up for the scrap. Plenty of skill but very little effort

Mitch Connor

I'd look to sign a more consistent running threat, but right now I think garnacho is the best fit, for how I'd like to see us play. Put zirkzee or eriksen on there for garnacho and we lack a running threat. Plus if dalot is on the left I think the pace a d intent of garnacho is important. Amad would offer that from rwb on my suggestion.

Mitch Connor

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122985018#Comment_122985018

And yet Burnley and Southampton bossed the league, and get stuffed in the pl.

Robson99

For those old enough to remember it's a lot like when Sir Alex came in from Aberdeen. It took him the guts of 3/4 seasons to build a team and break up the culture that existed. He got rid of so.e big names ( McGrath, Whiteside, Moran and a few more ). He brought in practically a new midfield in Webb, Phelan, Wallace, Ince and a pair of CHs that were the back bone of his team. He built HIS team over 3/4 years.

The same is required now. Whether we like to admit it or not we have a very average squad. Rashford, Casemiro, Bruno, Antony, Malacia, Shaw, Zirkzee, Lindelof could / should all be out the door in the summer and let the rebuild commence. It's going to take us at least 2 full seasons to get things right...but at least let's give him the opportunity to get in his players and the chance to build a team

Posters saying he is under pressure already or questioning how long he will be left in charge really need to stick to the playstation.

Let's give the man the man the chance to break up the **** show of a culture that's in the dressing room and judge him after he has had 2 summer transfer windows

Nigzcurran

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122985028#Comment_122985028

Your point is?

Sand

As far as Amorim goes, he's so far shown himself to be charismatic but he could very quickly become ETH 2.0 in the UK media. He is an up and coming manager with a good track record in European leagues, comes to the PL and its tough going - we've seen this story before. For all the talk about patience, INEOS are not known for patience in their appointments. Ask anyone at Nice, or Ashworth. If Amorim's record in the PL (7 points from 18 available - just 4 from 12 against Ipswich (A), Forest (H), Everton (H) and Bournemouth (H)) doesn't pick up then realistically he will be under tremendous pressure very quickly.

The reality is the only fix is several years of excellent, incredibly successful transfer windows one after the other. Incremental improvement, not quick fixes of sack X, hire Y.

I think sometimes people overstate the importance of the manager/head coach. 95% of it is recruiting good players. We're seeing it with Pep at City who has 9 defeats in 12 games now. He didn't suddenly forget how to setup a football team or inspire players. City are missing critical players for their system, and have made some mistakes in recruitment that are being shown up now.

Mitch Connor

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122985040#Comment_122985040

You're point was united would struggle in that league. Where evidence shows teams that have absolutely walked it a d struggled in the pl worse that united.

Evidence just doesn't support it, imo.

ericzeking

The big problem with United is , it's not just the on the pitch stuff. Week after week it's circus after circus, is there any other club like it?

EtH had Ronaldo, Sancho, Greenwood, Antony and Rashford sh!tshows to deal with, every week there is some new drama, grinding stuff. I guarantee EtH will be a success again, but at United the man was just broken down piece by piece.

Now Amorim has Rashford and Garnacho already causing a distraction.

It is constant distraction away from the goal of winning the game at the weekend.

What do Liverpool for example have? Salahs contract maybe? But he is still banging in the goals.

Mitch Connor

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122985073#Comment_122985073

We need to return a seriousness to upper management. You step out of line, you're gone or in serious danger of it without change. You don't contribute, you're gone.

We have distractions because we allow players to be too interested in aspects of fame. Em

Nigzcurran

Yeah I'm sure they'd get a few wins down there but our record against the so called lesser teams has been terrible the last few years. It doesn't add up when teams like forest, Ipswich and palace can be a match for us even though on paper we should hammer them. We have plenty of players who have shown us a level of skill these other teams can only dream of but they are well drilled and have a plan they stick to which we never seem to be able to overcome unless they have a bad day. They are usually first to most headers in both boxes and get stuck into tackles, very rare you see any of our players going in hard for a 50/50 ball. It just feels like no matter what players or coaches we have it's the attitude out on the pitch that kills us

Mantis Toboggan

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122984636#Comment_122984636

Look you may not like to hear it and I find a lot of united fans are slightly deluded anyway but I can guarantee you if we lose 5 more in a row there will be massive pressure on Amorim.

If we get sucked in to a relegation battle the club may be forced to act. They've already cut askworth lose after 5 months, they have a ruthless streak.

Since Fergie left we're always one signing away from solving all our problems and transforming the team, unfortunately this isn't Championship manager and it doesn't work like that. I'd be very slow to give him any money in January based on results and performances. Maybe a loan signing but that would be it.

Dave0301

People really need to stop belittling the teams that have beaten us as having "average players."

Bournemouth in the first half were excellent in their shape off the ball yesterday and their 3rd goal was ruthless in punishing United's mistakes.

Most Premier League teams are made up of strong technically proficient players. Calling other teams full of average players when we have Malacia starting is disingenuous. The number of United players that would be automatic starters at other PL teams, especially the top 6 is dwindling by the season.

IncognitoMan

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122983577#Comment_122983577

This short term fix idea is exactly the opposite of what the club needs right now!

Chelsea since that CL season have finished 3rd, 12th and 8th. They are no benchmark.

The quick overnight patch job is not what the club needs. The club needs to be back challenging each and every season and that needs long term thinking and planning.

Robson99

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122985122#Comment_122985122

So expect him to preform miracles with a squad littered with **** players. Keeping them mid table would be an achievement. I think you are really over valuing the quality of squad we have. Yes capable of winning the odd big game...but then clap one another in the back and do **** all for the next 4. He needs to be able to bring in HIS players and fuk out the wasters. Every manager deserves to be able to do that.

Do you honestly think any manager would turn that sows ear of a squad into a top preforming one ?

FourFourRED

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122985122#Comment_122985122

This here is why you back him and get the players needed:

https://twitter.com/utdfaithfuls/status/1871133422535467136?s=12

He said himself we’re going to suffer. Short term pain for hopefully long term gain.

Of course if we are somehow at serious risk of relegation then maybe you have to do something but I don’t think it will get that bad.

If SJR decides that he has seen enough after another 5/10 games when the guy himself said it wasn’t going to be easy, he is going to come in for some heavy criticism for meddling in something which he knows nothing about.

Zeek12

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122985122#Comment_122985122

Sadly this is true. The media Love a good United "Disaster story". The club has been like a bad soap opera for over a decade. And looking at some of our forthcoming fixtures (Newcastle, Liverpool and Arsenal in the Cup) - defeats look very probable indeed. RA could definitely find a very negative spotlight directed at him.

Lets hope Ineos keep their heads and don't do anything silly. I don't think they will do something daft to be fair. He is Their appointment and he deserves to be given time.

What's actually worrying is so many in this group of players are made of jelly and don't have the fortitude or backbone for a battle.

How will they cope and react if we slip further down the table, and the pressure really starts to come on them?

pjohnson

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122985122#Comment_122985122

Insane.

Regardless of manager theres not a left back in the squad. Unless you know a manager who has tactics that are designed to entirely ignore the existence of the left side no manager makes this team work without an LB. Or do you think Amorim should try Heaton as a secret LB weapon?

roosterman71

The range of opinions here is fascinating. We've some discussing how poor the squad is and saying we need new players and others saying the manager should be given nothing bar maybe a loan. We've posters saying we'd be better being relegated and rebuilding FFS. Who really thinks that's an approach to pursue?

The man is in a few weeks and is going to need time. If INEOS decide results aren't brilliant to date and use that as a reason to not back him somewhat in January, then INEOS is the problem here, not the coach.

ngunners

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122984978#Comment_122984978

Ait Nouri is a horrible defender. He has loads of attacking threat but he's a complete liability in defense and one of the reasons Wolves have been leaking goals. He didn't play their last match where they kept a clean sheet and I would wager that they are stronger defensively without him.

Cunha is a fantastic player.

DM_7

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122985073#Comment_122985073

United always have a circus, SAF was always dealing with serious issues from Cantona jumping into the crowd to Rio getting a ban for missing tests, he fell out with loads of players like Beckham, Ruud or Heinze. His last great team started to fall back when Ronaldo was under the attention of Real and the mess that Tevez temporary loan from a third party came to an end.

The one constant at United, and INEOS have done this also, is the constant jumping from one coach to another that needs very different things and major turnover of players, with massive investment needed manager to manager, that generally turns out to be poor investment.

Amorim will benefit from Maz, Yoro and Ugarte but how many of the signings under Ten Hag would he want as priority players?

De Ligt, Zirkzee, Malacia, Hojlund, Casemiro, Antony, Eriksen are probably all no.

Martinez, Mount are maybes.

No idea if he would he have wanted Onana to be honest.

Mantis Toboggan

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122985196#Comment_122985196

Well we don't really play with a left back anymore. Surely Garnacho could do a job wing back against Bournemouth at home? Or if he wants a proper left footer why hasn't he tried Antony? Rashford another who would be dangerous going forward and what's happened Harry Amass who was supposed to be the next great hope?

My point is that if we spend 50 million on a wing back it's not going to massively impact the team as much as everyone wants to believe it would.

JRant

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122985218#Comment_122985218

Let's not forget he hasn't had more than 3/4 days between games since taking over and is dealing with a hodgepodge group of players assembled over the last 4/5 years that mostly lack the physical traits to compete at the top of the PL rather than technical ability.

The schedule of games up to mid January is pretty insane so I expect things to get a little worse before they get better. Once we are out of all cups and he has time to work properly with this team and bring in a couple of his own players we'll be in a better place.

BENDYBINN

we would have won yesterday if rashford was playing……..Bournemouth really poor at the back…we can’t afford to leave him out.

bucketybuck

Is it really out of order to ask that the exciting new coach bring something to the table, or are we supposed to just leave him alone for 2 years no matter what and do an assessment then?

Nobody is asking for a title challenge, or a revolution after ten games, but if he is a top coach then I don't think it is too much to ask to see some players performing better than they were previously. To see results improve over the failed coach that got sacked.

It kinda feels like a lot of people are starting from the default assumption that Amorim is definitely a top coach who absolutely will be a success if he is left alone.

But he isn't. He is a young manager who has shown potential, just like Ten Hag. And if left to his own devices he could easily make a pigs ear of it, just like Ten Hag. And so he needs to be judged on his performance just like any player, manager or employee ever hired by anybody.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122985375#Comment_122985375

I don't know about would have won but the attack was very uninspired.

Garnacho from the start could have made a big difference too. With Zirkzee you need players running beyond him and Bournemouth seemed a bit suspect in that regard when Garnacho came on but he didn't have the quality to really exploit it.

DM_7

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122985477#Comment_122985477

No it is not out of order. Elements of how the team functions have clearly changed. It's too early to make any calls on if that is good or not.

Is it the case that a lot of people (unnamed in your post) kinda feel Amorim is a top coach that absolutely will be a success? I don't see where that view is coming from.

All we have seen so far is the club decide they want this coach and that he wants to change how the team plays.

He openly stated after his first game that the team will suffer as a result of the changes he is making. He feels he has to do it now as if he delays it, then the team will be in a similar place next season at a similar time.

We saw Ten Hag come in, we saw him abandon his ideal quickly + within a few games - and get the team through his first season. Then in his second, again he had to abandon his ideal a few games in and found himself in the same place he was the previous season. But this time the results got progressively worse. They got worse again in the next season and in the end all that happened was he left the club as low as he found it.

Amorim could do just as poorly overall, we don't know, but a short terms bump in results to get through a season is not what the club actually needs right now.

Mitch Connor

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122985477#Comment_122985477

I think tactically abd in general terms we do see something different and better. But the players continue to make mistakes which is difficult for any coach

My main criticism of him and his team is just how bad we are at set pieces - it should be clear they need to rectify that defensively, as the biggest priority, as it's making matches extremely difficult when the opposition have a near certain goal every game, at least one. Creates huge nervousness too, which impacts everything else.

Mitch Connor

I also thinks he really needs to push towards a settled side and rotate when it's needed. Maybe it's fully needed for more intensive on the training ground tactical work but if Bruno a d dalot can either do both or do with out it, we need to see that from our strongest selection in general.