Hit and run in our apartment complex

kat20

Hi all,

Looking for any advice please for this issue. Apologies it is long.

In the apartment complex myself and my husband live in there are 2 apartment blocks one under a building management company and the other is under the local county council. Our block has designated parking spaces and the other block is supposed to as well but it seems they don't as ever since the residents moved in months ago we have had numerous issues of other cars parking in our space. We have called building management and sent emails to try and rectify this issue along with the other residents in our block. The management solution is park in another space which is someone else's spot.

Last Saturday my husband and I returned from being away for a few days and there was another car in our space. My husband parked our car in front of the other car as there was no free spaces available and left his number on the windscreen to call to move.

2 hours later we saw the car had managed to angle out of the space as the space next to our space was empty. My husband immediately noticed that the passenger side door had been reversed into by this car as there is a huge dent and the person had took off not leaving a note.

Unbelievably our apartment complex has no CCTV looking at the car park area or capturing cars coming in or out and they say it is unfortunate.

Would anyone happen to know would building management have any liability for this incident or as there is no CCTV footage and no pic of the other car there is no proof this occured in the complex?

Oscar_Madison

I’ve often seen signs (and there’s probably one there somewhere in that car park) which states “the management accept no liability for property damaged…..blah blah blah…”

I’ve often wondered to what degree this has any legal basis in that say a wall collapsed on your car in the car park, Shirley the property owner would be liable.

But in your case, you didn’t park in a space, you blocked another car - it was a crime driving off certainly but legally I don’t see how the management company could be held liable for this. Why are you thinking they might?

I feel for your situation - not sure I would have blocked someone in but can understand the frustration - maybe check are there any cameras directly on the road- do you remember the type of car? Report to Gardai but don’t hold breath anything will come of it- obviously keep an eye out for the car again but likely it was a visitor

kat20

There is no signs in the complex that say management accept no liability. I understand not wise to park in front of the car but we did leave a number on windscreen and there were no available parking spaces as the car park was full.

There are no cameras coming out on to the road but we do know the make and model of the car and have the year and county just don't rest of reg plate.

We contacted the guards and filed an incident report as soon as it happened.

I suppose because this car parking issue had been highlighted to management for months and because our allocated parking space is included in our lease agreement I thought there might be responsibility.

wandererz

No CCTV?

https://www.woodies.ie/tactix-rubber-mallet-16oz-1114475?objectId=40247&queryId=095e7477899fbc83e10b4f3ff4e06c06&indexName=prod_default_products

kat20

There is only CCTV facing the entrance into the building and in the lobby. Management reviewed footage and informed us that the camera does not capture cars passing.

XsApollo

I know this doesn’t answer your question, but to stop people parking in your space get a parking post with a lock that you can place and un place as you wish.

So your husband, out of annoyance, blocked another car in by parking across the space instead of finding somewhere else to park, your car is damaged and you can’t prove the car your husband purposely blocked in, did it?

It would appear you are suffering from the law of unintended consequences for your actions.

JVince

YOU parked in a manner blocking another car and you want someone else to pay because the car YOU blocked damaged your car slightly as it was trying to move out of the space.

Frankly, they were entitled to smash your window and move your car as you were intentionally impeding their movement.

Just because they were in a parking space that was allocated to you gives you no right whatsoever to block them.

Allinall

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122259295#Comment_122259295

Of course it gives then a right to block the other car. It's on their property.

It certainly doesn't give the other person the right to cause damage, just because they can't get their car out.

JVince

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122259341#Comment_122259341

It's unlikely to be their property. Just assigned to them.

You don't have a right to block another vehicle unless you clearly state that in signage that is clear and easily visible.

Mikros

Chances are the car will be back to the complex again so you can just grab the insurance details of the windscreen. Even if you were wrong to block the car in (debatable, considering you left a contact number) it doesn't give the other person free reign to damage your car. You will get no joy chasing the management company for liability for a 3rd parties actions.

kippy

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/2058355881/hit-and-run-in-our-apartment-complex

Out of interest - what logic would you use to suggest that the management company held liability in this instance?

Buddy Bubs

Bad decision borne out of frustration with inaction and of a bad setup, but a bad decision nonetheless

Marcusm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122258647#Comment_122258647

The management company did not drive the other car, a human being did and they are likely liable for the damage to your car. Did you photograph or take note of the other car’s registration plate? Even if you had, it might not be sufficient proof. Without it, I cannot see how you have any recourse. It’s tough but I don’t see any other solution.

beachhead

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122259372#Comment_122259372

There is a legal right to the car parking space if written into the lease.The leaseholder is entitled to block anyone using the space.It was unfortunate that the driver did not fully block the space.The leaseholder should pursue the management company.On the issue of signs placed in a car park have no legal standing.They are advisory in nature

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122261332#Comment_122261332

I’d be interested to know what right you speak of to block anyone who occupies that parking space.

beachhead

The leaseholder pays for the parking space when the tenancy agreement is set up.The tenant has a designated space.Look at the terms and conditions of your lease agreement if you have one.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122261367#Comment_122261367

Does that entitle them to park outside their designated space?

28064212

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122261332#Comment_122261332

There is a legal right to the car parking space if written into the lease

Right

The leaseholder is entitled to block anyone using the space

Wrong.

The leaseholder was entitled to contact the management company to have the parker towed/clamped/penalised under whatever T&Cs the car park operates under.

Del2005

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122261367#Comment_122261367

I'm sure the T&Cs of their lease says that all cars have to be parked in designated parking bays, both cars where parked wrong. The MC already told them that if their space it taken they have to use another space.

The OP fecked up by not taking a picture of the car in their space and their undamaged car blocking it. Even if they get the reg of the other car the owner can deny it was them that caused the damage.

Oscar_Madison

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122261794#Comment_122261794

Yep on a hiding to nothing in my view - it’s very possible the other car if minor damage done is now repaired - no witnesses no proof no case - there’s an assumption here that the blocked car caused the damage- more than likely it did- but with no witnesses and a likely now repaired car, I’d be putting down to lesson learned and move on - it was 2 wrongs

Lenar3556

From my reading of the OP;

There are two blocks of apartments, one is privately owned, the other it seems is local authority housing. The OP I am presuming is residing in the privately owned block and has an assigned parking space(s) which is set out in the apartment lease.

The OP is likely also to be a member of the Owners Managment Company, and a meeting needs to be arranged to agree actions to regularise this unauthorised parking of cars which infringes on the terms of OP’s lease.

As regards the vehicle damage, it’s going to be difficult to find anyone responsible except the driver of the car that caused it.

3DataModem

OP you need one of these. Easy to install. Your management company won't care. https://eur.vevor.com/parking-lock-c_11507/vevor-car-parking-lock-20m-remote-control-car-park-driveway-guard-space-saver-p_010810589056?adp=gmc&country=IE&utm_source=google&utm_medium=cpc&utm_id=20478028752&ad_group=154281938602&ad_id=670832970676&utm_term=&gad_source=1&gclid=CjwKCAjwmrqzBhAoEiwAXVpgovie9Kzlh3oEyed-0AfGOO64-VuxEIwfO8uqgHXjQ5Q3doLiYq0mixoC5UYQAvD_BwE

Secondly, a way to stop people parking in a space (or at least, this worked for my boss in the office) is to put a disabled sign on it.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122268317#Comment_122268317

You have no reason to think the OMC won’t care if the lock is fixed in position, they may not want 20 different spaces, each with a different barrier contraption for people to trip over. It’s also worth remembering, the op does not own the space, it is leased to her/him and remains the property of the MC, they may not want their property altered. At the very least, the op would need to get their consent to place a fixed object on their property.

Claiming a disability where none exists, is low.

Del2005

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122268317#Comment_122268317

The OMC might care when their car park is damaged when it's installed or if someone trips over it and sues. In an apartment complex all you own is the air inside the walls, the OMC owns everything else, you don't even own your balcony you just have exclusive use of it.

Secondly, a way to stop people parking in a space (or at least, this worked for my boss in the office) is to put a disabled sign on it.

If it's correctly marked you need a blue badge to park in a disabled space, if it's not correctly marked then it's a parking space.

Lenar3556

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122272571#Comment_122272571

It’s a private car park - the use of disabled spaces and any rules as to how they might operate is entirely at the discretion of the owners Managment company.

Del2005

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122285701#Comment_122285701

That depends on it being a public place or not. If they are having problems with people parking it would imply that it is a public place under road traffic legislation and then it's not at the discretion of the operator how they manage disabled spaces.

Lenar3556

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122286007#Comment_122286007

Have you a link to the legislation that sets that out?

Say I own a small factory, and decided to put up some signs designating certain car parking spaces as being for disabled use. I used the same signage as features in the national traffic signs manual.

I drive in some morning and park my own car in one of them. I would have committed a criminal offence? Doesn’t seem logical.

Padre_Pio

At the end of the day, a parked car can't cause damage. The other driver caused the damage and should pay.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122287276#Comment_122287276

Which other car?

Sconsey

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122287320#Comment_122287320

The one that was moving and hit the side of the OP's car. They hit a stationary car and drove off.

JVince

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122286007#Comment_122286007

That's incorrect. You may be mixing up a "public road" and a "public space".

On a public road traffic legislation is in force.

On a public space road traffic legislation is not in force, however there is plenty of legislation to protect people from bad driving in a public space, but this does not extend to parking. A garda or a traffic warden cannot issue a ticket in a privately owned car park even if that carpark is open to the public.

I also believe (open to correction) that a garda cannot issue a ticket in a council owned carpark, however a traffic warden may do so.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122287376#Comment_122287376

Which car hit the op’s’?

Padre_Pio

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122287505#Comment_122287505

Apparently the one he tried to block in

"My husband immediately noticed that the passenger side door had been reversed into by this car as there is a huge dent and the person had took off not leaving a note."

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122287932#Comment_122287932

If you read the rest of the op’s posts, there is no CCTV, the op hasn’t posted that they have found anyone who witnessed it. the op doesn’t have a the car’s registration number, It would appear that the op is assuming the car they blocked in, did the damage, but as the last line in the opening post states, they have no proof it happened in the car park.

So which car are you saying should the op get to pay?

Padre_Pio

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122288235#Comment_122288235

If it sounds like a horse, looks like a horse…

The person that should pay is the driver of the car.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122288363#Comment_122288363

Which horse though?

The op has a huge problem, they neither know the identity of the car/owner, nor have proof that the car did the damage or if it was even done in the car park.

Using your glib analogy, it’s like saying a horse did the damage, but not knowing which horse.

Padre_Pio

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122288379#Comment_122288379

Using yours, it's like seeing hoofprints and horse sh*t and saying "what horse?"

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122288418#Comment_122288418

You nearly have it, just a little more to go, which horse did it?, if it needs to be identified, as in the ops case.