How much do solicitors cost for traffic summons?

Any guidance appreciated.

Received a careless driving summons last week. Contacted a solicitor, they quoted 4k to 5k, payment required upfront. Is this a standard price? Should I go with the solicitor or attend without, by myself?

JVince

the scaremongering and utter BS that comes up in in the insurance forum is quite unbelievable.

OP - Ignore 90% of the utter crap written here.

Insurance claim is settled. That is the END of the insurance element. And it is not an admittance of 100% fault - insurance take a financial view and look for the lowest cost result in most cases. 6k personal injury settlement suggests very little if any injury and certainly no long term issue.

You are simply up for careless driving. If there was "bodily harm" (not half made up whiplash - but broken limbs etc) it can be serious and solicitor is essential.

So you need to think was was the cause of the accident and what specific action caused the charge of careless driving. This will dictate what level of legal representation you need. Using mobile phone? Overtaking on unbroken line? Illegal turn? Running a red light? Undertaking? Brake checking?

My guess is its at the lower end of things. Regular court solicitor (as you seem to have done) and €300-€500 cost.

coylemj

If anybody was injured in the incident which lead to the summons, you definitely need a solicitor. But winging it even if there was no injury won't look good. That said, the cops didn't summons you for dangersous driving so it can't be all that bad.

I wouldn't pay that type of money for a court appearance but as far as that solicitor is concerned, he or she could be stuck in the court all day waiting for your case to be called so they're probably factoring in a day's pay for the gig.

One thing you could do is go down to the same court a week (country) or the day (Dublin) before and see if there's any solicitors present who are handling multiple cases. If you can spot one, pull him or her aside when they're not actively defending someone and ask them if they will take your case. It will cost a lot less if they're already going to be there plus they probably know the court staff and, with sufficient notice, may be able to get your case called earlier rather than later. If it's a courthouse outside Dublin, any solicitor on the ground will do and most of them will probably take your case.

Claw Hammer

I agree, legal aid solicitors do not charge as much as other solicitors. Some are happy enough to get as much in cash as they would get from legal aid.

Thank you both. The other driver had a very small claim, their employers car was 8k to repair I think. All settled last year. Solicitor said its to cover 3 court dates for them and the barrister. My nerves are gone as they explained its a criminal conviction that stays on record for 7 years and could impact travel etc. I've 30 years clean driving. Other driver had a camera showing me at fault so I thought it a foregone conclusion but solicitor said until they have that and all other info it could be struck on a technicality. I didn't realise you could turn up at the court house and ask for representation. I didnt want to leave it too late.

peter4918

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121893734#Comment_121893734

A barrister? Is it a district court? Surely any solicitor half decent will manage a careless driving case without the need for a barrister.

Yes it's district court, does that mean a barrister is or isn't required? I'm clueless about this and just found a solicitor online, cost 200 for the consultation.

peter4918

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121893778#Comment_121893778

Is it only careless driving? If so there is no need for a barrister in the district court unless the solicitor is seriously incompetent.

It says "without due care and attention"

Ted222

https://www.citizensinformation.ie/en/justice/civil-law/representation-in-court/#:~:text=The%20solicitor%20prepares%20the%20case,the%20presentation%20of%20the%20case.

A barrister is normally required only in the higher courts. A good and ethical solicitor can represent you in a lower court.

It’s not unusual for solicitors to suggest that a case is of such complexity that if requires the services of a barrister.

This is like saying that your hunger is of such significance that it requires the services of Patrick Guilbaud. Sure you’ll come away full but no less full than if you’d gone to KFC.

Lenar3556

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/2058340702/how-much-do-solicitors-cost-for-traffic-summons

No it’s not.

What part of the country is the case being heard?

Claw Hammer

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121893734#Comment_121893734

If you are dealing with a solicitor who normally doesn't do legal aid, those are the fees they charge. A legal aid solicitor will do it or engage a junior barrister for a much lower fee. If just ring a solicitor at random asking them to do this kind of work. the fees will vary enormously. They are getting a barrister because they don't do that work normally and don't know what to do and they want to be paid by the hour because yours will be the only case they deal with in that court. %k would only be the start of it. If there are adjournments or appeals the bill will shoot up.

coylemj

OP, who suggested that the case would stretch over three days and require the services of a barrister? Was is the online guy who charged you 200?

Driving 'without due care and attention' is covered by Section 52 of the Road Traffic Act and is usually called careless driving. A conviction for which will have no impact on your ability to travel anywhere. Did you get that nonsense from the same source?

Any competent solicitor could handle a case of careless driving. The strategy will be to either contest the prosecution's evidence in an attempt to get a verdict of not guilty or playing down the defendant's culpability ('there but for the grace of God go I') in order to mitigate the fine.

It sounds like there was no personal injury and the other guy's car cost 8K to repair. Without the dashcam, I'd say this would never have made it to court.

Thanks for the replies, I don't know how to tag you. It's Dublin and the solicitors are a leading criminal defence and do traffic regularly, they had good reviews. The 200 consultation was with them and they mentioned the travel, barrister, etc. I thought it was ott but have no clue about these things.

Bass Reeves

I think this solicitor firm saw you coming. I think you should get a list of solicitors and start ringing around and look for a price. If they mention a charge fpor consultation hang up.

AlanG

Go to one of the small solicitors offices around the four courts and they will do a cash representation for you. Bring cash to pay and cash to make a donation in court. If no one was injured and if there is no more to the case than you said then the case is likely to last about two minutes. Quite likely the prosecuting guard wont turn up and it will be thrown out.

Thanks everyone, the court date is in a couple of weeks so I didnt want to leave it too late but will phone around for prices. The only other things I see I didnt mention above is the camera showed the other driver had green, which makes me red, and my car was written off. First time I've ever caused an accident and I made a right bags of it.

AlanG

Another thing, Check your insurance - legal fees may be covered.

Claw Hammer

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121897598#Comment_121897598

The only legal fees covered will be the fees in defending a civil action. The insurance companies will usually want a not guilty plea if there is going to be a civil action. There is no point in ringing around. Go to the District Court dealing with your case and watch the cases being dealt with. You ill soon notice a few solicitors doing all the legal aid work. Approach one of them when they are not busy and discuss it.

dontmindme

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121897574#Comment_121897574

the camera showed the other driver had green

is your car identifiable in the same frame/picture?

Kiwi John

I had a traffic case about 10 years ago.Went to a large solicitors and they said that a local guy did most of the district court cases.

Went to him and he ran through the case told me to turn up on time and ring his fee in cash,150e if i remember right.

on the day there w as a group of solicitors sitting at the front of the public seating ,about 6 of them who were representing most of the cases,my guy seemed to be handling 6 or 7 cases.

coylemj

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121897385#Comment_121897385

'Leading' is the one thing in a description of a product or service that means absolutely nothing. And 'good reviews'? Dear God man, how naive are you? Guess who writes those reviews?

They told you that a careless driving case where there was no personal injury would involve three court hearings and the services of a barrister so I guess you could say they're 'leading' all right, they're up there leading the pack of brass necks.

I'm clearly very naive so am so glad for all the advice here.

I've no idea if the CCTV shows my car as they wouldn't show it to me at the time, and when the open claims closed, I thought it was all behind me. There is a witness statement against me though I was told.

I'll drop down to the court on Tuesday when they're back open to see how it all works and talk to a solicitor that's handling most of the cases and go from there. A few hundred sounds much better indeed.

mrsbeebee

Contact your insurance company as some policies have legal expenses as an add on. If so, they may refer you to a solicitor and cover a certain amount

monseiur

Did your insurance pay for the repairs of the other vehicle ? If yes it would indicate that all concerned are accepting that you were in the wrong. In that case it may be best to plead that way and play on the fact that you have over 30 years driving experience accident free. It will look good in the eyes of the judge if you are represented by a solicitor (don't forget that they're all a one big click)

Talking about barristers etc. is making a mountain out of a molehill. As others have stated find a solicitor that in court on the day (all day) and his fee should be sub €350 cash.

Don't worry about it, no one was injured or killed. It's just a very, very minor issue compared to other more complicated & serious cases the learned judge will hear that day.

I contacted insurance earlier today and they'll call me back next week though op said they'd likely only be concerned for civil matters so will see what they say.

Monsieur, yes they did and that's what I thought and planned to do all along but the solicitor said insurance companies only need 51% to pay out and when they reviewed paperwork it may be possible to defend the case on a technicality, that it's a criminal conviction for 7 years that could impact in many ways as I mentioned above, I could also be disqualifed from driving etc. Based on everyone's input here it's seems that worse case scenario may not be so probable. I'll find a solicitor at the court house and see what they say.

Bass Reeves

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121898506#Comment_121898506

TBH, I think you are trolling

Bass, I'm not sure why you would think that and you're wrong

Thanks for the guidance all. I went to the courts this morning to watch and spoke to one of the solicitors and he quoted a fifth of the other quotation so I will talk to him later.

Also the legal advice company from my insurance company has just phoned and they do provide a criminal defence for these matters free of charge, or I can choose my own solicitor and they'll pay a fixed fee towards it.

I felt much better having seen all the different hearings this morning and how quickly they whizzed through them.

AlanG

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121898506#Comment_121898506

If the CCTV is being used as evidence in a prosecution then it needs to be released under disclosure to the defense. Also you could request it under data protection laws. It seems very strange that it would not be made available to you.

The solicitor explained they request disclosure but there wasn't one involved back then. I've checked back on my notes from the time. Insurance company said they'd let me know if they could share the footage with me when I asked. Im mistaken, the dash cam was the driver behind me and not the other driver. A couple of days later I received the letter saying I was a fault.

coylemj

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121913181#Comment_121913181

Your insurance has already settled with the other guy so I find it strange that they're willing to defend you on the careless driving charge. Because it now makes zero odds to them if you're convicted or not.

Settling the civil side of the matter while charges were pending against you says (according to your insurance company) that you were 100% at fault. Not sure if the prosecution can use that against you if you plead not guilty. Maybe, as this is the legal forum, some of our learned friends could comment on that aspect of the cases.

Yes I don't think they could defend, but rather would represent, for exactly the reasons you've said. The whole thing has been a lesson and one I hope I'll never have to repeat.

Claw Hammer

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121918301#Comment_121918301

The insurance company might say that they believe they will ultimately be found liable. That does not mean they have settled or will settle anytime soon. They may well let the o/p defend the case and see if anything turns up. Insurance companies often have someone at an inquest to note anything which might help in dealing with a claim. Sometimes the claiming driver is caught out in a lie.

cml387

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121918301#Comment_121918301

Some years ago I remember getting insurance and an additional (apparently at no extra cost!) policy which would cover personal legal costs.

That may be the case here.

coylemj

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121918844#Comment_121918844

The OP's insurance has settled, it's a done deal. I stated that in the post you quoted. See post #3 - 'all settled last year'.

So the outcome of the careless driving case will have no bearing on the issue of civil liability, that has already been conceded. Because even if he is found not guilty, that doesn't mean the other guy was at fault and the insurance can attempt to claw their money back, it simply means that the Gardai failed to prove their case beyond a reasonable doubt. But the bar for civil liability is much lower and the OP's insurance have probably seen the dashcam video and thrown in the towel.

Claw Hammer

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121922810#Comment_121922810

It is still open to the other driver to make a personal injury claim. the insurance will not want a guilty plea in case that happens.

coylemj

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121922908#Comment_121922908

Is it the practice for an insurance company to settle with a specific party for material damage while leaving the option open for the same person to later lodge a personal injury claim?

I thought they only paid out if the party agreed to accept the payment as a 'full and final' settlement. What you're suggesting is that a motorist could be compensated for the damage to his car but he would be free to lodge a whiplash or similar claim a year later?

Hi, the other driver made a personal injury claim last year and it was settled for 6k. (in addition to car fix of 8k) Are you saying there could be another personal injury claim, I would have thought that wasn't possible?

Appreciate that!

beachhead

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121897451#Comment_121897451

Advice here. Best outcome is the guard doesn't turn up but still pay the solr. E4-5k a rip off

peter4918

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121936826#Comment_121936826

At this stage now you are dragging the a**e out of it. Just get a solicitor to represent you. They will seek disclosure the next time it’s up in court and you will know exactly what is in the careless driving charge against you (i.e the evidence) and your solicitor can advise from there. Simple as that.

halfpastneverr

If this is in Dublin, go to Court 8 in the CCJ (the summons court that deals with most non drink drive road traffic offences) and see what solicitors are handling the majority of cases. There would be 3 or 4 who have the court sewn up, are there every day & know all the traffic guards and court staff and the personalities and pet hates of the Judge's that sit there. When the court rises, pull one of those solicitors aside and explain your situation. Unless you have a high income and have minimum outgoings like no children and no mortgage or rent, you will very likely be covered by legal aid. The solicitor would explain this to you as well.

Ringing around solicitors is no use, as many of them would cover regular district court cases alright, but plenty wouldn't be too familiar with road traffic stuff. The firm that's on about 3x court appearances and barrister sounds like one of them.

@peter4918

@peter4918 hardly, I'm responding if someone asks me something, is that not the norm here? I already have if you read my post from last week.

Tks, that's what I've done.