Wiring & Switch for an attic space light

Asdfgh2020

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121873594#Comment_121873594

won’t be happening…..too many reasons to be up and down into attic/artic ( as it’s so old up there)……have a fairly large one so it’s just so convenient for lobbing stuff up into😀

timmyntc

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121873566#Comment_121873566

No it's fine.

Most confusing part is sharing a live between switches, and that part will be there in your new arrangement regardless, unless you decide to rewire all your lights and switches.

Asdfgh2020

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121873678#Comment_121873678

One last comment about electrical works in domestic houses and in particular the ‘routing’ of cables……it’s like they (electricians) just pick the shortest route and throw cable over/ around joists and rafters and trusses with no thought that the attic space might one day be converted or floored…?

timmyntc

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121873786#Comment_121873786

Yes there was never any forward thinking in the past.

If flooring your attic you'll have to lay timbers across joists anyways, so for some of these you'll have to make cuts to accommodate existing cables. That's the reality of it, it's too much work to redo everything perfect so you inevitably have to compromise your work to facilitate someone elses shoddy job.

Either that or you spend way more time and money

tomhammer..

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121874238#Comment_121874238

It's been a regulation for a long time that attic cable wiring is tidy

Shoog

Funny wiring in switches, or even fairly simple two or three way wiring in switches can be a real head scratcher to work out. I just try to keep it simple and logical.

tomhammer..

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121874271#Comment_121874271

There's 3 methods that have been in general use for domestic work

The 3-plate ,singles method and looped t+e at switches

Plenty more methods outside of that esp. in industry and commercial

Claw Hammer

My solution to this is to put the switch into the ceiling beside the trap door with an led lit switch. That way I can see, without opening the trap door, if the light is on or not in the attic. I will only be turning on the light if going into the attic so no point in having a long switch run half way down the wall outside. No point in putting the switch into the attic since it will be dark when the attic is opened and it is no possible to see if the light is on without opening the trap door.

monseiur

Another solution I've seen at a friends house at the weekend - he put a small red bulb (the type you see in Sacred Heart type lights) in the corner of the kitchen ceiling. This is wired into the same switch as attic light so both are on/off at the same time. So if he forgets to switch off the light in attic he or someone will spot the tell tale red light on in kitchen. House is a bungalow so it was an easy fit.

tomhammer..

If you're accessing the attic a lot a light switch in the landing area with neon is probably simple as any

The red bulb and mechanical switches is overthinking it

Trapeze

Many years ago I wired the feed for my pull switch in the attic from the light in a children's bedroom. That way if I forgot to turn off the attic light it would only be on when the bedroom light was on.

tomhammer..

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121882020#Comment_121882020

Another over complicated method of wiring an attic light

Sure ya risking a blackout up there if someone turns off bedroom light

timmyntc

With a modern LED bulb it'll cost you no more than 20eur a year if you left the attic light on that long.

Not worth putting in such complicated solutions.

If you really want to save energy, just make sure to double check that there are no lights on in attic before you close the hatch, like a checklist every time you shut it.

tomhammer..

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121882210#Comment_121882210

All nonsense solutions it has to be said

Shoog

Neon switch seems the most elegant solution to me. Put it next to the hatch out of the way. Job done. You won't leave it on by mistake for more than a day.

Simple.

tomhammer..

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121882241#Comment_121882241

Correct

Sure the other solutions sensor and secondary switch are creating the risk you're trying to mitigate against

Namely the light being on and going un noticed

Shoog

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121882269#Comment_121882269

Also they run the significant risk of going out leaving you stranded in the dark.

tomhammer..

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121882277#Comment_121882277

Both have risk of light staying on for sensor or going on and /off for secondary switch

Also a hazard of light going off

A sacred heart lamp is just overkill also

Has to be said for correctness

Bruthal.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121848373#Comment_121848373

I'd say if you were around when electrical lights appeared, you'd be saying "are people too lazy to light candles now"

tomhammer..

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121884298#Comment_121884298

Ya hear different opinions from inspectors and they're not always right unfortunately unless they're just quoting rules

Way back my first inspector said anyone putting neutrals in switches should be shot. Next one said loop t+e to switch

It turned out to be an improved method for domestic lighting

The 3-plate lighting method and ring final socket circuit shouldn't be used for domestic work as they create unnecessary hazards in domestic

Bruthal.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121887303#Comment_121887303

Yea I prefer the neutrals available at switches. Never liked ring mains at all.

Asdfgh2020

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121861302#Comment_121861302

just one last post on this. I finally completed the job as per the above and ăll worked out. I ended up putting three lights/roses in, connected in series ( not sure if this is the correct term ) as it’s a fairly big space and all worked out perfectly……no more need for the miner’s light or flash lamps etc….now all I need to do is add more insulation, move a couple of water tanks and start flooring……!

Regarding the absolute thoughtless approach that the previous ‘spark’ put in to the routing of cables in the attic space ie above, over, around, between joists etc what is best way to re-route some of these in advance of adding flooring…….is cutting and re-splicing cables with connectors a major no? Is it best to just cut notches out of the top of the joists to recess the cables into and avoid any cutting and re-connecting…?

meercat

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121982466#Comment_121982466

don’t cut the joists(or cables for that matter)

If you have the height then cross batten them with 2X1. You’ll loose an inch and gain more stability too