Deposit return scheme (recycling) - Part 2

jj880

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123214564#Comment_123214564

I posted specifically to do with Re-Turn. Nothing to do with glass so the rest is not relevant to my post.

I got a false heading from the Re-Turn.ie homepage that has been debunked several times on this thread. The EU legislation has been posted here. Its for return targets but on Re-Turn.ie they say Recycle. It's BS.

The poor level of "sources" on here is actually mad

Boggles

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123214613#Comment_123214613

Again, no one is obliged to backup your claim.

You can't, because it is nonsense just like your claim about bottled beer.

You are making a holy show of yourself, so just move on, for everyone's sake, especially your own.

odyssey06

The Re-turn website says - direct quote:
The Single Use Plastics (SUP) Directive is the main driver for the introduction of Deposit Return. We need to achieve the EU recycling targets of 77% by 2025, and 90% by 2029

That's not what the Directive says. It does not mention recycling. I've included the link below to what the EU actually says about it.

Specific targets include

• a 77% separate collection target for plastic bottles by 2025 – increasing to 90% by 2029

https://environment.ec.europa.eu/topics/plastics/single-use-plastics_en

The Re-turn website is spreading misinformation if not disinformation. And the difference between whether something is "collected" or actually recycled is more than just semantics. It is a bait and switch.

Red Silurian

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123214632#Comment_123214632

I've explained very clearly my claim about bottled beer if you don't understand it that says more about you

So just to be clear, you can't provide any proof?

Red Silurian

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123214633#Comment_123214633

And what happens to the bottles/cans/glass after they get collected?

jj880

Just goes to show. A lot will look at the homepage and that's it. Case Closed.

Must be recycling targets if re-turn.ie says so. It doesnt get more brazen than flat out lying on the homepage of your own national DRS website.

Let's let the same cowboys have 50,000,000+ euro of our money annually.

Conspiracy theories? The biggest one here is: "This DRS is about the environment".

odyssey06

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123215098#Comment_123215098

That is the question. There's no commitment\guarantee from Re-turn that all items collected will actually be recycled. If there is a glut of PET on the recycling market, then what happens? Will they be sent for incineration?

Ask yourself why the EU targets specify collection rates and not recycling rates, if they are the same thing.

Red Silurian

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123215099#Comment_123215099

It doesnt get more brazen than flat out lying on the homepage of your own national DRS website.

But what if they aren't lying and everything re-turned is getting recycled?

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123215120#Comment_123215120

No commitment or guarantee except for the fact that it is written all over their website you mean.

Look at it another way, if the products being collected weren't being properly recycled it would be all over the news. There's reporters out there with a lot of hatred for the system, if it wasn't being properly recycled they'd be over it like flies on s#!t. You'd also have the opposition parties in the Dail using it as another stick to beat the govt with.

Chances are if this stuff wasn't being properly recycled we would have concrete evidence of it, not hearsay from a few headbangers on this thread. Remember, we don't live in China

jj880

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123215163#Comment_123215163

Come on. You cant be that dim. All morning we've been discussing the lie in question being Re-Turn putting "Achieve EU Recycling Targets" on their website homepage when the EU legislation states they are collection targets. Stop the nonsense posts.

Red Silurian

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123215182#Comment_123215182

Is it dim to believe what is written on a the re-turn website over what people with hidden names say on web forums? I'd think not

jj880

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123215738#Comment_123215738

Youve been provided with a link to the EU directive that states "collection targets". Do you believe me if I tell you Ireland is an EU member or is that false because you dont know my real name? This is bizarre.

odyssey06

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123215787#Comment_123215787

There's no author's name on the information on the Return website, therefore it can be safely ignored by that logic!

It is just somebody anonymous on the internet.

Some absolutely desperate arguments being rolled out here when the EU website plainly contradicts the information on the Return website. Imagine believing what is written on the Return website and not an official EU one.

Tony EH

Collection targets are not the same as recycling targets.

Surely that's an obvious one.

:/

Red Silurian

What happens after the product gets returned if it doesn't get recycled?

Tony EH

You're assuming that just because something is collected that it's getting recycled.

LambshankRedemption

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123215904#Comment_123215904

It gets a warm new home in Poolbeg.

Red Silurian

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123215926#Comment_123215926

And everybody else is assuming that it's not getting recycled, without any actual proof of what happens when we say goodbye to our recycled products

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123215931#Comment_123215931

I presume you have proof of this?

Tony EH

In the case of plastics we know that the majority doesn't get recycled, on a world wide basis.

"Collection" doesn't mean shite, when "recycled" is the reason we're being told the item is being collected in the first place.

Sconsey

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123215950#Comment_123215950

https://www.epa.ie/publications/monitoring--assessment/waste/national-waste-statistics/EPA-Packaging-Info-FINAL.pdf

Proof you say? 71% of plastic collected in 2020 was incinerated

I have not seen anything from DRS to say the pattern is changing. They talk about collection, nothing about what they are doing with the millions of plastic bottles.

Red Silurian

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123216031#Comment_123216031

DRS was introduced in 2024, has there been any proof that what we put into the RVM doesn't get recycled?

beachhead

None

kippy

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123217298#Comment_123217298

There's very little proof of anything from this scheme.

No proof of official monthly collection rates.

No proof of the shop from home people getting the promised supplier led collection which was promised before the scheme started.

No proof that the scheme is better for the environment versus the older methods of collection (bins in houses)

No proof that these guys actually looked at how things were done in other countries.

No proof that alternatives to this scheme(including tweaking the old scheme and collections strategy) were looked at.

No proof that this scheme is better on a percentage collection than old methods(because no official figures available)

No proof of what happens items after they get collected.

Most worrying there's no proof that this scheme has or will change consumer or producer behaviour.......

So no, there's no proof that they get incinerated or magically get recycled.......

Red Silurian

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123217587#Comment_123217587

So no, there's no proof that they get incinerated

Exactly! Just to add, there's also no proof that they get fed to animals, sent to China or to landfill after going through the re-turn process.

But if the scheme bosses say something gets recycled on their website, in news conferences etc I'd be inclined to believe it until proof of the alternative surfaces. If there were any proof of such a thing I'd be one of the first calling them out

Most importantly, could you imagine the public outrage, on a scheme that already attracts a lot of ire, if what some on here are saying were true!

Boggles

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123217752#Comment_123217752

But if the scheme bosses say something gets recycled on their website, in news conferences etc I'd be inclined to believe it

Yip. You would be the target audience alright.

GSBellew

What's the difference between going to a bottle bank and going to an RVM and feeding it?

Genuine question to those who are anti RVM but have no problem with dropping bottles off at a bottle bank?

I just combine the two runs into one, twenty minutes to half an hour on a Sunday afternoon see's the job complete, no major hassles or drama, the odd can or bottle is rejected and then accepted on the second try, I've had that happen maybe 3 times in the year in total, I have yet to be in a scenario where there is a long wait or no machines working

Is the system perfect? Far from it, but it is not the worst experience of my life, I have much more pressing and stressful things to get wound up and lose sleep over, a deposit return scheme? Nah, it's small fry so count yourself lucky if it's that high up your list of irks and ire's

kippy

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123217752#Comment_123217752

Based on everything you know, why would you be inclined to believe them when all conventional logic would suggest that they have spoofed their way through this project from day 1.

Have you asked yourself:

Why haven't they told us the stats of what happens the items after they are collected?

Ask yourself, why haven't they given us those stats, if the stats being as some say here, would lead to public outrage.

kippy

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123218000#Comment_123218000

Of course it's small fry in the whole scheme of things for many people and many people who have some civic responsibility (and what their own money back) will of course engage with it.

The issue is, the scheme itself doesn't solve any pressing problems, lets the producers completely off the hook and is (I would say) deliberately designed to make it awakward to claim your own money back/use that money. It's also come with a whole host of false promises, poor planning/implementation and a lack of reporting (that while I am prepared to wait for) is essentially the whole point of the sheme.

Not much difference going to a bottle bank or an RVM just that bottle bank in theory but of course in practice there are many. If an RVM were as simple to use and the whole process were are straightforward as glass collection it would make plenty sense but both collection methodologys are completely different.

Of courses there are far worse things out there but to see a completely pointless scheme, that isn't ultimately going to solve the core issues, and will lead more outlandish actions down the road is just annoying.

And the same people who didn't engage with other collection/civin responsibility won't engage with this, either way.

When you look at the setup of it, where the producers essentially run the scheme - it is doomed to fail in the longer terms goals of what a scheme like this SHOULD be doing.

odyssey06

People probably assume when you put used clothes into a Clothes bank it gets recycled or re-purposed.

Well not always…

Much of what is sent to the Global South now is low-quality, synthetic fast-fashion, she says, and so can end up in landfill or being burnt in countries such as Ghana. 

https://dublininquirer.com/2025/02/26/council-expects-to-flip-the-financial-model-underpinning-used-clothes-banks/?utm_medium=email

Red Silurian

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123218337#Comment_123218337

Would I believe what the official website of a govt scheme says over some unknown peoples posts on social media? Yes is my answer there

Red Silurian

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123217859#Comment_123217859

I think we are all the target audience in these cases