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Deposit return scheme (recycling) - Part 2

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Comments

  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 16,918 ✭✭✭✭elperello




  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 16,918 ✭✭✭✭elperello




  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 10 instantfoam


    Well easy both are and were scams.

    Why are we moving from putting bottles & cans in the green bin to Deposit Return?

    To date, over approximately 60% of plastic bottles and cans are being collected for recycling through recycling bins, which means that over 30% are not collected, leading to increased littering.

    By placing a value on the drinks containers, we are incentivising consumers to return their bottles and cans in order to get their deposit back and discourage littering. The Deposit Return Scheme is a circular economy initiative that aims to create a closed loop recycling system guaranteeing the material is returned and recycled into new drinks containers.

    In addition, with the separate collection of drinks containers, there is no cross contamination and a higher quality of recyclate is collected, which is more efficient.

    over 30% are not collected, leading to increased littering. Is that not an out and out lie ? People who put them in the green bin are not tossing them on the road now instead.

    Why doesn’t the Deposit Return Scheme include glass?

    Currently, Ireland has a recycling rate of over 80% for glass and is surpassing recycling targets for this material. As a result, there are no plans to include glass in the Scheme but this may be open to change in the future.

    1 return will never get 80% like glass.

    2 why are they not saying 20% of the bottles are being tossed on the road like the plastic ones ? is that because it's a lie ?

    some digging

    Ireland’s recycling rate has not improved in a decade: it is time to move away from a wasteful linear economy | Environmental Protection Agency

    Single-use Plastics

    • 30,680 tonnes of single-use plastic bottles were placed on the market in 2022. A collection rate of 49 per cent was achieved prior to the introduction of the new Deposit Return Scheme. 

    The report shows that over the last 10 years Ireland’s recycling rate has stagnated and mandatory targets for municipal and plastic packaging are at a high risk of not being met. Currently Ireland’s municipal waste recycling rate is unchanged at 41 per cent, with a requirement to be at 55 per cent by 2025. In addition, whilst recycling of packaging waste is 60 per cent, this must reach 65 per cent by 2025. In 2022 the plastic packaging recycling was 32 percent, up from 28 per cent in 2021, however the recycling target for plastic packaging is 50 per cent by 2025.

    Single use not Pet

    Are PET plastics recyclable?

    What is PET? - Recycle the One

    Almost uniquely among plastics, PET is near-infinitely recyclable and because it can be made into new products, this lowers the need for fresh PET to be made, further reducing emissions. In fact, recycled PET products show a drop of up to 90% in CO2 emissions compared with virgin PET.

    What is the problem with PET plastic?According to the rapport, PET plastic can leak harmful chemicals into its contents. This chemical leaking is extremely toxic to humans and can have various side effects on those who consume them. After the use of PET products, they are thrown away.

    But But green.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 12,102 ✭✭✭✭thesandeman


    Ray Darcy just mentioned it now.

    €54,000,000 not claimed. He's not impressed that ReTurn are keeping the money.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 10 instantfoam


    DEPOSIT REFUND SCHEME | Urban Agenda Platform

    Actions and Implementation

    Deposit refund schemes are systems where consumers pay a small amount of money upfront, to be reimbursed to them when they bring the container to a collection point once they have finished using it.

    Apparently we copied some undisclosed out of thin air country in Europe. No return to the store you got it from no voucher none of the addons. And notice collection point not RVM. Even the return website says they are not mandatory. Cash grab plain and simple. steel is also mentioned in return. The green bins never took steel ? do the RVM. I thought steel was only used for like water bottles and cantinas and alike not beverage cans.



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,369 ✭✭✭jj880


    unclaimed money raised through the drink industry-funded scheme actually goes towards the cost of running the machines and paying for advertising

    Hilariously brazen thievery with vague spoof on how our money is going to be spent.

    50+ mill a year cash cow. Jackpot.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 20,701 ✭✭✭✭Tony EH




  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 12,102 ✭✭✭✭thesandeman


    It's coming up on Drivetime as well.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 19,207 ✭✭✭✭kippy


    I thought we weren't getting concrete figures for a few months yet?



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,369 ✭✭✭jj880


    Dxhound right now:

    Screenshot_2025-01-16-12-53-15-993_com.android.chrome-edit.jpg Untitled Image


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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 19,207 ✭✭✭✭kippy


    Don't worry - everyone knew these figures would be in this ball park. I assume there's a few standard lines DRS supporters will use to justify them…….



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 35,372 ✭✭✭✭odyssey06


    The figures being reported across various media outlets are:

    Over €54 million in unclaimed deposits

    Only 73% of items were returned.

    Hasn't been picked up yet by eg RTE with detailed information on how those figures were arrived at.

    "To follow knowledge like a sinking star..." (Tennyson's Ulysses)



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 11,743 ✭✭✭✭Red Silurian


    €54m unclaimed and 1bn containers returned reported by the Irish Examiner 2 weeks ago

    If the unclaimed money was made up of €0.15 deposits that suggests 360m containers not returned. So that's 1.36bn sold and 1bn returned or 73.5% return rate

    If the unclaimed money was made up of €0.25 deposits that suggests 216m containers not returned. So that's 1.216bn sold and 1bn returned or 82% return rate

    So if my maths is correct the actual return rate is somewhere between 73.5% and 82%, that's up from the 70% we were reportedly returning before the scheme started but quite short on the 90%+ target



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,369 ✭✭✭jj880


    Sure. Quite the figure when finally in writing with a side order of "up yours noneya business" on how its going to be spent 😳. Going to be tough work to justify that.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 22,633 ✭✭✭✭dxhound2005


    I have some of that €54 million in my house. I will be getting it back later this week.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,102 ✭✭✭This is it


    I've 4 bags of bottles, twice recently tried to bring them back and machine was out of order. Pain in the arse



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 19,207 ✭✭✭✭kippy


    Be careful, you'll be told the 90 percent rate is what we are working towards and we have till 2029 to get there. Or something like that.

    I am somewhat still wanting to see what the official figures are for the timeframe involved.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 11,743 ✭✭✭✭Red Silurian


    In order to get higher figures you would need people who didn't use it the last 12 months to use it in the future. I don't see it happening.

    Eventually inflation will make the deposit worthless and they are only going to wind up back in the household recycling bin



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 19,207 ✭✭✭✭kippy


    This is the line ReCycle have used as well whenever there's been a managed leak about figures a d the rationale for not releasing figures to this point.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 22,633 ✭✭✭✭dxhound2005


    I'm just one house, there could be a million more.



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,369 ✭✭✭jj880


    How much of that 54,000,000 euro do you really think is still being stored in houses round the country? Come on. This is weak.

    Remember there was a 4 month "transition period" until 1st June 2024 when building up that 200,000,000 euro in total deposits.

    It will be a higher figure for the next 12 months so without significant improvements to Re-Turn a higher figure again thieved into the Re-Turn kitty from non-refunded deposits.

    Any comment on the complete lack of transparency from Re-Turn on how our money will be spent?



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 22,633 ✭✭✭✭dxhound2005


    Is there some system which can declare them as never coming back? What happens if a few of them turn up tomorrow?



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,369 ✭✭✭jj880


    Again weak response. Why should I answer your nonsense questions when you wont answer anything.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 19,207 ✭✭✭✭kippy


    So what is the point of this scheme then if the confidence in the actual figures is just as low as it was with the original method of collection?



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 22,633 ✭✭✭✭dxhound2005


    Any count done today is going to be out of date tomorrow.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 11,743 ✭✭✭✭Red Silurian


    At an average of 5m bottles/cans sold per day you could safely assume there's a little less than €1.25m in deposits being, err... deposited, per day. So €54m in deposits equates to at least 43 days worth of in-scope products sold



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 35,372 ✭✭✭✭odyssey06


    Undermines the entire concept of the scheme then wouldnt it... meeting targets etc because it would be out of date tomorrow.

    Once again, an illogical attempt to defend the scheme just backfires.

    Everybody reading the thread knows if the figures were favourable to Return, you would be promoting them without scrutiny.

    Your claims have no credibility.

    "To follow knowledge like a sinking star..." (Tennyson's Ulysses)



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 11,611 ✭✭✭✭LambshankRedemption


    FYI, I added that user to my ignore list months ago for doing that exact same stuff. He has never encountered an out of order machine, does not find returning anything arduous and has never had an item rejected. He is alright, Jack



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,369 ✭✭✭jj880


    I'm going by the figures reported today.

    https://extra.ie/2025/02/24/news/irish-news/e54million-of-deposit-return-cash-unclaimed-in-a-year

    Around €200 million a year is spent on deposits but a whopping €54million of that cash pile is not claimed back.

    So 98 days worth of total year deposits but Im not sure what that's telling us.

    Its a huge sum of our money being pocketed by a CLG completely unaccountable to anyone it seems.



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,044 ✭✭✭geographica


    I suppose you could put a “good” barcode sticker over these cans being rejected? Hmmm



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