Shortage of Catholic priests.

BaywatchHQ

Many priests would have been celibate anyway regardless if they joined the priesthood as many of them are non neurotypical. Also I don't believe allowing priests to marry would make such of a difference as young people aren't interested in the Catholic church. My parish currently has a temporary Spanish priest who noone understands.

Grayson

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122023618#Comment_122023618

I think it would have definitely made a difference if it was brought in 40 years ago. Now not so much since so many people have left the catholic church. The pool of potential priests is far smaller now. But 40 years ago there would have been a lot more young men who might have considered it except for the celibacy clause.

Poon Tang

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122024836#Comment_122024836

They should embrace new ideas in order to survive. We all know religious doctrine is made up BS anyway, so they can just make up some new rules to become more modern and progressive.

Just imagine if your local priest was gay or trans… and Sunday mass was like going to a local pride festival. They might get some fresh new blood into their cult, and could look to the future with more optimism. Instead of dwindling attendance figures and crumbling decaying churches.

gym_imposter

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122024857#Comment_122024857

Apparently the likes of the church of England hasn't seen any increase in attendance since becoming more liberal

political analyst

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122022098#Comment_122022098

Do those senior clerics have the power to remove a Pope from office? If they do, then that demolishes the idea of papal infallibility.

downtheroad

Just close/merge a few churches. In some parts of Dublin you'll find several churches within a small radius (I can count 6 within 2km radius of my house). There's hardly a demand for that many.

One eyed Jack

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122032801#Comment_122032801

Nope, and while that does mean the Pope is unimpeachable, Papal infallibility is an entirely different idea! 😳

Francis’ battle with the more hardline Conservative clerics among the flock is less of an actual battle, and more Francis giving them the signal that they should flock off, with the sign of peace reversed, in their general direction 😏

political analyst

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122032881#Comment_122032881

If it's impossible to remove him from office then why is he afraid of those clerics. If his word is law in the Vatican then what difference does what those clerics say make?

One eyed Jack

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122032886#Comment_122032886

I think I get where you’re coming from now. Francis isn’t afraid of them, so much as they’re just a pain in the arse, and should they gain enough authority, then there could be a change in Canon Law which would bring about the possibility of ousting the Pope from office. However the existence of that law would then also apply to anyone among themselves who might one day hope to ascend to the throne, so to speak, and that’s why they’re wary of bringing it back:

https://slate.com/news-and-politics/2010/03/can-the-pope-be-fired.html

political analyst

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122032930#Comment_122032930

But the Pope has a veto and so any plan by those clerics to change Canon Law to bring about that possibility would come to nothing, wouldn't it?

Anaki r2d2

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122024857#Comment_122024857

Lol, I don't think an "openly" gay priest is going to help matters!

They have been modern and progressive for a long time.

BlueSkyDreams

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122024857#Comment_122024857

Just cannot imagine that ever happening in Ireland.

Besides, it's the message that's important, not the delivery.

And if people dont believe in the message, well the game is up.

One eyed Jack

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122032949#Comment_122032949

Now you see why Francis isn’t afraid, and the hardline Conservative clerics amount to nothing more than a pain in the arse for him.

political analyst

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122032962#Comment_122032962

Then why won't he let priests get married?

purplepanda

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122020770#Comment_122020770

Wasn't that the reason celibacy in the clergy was encouraged, I recall reading it wasn't until after 1000AD onwards that it became common practice. Or is it connected with the Latin - Orthodox schism of 1054? As Orthodox priests can marry.

WrenBoy

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122023147#Comment_122023147

Ah there's still plenty God botherers like myself left to keep the doors open, sorry you'll have to suffer our presence a while longer 😂

mikethecop

I have very little interest in the church but it seems that there has a shortage of priests as long as I an remember , and that a while.

it really is hard to understand the objections to married and female priests in this day and age, if they want to choose that life and people who want to choose that life are needed then whats the fecking problem popie ?

Princess Consuela Bananahammock

I think the problem is disturst in religions generally. People are not turning away form the church in order to pursue a different faith, they just tend to be more skeptical and that's not something that's going to be changed by a loosening of attitudes.

XsApollo

we are a wealthy country, how many young fellas nowadays would pick a career as a priest?

Back in the day I’m sure people decided to become a priest because of pressure, or nothing better to do.

they will have to start finding priests from less wealthy countries, vulnerable people .

That’s their speciality preying on the vulnerable.

And a big no to removing the celibacy requirement, so people forget what that organisation did to children and is still doing mind you in other parts of the world.

I can imagine what kind of life being indoctrinated into the Catholic Church would mean for a kid. Abuse and no freedom.

Fu*cking animals.

hoodie6029

How they are still going after all their scandals and criminal behaviour for decades is beyond me.

Refusal to pay compensation to the victims even though they got to State to foot the bill for most of it, stringing g it out as long as possible so many of the victims are dead to reduce the bill. The vile legal behaviour of the Christian Brothers.
Now little by little selling all their prime property while claiming poverty.

If they started up today they be investigated as a Organised Criminal Gang and have CAB after them.

Their absolute refusal to acknowledge anyone’s right to longer be counted as Catholic too. If it was Facebook or anyone else at that, they’d be in the High Court explaining themselves fairly quickly.
The sooner that they are gone from Ireland, the better. Unfortunately they just move their scam to other countries.

Large bottle small glass

I love the way when it comes to Christianity, but especially the Catholic Church, it a free for all with regard to criticism. People are much more careful generally when it comes to criticism of other religions especially Islam.

Many of the Muslim men I speak to (my town has a hotel devoted to Syrian refugees) would make a parish priest from the 1950's blush with their views on a whole host of social issues including sexuality, women's place in society, the role of religion in everyday life etc etc.

As a non believer myself, with the benefit of hindsight has our social evolution in the West, been an entirely good thing for society? We have never had more involuntary childless women, more involuntary single people, more children without an active father, similar amounts of kids needing foster care, mental health issue within all sectors of society etc etc.

While all the great religions have a single thing in common; an illiterate man in the desert hearing a voice from the sky being the genesis of their Great Book they also have something else in common. If you take all the words in books as nonsense they still bring to people who practice a sense of community/belonging/daily structure/identity/coming of age rituals etc etc.

These are all good things that many of the people who struggle in the western world would benefit from having in their lives.

I'm not sure from a neurological perspective there is a lot of difference between saying a daily rosary/ getting a mat 5 times a day and facing east with mindfulness/CBT techniques. Its time out for yourself to reset and allow time to calm your brain.

Along with the certainty of death another certainty is that at some stage in life you will get kicked in the face; major illness, death of loved ones, betrayal etc etc. Organised religions are always active in these areas and offer a lot to people struggling be that daily structure, community, people with similar experiences. When my face kicking came, which was pretty extreme, the gentlest, wisest and most helpful person I met was your quintessential old Catholic priest. It caught me by surprise for sure.

A common requirement for any recovering/grieving/struggling is positive social contact/community. Churches are really active in those areas. Religion will never be for me I would think but for a huge cohort of people it does work.

Progressive liberalism doesn't have all the answers and atheism certainly doesn't.

Nick Cave has written extensively about the role and essence of God/religion in life. To paraphrase and summarise his take: rationally religious belief in obviously nonsense but my life is better when I practise it"

yagan

The RCC, Anglican church, state Lutheran churches were once the central hub in their respective societies. Ireland was an outlier in the aftermath of the reformation wars in that it was the only realm where the populace did not follow the religion of the sovereign, so we've a political angle too.

Aside from the centrality of their premises in our physical environment I can't think of anything positive they can offer.

Being a priest is being gods salesman and I'm not sure what they're selling other than lessons in slippery evasion of truth.

Oscar_Madison

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122037556#Comment_122037556

historically religion was essentially a way of organising society - Education was limited to the privileged - wealth was not at all distributed. Citizens were essentially slaves to their paying masters no matter whether it was 19th century Deep South America or someone farming a small holding in the west of Ireland owned by the chap in the big house up the road.
If you look at China, whilst their record on religious beliefs is atrocious they still have a belief system very similar to religion except this one is based on the collective good and adherence to whatever rules comes out of the communist party and dictator - it’s not really hugely different to how religious backed countries run their states - a dose of fear, a lot of forced conformity and a bit of hatred for anything different and that’s it.

After that it’s simply a question of what flavour religion would you like to live under.

SupaCat95

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122032801#Comment_122032801

There was an internal coup to remove Pope Benedict. Hence is also not buried with the other popes and no head of state attended his funeral. We all know he spent the 70s' and 80's covering up Romes knowledge of greater child abuse so there was no liability and it was just a local thing.

Sunny Disposition

If God wants more priests he'll look after it, I wouldn't worry too much.

SupaCat95

Its very very difficult to change a very very old and large organisation, there are not many older the club of Rome. Also hardline clerics are the new generation. They new priests dont understand their role in society. They are too authoritarian, academic and rooted in the belief that they have are on a mission. I had one of the new ones start telling me how to conduct myself regarding legalities of my wedding, I walked away …BOOM, credibility gone in 3 seconds flat. An elderly priest was introduced to me afterwards, smoothed it all over, problem solved.

I met two of these clowns from wealthy families as a younger man. They never did community work, did arts degrees in bolloxology, three holidays a year, unelectable to office and the families shoved them into the priesthood cos they were no good at anything else. One was deemed unsuitable and the other was forced through and given a Jesuit parish but as odd as they come. I cannot say anymore about their peccadilloes other than three wasnt considered a crowd.

BolloxChop

The catholic church and Christianity is in decline in this country yet Islam is expanding with new mosques being built. I have no love for Catholicism but why are people happy to have a religion like Islam expand here? Or is that islamaphobic to ask?

Large bottle small glass

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122037734#Comment_122037734

Its not just Islam, there is an unprecedented rise the number of Christian churches catering to the needs of African/asian/south American arrivals.

I've a Brazilian friend driving a 2.5 hr return journey every week to go to a church service primarily made up of Brazilians. A stuffy Irish mass doesn't cut it for a lot of our new arrivals.

SupaCat95

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122037734#Comment_122037734

Most people think Islam is just a new religion, it is not it is a new "regieme" with taxation, legal system and a social structures that are incompatible with our values. About 10 years ago there was a meeting in Rome between the heads of the Roman Catholic Church and the Islamic authorities. There was an amalgamation agreed where the RCC would be assimilated into Islam "gently". The Islamic followers have the population and Rome has the wealth. Watch it happen over the next 30 years. We are getting traded.

yagan

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122037734#Comment_122037734

It's the same for any immigrant group. When I was an emigrant many of the emigree community events were based around the church built by previous generations of Irish immigrants.

In the 80s in the US guys from the Ancient Order of Hibernia would lecture me about Ireland, even though most had never been. Thanks to FB I see a lot of that type become Trumpers and call Ireland a liberal shytehole.