Almost a cheater?!

YellowLead

He needs to take on his half of the household management/work and that’s the bottom line. If that’s not possible, then he needs to pay for cleaners etc.

Male a list of everything you are currently doing (grocery shopping, meal planning, cooking dinner, dropping kids to school, signing their homework, bringing them to swimming or whatever, doing laundry and uniforms) just so he sees the enormity of it in front of his face, and ask him which ones he is going to take on.

JeffKenna

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121912183#Comment_121912183

That's gaslighting. Pretty bad form to not come out and admit he's in the wrong. At least you can work from there. Putting the blame for his actions on you is just totally wrong. Some accountability is needed here.

maddierthan

It's just mad to me to be here asking the internet for advice on my relationship. Last week I would not have been able to fathom this.

I'm so deflated by it all. I'm just crushed.

I'm also very glad to hear that I'm not alone in thinking that he's gaslighting me.

Squatman

immature of the husband no doubt. on a more human level, you need to leave work at work. it should not be impacting your personal life to the extent where your husband feels isolated, or where you are burning out.

NB I am in no way drawing any conclusion or reference that item A led to Item B. I'm sure I will be accused of it thou, so rest assured it will fall on deaf ears.

maddierthan

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121912543#Comment_121912543

It's funny because I actually do leave work at work. I'm just getting by at work because a lot of my headspace is taken up with family and household tasks.

I was once very ambitious but something had to give.

If my husband feels isolated, and that's entirely possible, he should communicate that with me. I can't be everything to everyone and a psychic to boot

PeaSea

You said at the start "My husband and I (both early 40s) have always had what I thought was a good relationship", if you hadn't said this to be honest I would have assumed from subsequent posts you were a pair of hormonal teenagers. A bit of maturity here on both sides would go a long way.

Does he do this often, go out in the evening and come home drunk - if so, then as others have said that's what I would be worried about first. If he doesn't do this as a rule, then has something happened recently (that you might not know about) to dent his confidence and make him start to behave like this - if so, then thats what you need to sort. imo the texts are a symptom, not the problem.

Ted222

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121912183#Comment_121912183

I’m sorry but I think you may be overreacting.

It’s open to interpretation. When people get married and have kids, they forego the carefree lifestyle they may have once had.

It may be that your husband just enjoyed his night out, flirted a little bit and then tried to repeat the experience a few nights later.

Married people (not just men) enjoy a bit of a blowout every now and again. Granted, he probably shouldn’t have texted the person but, in isolation, it’s not a life changing decision, unless you make it one. So he finds another woman attractive? The day he stops doing so is the real day you have to worry about.

Only you know what he’s like on a continuous basis but, a bit of perspective, on the evidence you’ve presented here, I don’t think he’s yet reached the status of alcoholic philanderer.

I’d agree he should be doing much more around the house but perhaps this is something you should discuss with him rather than randomers on the internet.

It might also help if you had more fun together. It sounds like your relationship is becoming more adversarial and that can be difficult to retreat from.

maddierthan

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121912930#Comment_121912930

I guess I have high standards when it comes to loyalty. Having said that I'm not expecting anything I wouldn't expect of myself.

I have discussed him doing more around the house. It's a fairly frequent occurrence. But also this is a discussion forum, where people request outside opinions, so that's what I'm doing here.

Ted222

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121913036#Comment_121913036

Yeah I get that but bear it mind, it’s easy for others to dole out textbook advice. You have to live with the guy.

Look, he fessed up and you’ve given him a dressing down which he probably deserves but maybe he’s just stretching for excuses by trying to blame you. It’s ridiculous and he probably knows that but he’s grasping at straws here.

And don’t conflate this issue with the housework. Sure, he should be pulling his weight but don’t make it part of a punishment.

For your own sake, think about how it’s perceived. The women in pubs are great craic and make him feel great. The woman at home forces him to iron and hoover. You can see where this will lead to. If you think it’ll lead to a situation where he prefers to spend time at home with you…..

While it would be nice to think we all live on Walton’s Mountain (younger people, please google), the reality is that men and women remain attracted after marriage to people other than their spouses. Alcohol can reduce the natural tendency to stay at arms length so maybe the advice is to go out, have a drink but not get slaughtered.

But 30 minutes with a hoover would never make a man want less drink.

DeanAustin

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121913036#Comment_121913036

Be careful with the advice on here. People tend to project their own frustrations on your relationship on very scant evidence or by taking something you said out of context/to an extreme. At this point, you’re best talking to friends to get advice and talking to your husband to sort out any issues.

Hannibal_Smith

@Ted222 and @DeanAustin please bear in mind this is Personal Issues Forum. The whole point of the forum is to provide a place where posters can come and seek advice on an issue that is troubling them.

@maddierthan you are welcome to continue seeking advice if you feel its helps.

HS

taxAHcruel

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121912183#Comment_121912183

A problem with him leveling "blame" against you is you are less likely to - how did you put it - own up to your fair share. If he wants you to own up to this stuff then he is going exactly the wrong way about it.

I subscribe to the notion of "extreme ownership". Taking ownership of choices you make or do not make. His choice to pursue on any level this other woman is entirely 100% his choice. Now certain behaviors of yours might have factored into that decision, sure. But the decision is still 100% his. You can not be blamed for it. He needs to take 100% ownership that this decision was 100% his.

You can similarly take ownership of your behaviors that have been negatively impacting your relationship. Now you have been made aware that certain behaviors of yours might be having negative outcomes, you can acknowledge that, own it, explore it, and mediate it.

But where he is shooting himself in the foot by taking things that factored into his decision - and casting them in the light that you are to "blame" for his decision when you are not - he is creating a dynamic where you are now less likely to do that. Why? Because he has now set it that any acknowledgement you make about your behaviors might now validate his claim that you are part to "blame" here. He wants you to acknowledge things you have been doing that is hurtful to him and your relationship - but he has demanded this in a way that makes it the least likely you are going to do so.

It sounds like there are several things you both can take ownership of, as individuals and as a couple. But as long as acknowledgement of any of those things validates some narrative of accepting blame for something the other has done or failed to do - it is much less likely to happen. There is a world of difference between acknowledging the actions of others were factors in our bad decisions and actions, and blaming those others for our chosen decisions and actions. It is very rare in my experience that the latter is ever a good or right thing to do.

But were I in your position now when this conversation next comes up again I would essentially say in your own words to him that "Ok I acknowledge the criticisms you have made about me, I am going to own them and explore them alone and with your support to see where I can improve, but this acknowledgement of where and how I can improve myself is in no way acceptance of blame for decisions you have made, and failures that you too now have to take similar ownership of. I acknowledge out relationship, like every relationship, needs work and improvement. But all relationships hit turmoil at some point and any decision you make during that period of turmoil is 100% wholly and entirely on you. No one can be blamed, but you."

maddierthan

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121915640#Comment_121915640

Thank you so much for your reply - it comes at exactly the right time.

I've been thinking about how we can move forward with my husband. He has decided to not talk to me which is making things ridiculously awkward. And I want to talk about this but I don't want to accept the blame for his actions.

Your suggestion makes so much sense to me. I do see the areas that I can improve in, and I do want to work on those, but I do want his acknowledgement that he fecked up massively.

I will use your advice to get things moving hopefully. Your timing is perfect! Thank you!!

Oscar_Madison

For me the “flirting” is a symptom of something not going well within the relationship - whilst it’s difficult right now OP, there’s huge hope here to rescue things before it goes beyond flirting, assuming that it hasn’t already done so.

An honest conversation around how he feels about you and his relationship with you as well as for you to be honest with him, is probably a good first step.

What comes out of that conversation will influence the way forward. I wouldn’t rule out a bit of counselling if both of you were agreeable to it.

RoboRat

My 2 cents. Sounds like he made an absolute arse of himself. He was flirting and after another skinful of drinks, he decided to resurrect the thread of the previous night. Now he feels like an arse and is trying to deflect rather than owning that he was in the wrong. Many people find this easier than self-reflection and hate to admit they are at fault.

I don't think you have any real concerns as you mentioned he always leaves his phone around. This is not the sign of a serial cheater. It also suggests that he doesn't have a secret phone as he would have used that.

I think a frank and honest conversation about why he did this, and if he thought it would go anywhere. Was it because of the attention? When couples are together for a long time, they tend to slip into a habit and lose what brought them together. Perhaps it's as simple as paying more attention to each other or a compliment now and then.

The drinking sounds like a problem though.

Ezeoul

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121915688#Comment_121915688

So now he is punishing you with passive aggressive silence to punish you for pulling him up for his fcuk up?

God bless your patience, OP.

Keep your resolve and remember you didn't do anything wrong here.

RoboRat

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121915705#Comment_121915705

I tend to disagree with this. Some people crave attention... too much attention. They need to be validated and if someone flirts with them, they feel this is validation that they 'still have it'.

Most of the time it stems from a deeper psychological issue that could have nothing to do with the actual relationship - quite possibly it's something from childhood that they hide or may not even know exists, but rears its head when a lot of alcohol is consumed. It's the same reason people are too loud, troll strangers online, etc.

marilynrr

TBH I would massively struggle to get past this.

A few weeks of you being short with him and he felt entitled to seek some excitement elsewhere? Even if it was just flirting it's so disrespectful to you and your marriage.

And even worse again is the fact that you were only that way because he's not pulling his weight at home.

If the same resentments build up are you supposed to just put on a big fake smile and treat him like a God so that he doesn't feel the need to get a thrill elsewhere?

And now he's not talking to you? Is he prone to giving you the silent treatment?

maddierthan

He only ever really does the silent treatment when he knows he's in the wrong, so it fits exactly what Roborat said.

I think it's easier for him to get on his high horse of indignation than actually admit he's done anything wrong.

I'm honestly struggling to get past it but I'm willing to swallow my pride for the sake of the marriage. I'm trying to get some time with him - he's very busy with work (or at least it's giving him an excuse to bury himself in the office).

I've text him to see when he's taking lunch so we can talk but no answer as yet.

Unbeknownst to him I've contacted a relationship counsellor who will hopefully have some availability after Easter. I think we need an outsider to help with communicating because if he keeps giving me the silent treatment, even after he's done wrong, we'll never get anywhere. Suddenly it's all very clear how quickly a relationship can break down irreparably

TheChizler

You're probably not planning to do this but definitely don't spring an appointment with a counsellor on him, both parties need to want counselling for it to be any good. By all means approach it like "I would like to get some couples counselling, I've read good things about so and so". Unless it's just for yourself.

maddierthan

You're absolutely right.

I'm just getting a jump on things and getting the appointment booked so that if he's agreeable we won't have to wait for ages for the appointment. I'll just attend myself otherwise

maddierthan

So we've had a chat. I followed TaxAHcruel's advice and he admitted that his actions were inexcusable. He says it was a moment of madness and that he would never do it again.

He won't attend any work functions until I feel ok with everything. He has also agreed to couples counselling so we can both work on underlying issues.

Then he gave me a big hug.

I feel a million times better. I know we're not perfect and there's work to be done but it seems like we've made a leap forward, even in comparison to where we were before the texting.

Hopefully we'll both do our best and we'll be back on track.

Thanks to everyone for their advice and opinions - it really helped me parse my own thoughts and gave me a way forward

89897

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121918005#Comment_121918005

Im glad you had the change to talk and come to an agreement but I also hope its not just the flirting and texting he sees as wrong.

The blaming you and then silent treatment could have more effects on the relationship that the flirting. He really needs to acknowledge that he was sorely wrong in that regards too.

tommythecat

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121918005#Comment_121918005

That's brilliant to hear. And it was very good advice to avoid a doubling down and not conflating the two issues. Very best of luck in the counselling.

taxAHcruel

I am glad I was able to help - nice to hear some of my random musings do sometimes help out. Well done on the progress, the communication, the patience, and the willingness to work on it and move it all forward. All good things.

Anything I said that was helpful, likely came from the book "Extreme Ownership" by Jokko Willink. So if you are bored and need something to read - there is a nice recommendation for you :)

I am in an extremely complicated relationship myself. So communication is the single most important thing we have to make it all work despite being so weird and unusual. So when I hear of things like "The Silent Treatment" I get antsy. That would never work in our relationship. And we would, thankfully, never do it.

appledrop

OP glad to hear he has finally come to his senses.

Would you consider getting a cleaner. Honest to god its the best thing we ever did.

That doesn't excuse his lack of helping around the house but trust me it will help hugely.

irumsohale

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/2058342100/almost-a-cheater

Well, it sounds like you're dealing with a bit of a puzzler there! Texting "Hi" to a colleague after a work night out does raise some eyebrows, especially when alcohol is involved. While it could be innocent, it's understandable to feel a bit suspicious given the circumstances.

It might be worth having an open and honest conversation with your husband about your concerns. Communication is key in any relationship, and addressing your feelings openly can help clarify any misunderstandings.

Ultimately, trust your gut instincts, but try not to jump to conclusions without gathering more information. Hopefully, it's just a case of harmless drunken antics, but it never hurts to have a heart-to-heart to ensure everyone's on the same page. Best of luck navigating this tricky situation!

Reesy

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121910699#Comment_121910699

Hi @maddierthan , I'd humbly suggest you have a chat with him about the texting incident. As for the other points (drinking, unequal shares of work) I'd suggest another chat later. TBH I'd think couples counselling would help you reinvent your relationship.