Local/ EU elections who will you Vote for

zerosquared

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122093862#Comment_122093862

Especially when what happens in Europe might have larger consequences to one’s locality

The whole idea of “protest” voting is daft to begin with, the Brits did it with Brexit and look at the place now (and the Tories are still in power)

Rustyman101

Anyone with a half coherent immigration policy which unfortunately rules out about 95% of candidates.

Just like the other 80% of the electorate if polling is to be believed.

we seem to going to have referenda on everything including the colour of Simons door, except migration policy.

While the colour of the door may effect Simons neighbours, I imagine the current wave of immigration will effect considerably more but no poll on this little nugget.

I Wonder why

Kermit.de.frog

The problem with "protest voting" is that if most voters did it they'd actually get the government they voted for.

Clo-Clo

The European elections seem to have a number of poeple who have followers on tiktok who like them complaining about the government and that has qualified them into been a good person for election

Silentcorner

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122094816#Comment_122094816

Look around you buddy!! The entire continent is politically unstable, not just Britain. I've never seen the amount of protests we are seeing, the farmers of Europe have been picketing in massive numbers, by the way, these are the people who provide our food. France is more unstable than the UK in recent years, riots, protests, church attacks, terror attacks…Germany has seen massive political swings after the disastrous Energy and Immigration policies of the Merkel years….there's a war nobody seems to want to end on the European border, record level of inflation is killing the middle classes, accommodation crisis everywhere it seems, massive energy price rises, more draconian climate policies to come…ya but the Brits are f##ked is no longer any kind of legitimate view!!!

We will soon lose another generation to the UK in the coming years. We have more crises than I've seen in my lifetime,

I have no idea why our youth aren't rioting in the streets, they have been f##ked more by this Government than any generation since the 80s.

We have damaged our tourist industry probably beyond repair. SME's have never had it tougher to maintain viability, we have a raging mental health crisis and a health system in a permanent state of crisis We have police pepper spraying innocent residents of private quiet villages. We are in unchartered waters.

zerosquared

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122095192#Comment_122095192

You must be very young so

Silentcorner

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122095227#Comment_122095227

You must be blind if think only Britain is in trouble.

Furze99

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122095034#Comment_122095034

How about trying it, suck it and see what happens like. Mightn't at all as bad as some vested interests like to point out.

Brussels Sprout

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122094845#Comment_122094845

Referenda are for typically making changes to the constituion. What wording would you like to insert into the constitution with regard to migration?

Galwayguy35

Will vote Independant Ireland in the local elections.

I'd give a vote to the Farmers Alliance but I'm not seeing any movement from them lately about running candidates.

I'm in the Midlands North West constituencey for the European elections so might vote for Michelle Smith but haven't fully made up my mind on it yet.

Silentcorner

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122095346#Comment_122095346

I wonder how many hatchet jobs the media will do on the Farmers Alliance and Independent Ireland etc between now and June, I see the pitch forks are out for Niall Boylan today…it's great watching Irish media get more hysterical and lose more relevance day by day!! I wonder when the penny will drop for Fg/FF/Sf/Soc Dems/Lab that hiring ex journalists may not have been a smart move!!! RTE/Irish Indo/Irish Times are irrelevant. Great to see!!

I'm betting the Farmers Alliance will be accused of having "back channels" to dark money in the white supremacy movement or some such nonsense!

Rustyman101

Oh I don't know maybe have some form off plebiscite on the current mess.

And yourself ? Or are you happy enough with the current situation, sure it'll be grand im sure.

fly_agaric

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122095192#Comment_122095192

Sorry a lot of that is a load of over-wrought hyperbole.

You've really "never seen amount of protests/terrorism/riots we are seeing" today across Europe?

Although there was no social media, no "Xitter" or "Thick-Tok" in the "past" (say mid to late 20th C?), so I suppose any protests and violence back then didn't really exist.

Just like the whole world was rendered in dull sepia shades and 625 vertical lines @ 50 Hz. The people who are old now likely could not see what colours snooker balls were in their youth. We have video evidence to prove it!

That part about "losing another generation to the UK"…think the UK seems to be more likely to lose a generation to us! Not good for the massive population pressures on housing and all govt. services here though I admit.

On the genuine problems that face us, well a bunch of far right and far left goons + cranks coming into power around Europe/in key countries off the back of failings of more "normal" politicans are not going to fix any of it.

I expect if they manage to ride some kind of wave to power in some more countries, they will just blow stuff up metaphorically and smear shít all over the place the way the Brexiteer gang did in the UK over last decade.

Make everything worse and ride off into the sunset with a sack of money, and you and me (and rest of the voting public) will be holding the bag (or suffering the hangover) afterwards.

Galwayguy35

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122095458#Comment_122095458

I see the Soc Dems are running Rory Hearne here in the Midlands North West.

He is just the sort of candidate that would suit that lot.

I'd like to see Boylan do well but he will have his work cut out for him.

Clo-Clo

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122095458#Comment_122095458

Niall Boylan 😂

Then you claim RTE/Irish Indo/Times are irrelevant

Not sure what World you live in that you think Niall Boylan is relevant and the others are not

Silentcorner

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122095519#Comment_122095519

I'm sorry, but your post is all over the place…

You think the UK will lose a generation to us? That is nuttery of the highest order, we can't even house our own youth. We have more young adults in their 30s living in the bedroom they were children in because they can't afford to move out than anywhere else in Europe. Nobody who is capable of paying rent or buying a house will be moving here for some time to come….absolutely nobody.

Silentcorner

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122095546#Comment_122095546

Where did I say Niall Boylan is relevant? Go back and read my post.

fly_agaric

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122095558#Comment_122095558

For something tossed off in a few minutes on a Friday night, I think it was no more all over the place than your hysterical brain dump! I mean I didn't even get to that doozy about the war "that nobody wants to end".

What does that even mean I wonder (?), though I think I know unfortunately.

You got me. The UK are obviously not going to lose "a generation" to us, as you say where would we put them all?

I would predict however that we will have a net inflow of UK citizens to here in coming years, not a net outflow of Irish citizens to the UK from here. I think Irish people that leave probably will not go to the UK.

Silentcorner

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122095586#Comment_122095586

Ok now we are getting places.

The war that no one wants to end, tell me then, what world leader is calling for peace talks? What global entity is demanding peace? There are marches allover the country every week for peace and politicians calling for ceasefires…in the middle east mind.

Now, challenge the rest of my points.

Are we not in an accomodation crisis?

Are we not in an inflation crisis?

Are we not paying huge money for energy?

Are SME's flourishing?

Do we not have a mental health crisis?

Is our health system not in perpetual crisis?

Is there not massive Farmers protests going on now for over a year across Europe?

Have we not seen massive rioting and public disorder in France for the last 4 or 5 years on and off?

What points specifically are you challenging?

Hamachi

I won’t be voting for FF/G, the greens because I’m not insane, SF, Soc Dems, PBP or Labour.

It’s slim pickings out there to be sure.

Brussels Sprout

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122095467#Comment_122095467

I'm sorry but you're dodging the question. Specifics are vital when it comes to a referendum. You need to know exactly what you want to say so that everybody is clear of the consequences. Otherwise it can cause even bigger problems. Case in point - the Brexit Referendum.

So a vague "We need a referendum on migration" doesn't hack it. What aspect exactly of migration? What would be the wording put to the people?

fly_agaric

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122095602#Comment_122095602

I think Chairman Xi has called for "peace" talks on the "Ukraine crisis" while Chinese companies are making bank (re)tooling up Russia and shielding it from Western sanctions so it can keep going in its efforts to destroy Ukraine.

So that is probably the kind of peace you mean, shaft Ukraine up the bottom and cut them off, smile at Putin, shake his hand and tell him what a great job he and his army have done liberating the New Russian Territories of Ukraine!

I just challenged the broader point you made that this was some worst ever era in recent European history, needing some very radical/protest/populist politics. A unique era of chaos, violence, upheaval etc. across the continent, not just in Ireland wasn't it:

"The entire continent is politically unstable, not just Britain. I've never seen the amount of protests we are seeing, the farmers of Europe have been picketing in massive numbers, by the way, these are the people who provide our food. France is more unstable than the UK in recent years, riots, protests, church attacks, terror attacks…Germany has seen massive political swings after the disastrous Energy and Immigration policies of the Merkel years….there's a war nobody seems to want to end on the European border, record level of inflation is killing the middle classes, accommodation crisis everywhere it seems, massive energy price rises, more draconian climate policies to come"

I guess you have rowed back from it now. On challenging specifics, I feel like I've already spent too much time on this and if you want me to write an essay for you arguing against each point backed up with statistics etc…well you are out of luck and all you'll get is below.

Point 1. This relates to Ireland and root of it is the f-ckup laissez faire "property market" mismanaged by multiple govt.'s as long as I've been alive and now completely cracking up under strain of population pressure/immigration. I don't think it applies everywhere.

Point 2. I think inflation in Eurozone has decreased back towards more normal levels this year. I believe that war you think everyone is so gung ho for had something to do with it in 2022/23. Maybe aftermath of Covid as well?

Point 3: Thank that war, and also Ireland's stupid short sighted "nimbyist" or "banana" (i.e. entirely electorate driven) energy policy for this one.

Point 4: I don't know (situation across Europe), I do know there are more Ireland-specific issues affecting the SMEs here.

Point 5: Yes there are large farmer protests, but this has happened before. Farmers are a strong lobby group in most countries and they do come on to the streets and make themselves heard when they are not happy. It is not good of course but it just doesn't feel to me like some special harbinger of doom coming for us all.

Point 6: On a new mental health crisis, I don't know. People do seem to talk about their mental health and their sufferings a lot more. Maybe they used to just quietly drink themselves to death or suicide in the past? I admit the phenomena of social media use and the internet etc. are probably bad for mental health generally. I don't see a bunch of radical populist politicians fixing this, more likely to be fixed by some normal politicians finally getting up the courage to take on the tech MNCs and their revenue generating models and put in some restrictions on social media/the internet (which will be called anti-free speech I am sure).

Point 7: Health system - another fine Irish mess that is.

Proint 8: France's riots. Yes France has had riots...Think there has always been a culture of taking to the street in protest there far more than here or UK, so again they have had violent riots in the past. However I agree with you country does not look so politically stable, and we don't know what next elections there will bring.

edit: On migration to/from the UK was kind of interested so I googled that. There's a decent net inflow of immigrants each year from the UK and that has been going on since 2016 despite the housing problems, and what a hellscape the country seems to be acc. to you.

"In the year to April 2023, the UK experienced strong migration flows. Estimates have shown that 14,600 people left Ireland to live in the UK, up from 13,400 last year and 18,400 people moved to Ireland from the UK, up from 12,800 in 2022 (See Figure 6 and Table 5)."

https://www.cso.ie/en/releasesandpublications/ep/p-pme/populationandmigrationestimatesapril2023/keyfindings/

Silentcorner

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122095676#Comment_122095676

So essentially, you are agreeing with me more or less on all my specifics….you just don't like the way I said it. I objected to the notion that the UK is f##ked…when clearly we are seeing the same turbulance all over Europe. You are the one rowing back on your points not me….I do accept that Europe has bloody history and I accept that what I said may seem like hyperbole on that basis, I meant in modern times and I was referencing the European political landscape in the context of the current British political landscape.

There is always a flow of people from the UK to here and vice versa, but it was you who said the UK would lose a generation of young to us, which as you admitted was a farcical statement. We on the other hand have lost multiple generations of young Irish people to the UK and I think (note the word think) we will lose another soon, living at home with parents into your 40s is not sustainable for any person, and our housing crisis has at least another ten years to go…

bobbysands81

No Government party will get my vote.

No right wing nut jobs will get my vote.

Any political party that leans left, or is left, or Independents that are left will get my vote.

JP Liz V1

It will likely be Independents and maybe Aontu, at the moment I think if Dustin the Turkey ran he'd walk it

spaceHopper

Any Eu candidate that has local issues like housing in the leaflets isn't getting my vote, it's not their job.

My council is doing an OK job on housing that are are actually building a fair amount if it. But they are also forcing stuff on my local area that isn't popular and they are letting the council officials away with to much. I watched one meeting online and only the FF councilor asked any hard questions and voted against something. So he has to get my first or second vote after that. It's who I'm not voting for, not greens not FG or other FF, not current Labor. So we'll see

elperello

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122095856#Comment_122095856

It seems that what you are looking for is right wing with "common sense" policies.

Beware of reasonable sounding right wingers they may turn out to be nut jobs in disguise.

MFPM

Local elections are broadly irrelevant, local government in Ieland has so little power, many councillors use it as a stepping stone to the Dail. Councils can be useful platforms for some though so in that context, hopefully as few of the anti immigration types polluting communities with hate and violence win, unfortunately one or two may get elected at local level, none of them will get elected for Europe.

Niall Boylan may get a reasonable vote in Dublin but he won't get any where near the seats.

Looking forward to the humiliation of the likes of Blighe and Dwyer in Europe too

More broadly on the Euros, hard to see huge change -

FF/FG/SF will take 8/9 of the 14 seats.

Greens 1/2

INDs will take 3/4 Flanagan/Daly/Wallace/Mullooly/McNamara

Aontu may take 1, can't see anything for Labour/SocDems/PBPA

MNW the hardest constituency to call, that's where there could be some interesting outcome.

end of the road

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122094845#Comment_122094845

because there is no need for one ultimately.

we have the policies in place, the problem is the government won't pay for the staff to actually enforce them, do that and we get on top of the issue.

abolishing the common travel area between ireland and the UK would be a huge help also but that would require reunification.

fly_agaric

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122095851#Comment_122095851

I don't think the UK is "fucked" either, and didn't say that myself. That would be more gloom and doom-mongering, and going against what I was trying to say.

I agreed a lot of your specifics are real things (maybe bar inflation, which has done its damage in 2022/23 but is easing).

However many of those are Irish (rather than European) problems.

They also don't indicate some catastrophic situation IMO, needing to take a punt on radical politics, throw over the table in hope it gets better and these problems get fixed (somehow). It almost always makes things worse (as UK has experienced recently - unfortunately they have only had bad political choices before them lately, a Comrade Corbyn govt. would have been dire as well I think!).

Even in terms of Ireland's recent-ish history let alone Euopean history (60s - 1990s say) current situation is not disastrous. We have clear problems, it could be better.

On the UK, there is no way we will lose another generation to them. If an exodus happened on scale of the 80s and previous decades (those were not some halcyon days in Ireland!) we'd lose them to the US/Aus./Canada or perhaps to countries in Europe with better prospects.

Places they can do better in than they can here at home. That is not the UK this time. As I pointed out, the British are coming here!