EV Charging with no driveway

berrecka

Hi there. I am looking at getting an EV. My current car has been written off so am looking to do so fairly sharpish. But we are not at all set up for it. We are looking at getting something small and on the cheaper end of the market like a BYD Dolphin (anyone any ideas on the waiting times for these?), or possibly a 2020ish 2nd hand. We drive very little, tbh, its really just to bring kids to their various clubs etc around the city but we all walk or cycle to work/school, dont even get into the car most days.

But we live in a quiet cul-de-sac with no off street parking - no driveways (parking isn't a problem. there's always space outside each house). There is a yard area between the front wall of the house that is about 1m wide, then a small boundary wall and a footpath, between the house and where the car is parked. What are the work-arounds for this? Will it be possible for us to get a charger?

Thanks in advance. Total newbie to EVs, and need to make a decision

anewme

If you dont have an allocated parking space, it will be a challenge. If you have an allocated parking space, you can install a stand alone Charger on a pedestal in your own space.

You cant install a charger on a public road / footpath. You cant drag the charging wire across public space either.

Buddy Bubs

Throwing cable from the house across footpath is not a possibility really just in case you're thinking of that.

How many KMs do you do a week? You'll be charging every 200 to 300 KMs really, so depends on how often that is.

If there's a fast charger near you that could charge you in 30 mins or so once a week and you don't mind waiting around, you're a possible case for an EV if you really want one but I'd still advise against it. At the moment public charging is as expensive as petrol or diesel. Small mileage you won't save much charging at home either.

And then there's your take on environmental issues EV v ICE, if that's a factor.

If you can't charge at home and don't spend much on petrol at the moment I'd say don't buy an EV

Firblog

Something like this Charge Arm | EV Charging Stations Ireland might be a work around?

Del2005

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121810280#Comment_121810280

I've seen them in a few places. Risky for when someone walks into them, it's a cable hanging onto a street so a good chance of being sued, and IIRC it'd still need Planning permission as it's going across a public footpath. Even a pedestal at the side of the road is risky with people tripping over the cable, people have sued councils for tripping on uneven footpaths. Unless you have off street parking it's not viable to charge an EV at home.

...Ghost...

Hi OP.

I'm in disagreement with the above comments for the most part. Of course, it would be silly and dangerous to just run a cable along the footpath, but there are simple solutions. Let's start with the charging issue.

So, you live in a cul-de-sac with no off-street parking, but parking is no issue, so that's not so bad. If you are able to park outside your own house, it's truly a non issue, especially as you can install a charge point inside your own 1m garden. The simple solution to charging is to run a cable cover along the pathway where (depending on the design profile) the cable either goes under the cover, or it slots into it from above. The image below is of a larger style, but much neater ones are available. Easy to see and pedestrian safe....especially in a cul-de-sac where there would be small numbers of pedestrians passing by.

Here is the type with the above cable sleeve. Very slim and neat. Perfect for buggies and wheels chairs to go right over.

Link https://www.d-line-it.com/ultracablecover/

Now, onto the car.

You don't say what your previous car was, but you do mention you were looking at a BYD dolphin. Do you want to buy new, or would you buy used, as you don't use the car much, so don't seem to need a lot of range.

If going used, the like of a 40kWh Leaf will serve you well and can be got from about €13k to 22k for a good example car between 2018 and 2022. These are considered to be quite family friendly and are very reliable. The new shape model (2018+) uses the modern type 2 AC charger that all other modern EVs use, but the fast DC charger (the ones you see at motorway service stations) is a CHAdeMO socket, so not as common and not the type the EU have as their standard. There is an adapter for about €1500 that lets you use both CHAdeMO and CSS type DC chargers though.

If going new, then you need to simply pick a car you like, at the right price point which is available. Again, the Nissan Leaf is available right away new from about €28k for the base model to €35k for the Tekna (SVE) spec, which is what I would buy if going Leaf. I don't know what other cars are immediately available around that price range...maybe MG ZE, or VW ID.3 are ready to go.

Del2005

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121811393#Comment_121811393

If a shop or company had cables running like that inside their premises they'd be shut down for safety violations, yet people think it's OK to do this on a public street. People can easily catch the cable hanging down

Gumbo

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121811393#Comment_121811393

While all those “help” mitigate the risk. You’re still liable if I fall or my child uses your charge arm as a pull up bar to practice his bar muscle ups.

...Ghost...

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121811882#Comment_121811882

Shops and companies are targets for chancers looking for a few bob. It's a lot harder getting a few hundred grand when you graze your knee after tripping over a half centimeter slope draped across the footpath in a cul-de-sac. Councils and OMCs don't exactly make it easy, sometimes make it impossible for people to install a home charging solution.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121811947#Comment_121811947

That's really all we can do is help mitigate against the risk. If you are lucky enough to be allowed install a kerbside pedestal outside your property, you are still liable if some numpty (saving for the blind) walks into it and gets injured. I'd only use the wider ones with the gentle slope which have minimal height just enough to cover the cable. I wouldn't use one of those overhead ones at all unless it was in an underground car park.

zg3409

I recommend an old petrol car. Too much hassle and claims risk going to EV. Depreciation on a new EV will be massive even if never driven.

HorseSea

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121811393#Comment_121811393

"Perfect for buggies and wheels chairs to go right over."

Have you tried pushing wheelchairs over these? If these were to become common they would be a huge issues for wheelchair users and for anyone pushing a wheelchair, not a suitable solution at all.

...Ghost...

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121812765#Comment_121812765

Yes. I have pushed a buggy over one several dozen times. Someone in a neighbouring estate on my route to the park uses one. I would suggest that anyone having difficulty getting over sloped cover of around 2cm over a 12cm distance shouldn't be outside at all, as there are actual dangers on the footpaths like raised lips between joints, indented shores and the lowered kerbs for pedestrians crossing the road which are far more dangerous than a cable cover.

The hyperbole in this thread from some is ridiculous.

Here's one almost identical to the one I see a few times per month. I've seen buggies, kids on scooterss, rollerblades and I have even seen a manual wheelchair user go over another one outside a take away which was a bit more chunky than this one....and shocker, it was a non issue.

Do you have an alternative suggestion? Some folk have issues with cars in general, so if you are one of those, I won't hold my breath.

Sonic the Shaghog

It's very simple, will the house insurance cover the OP if someone manages to trip and sue? Will the council cover it if the insurance won't? If no to both then the OP needs to stay away from it. This is a limitation that's been brought up to various governments worldwide with their electric car push.

By the looks of it the OP would be better served getting a little 2nd hand 1 litre petrol. A Yaris/Aygo or maybe Hyundai is it the i10? Would suit their situation at present.

I wouldn't like to be trying to rely on a mix of work/public charging in this scenario either. All it takes is for your company to decide free Charing is no longer available, or you could leave the job and end up somewhere with expensive/no work charging and you are up **** creek flailing trying to get public chargers.

In fact seeing as you seem to use the car so little anyways you'd nearly have less of an environmental impact with an older smaller petrol anyways if that's also a big concern.

Gumbo

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121812628#Comment_121812628

Generally, the kerb side pedestal is installed in management company estates and not council owned estates which helps remove the risk from the home owner indirectly

It is something that needs to be legislated for though. There are 1000’s of people with on street parking that would swap given the chance.

RurtBeynolds

Why even bother with all this hassle for a car you're rarely even gonna drive. Just get an ICE car.

...Ghost...

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121813127#Comment_121813127

Totally agree with first paragraph. Good idea to check if covered.

The rest about a small petrol car, not so much. We don't know the category of car the OP wants, so recommending an i10, or yaris is probably completely not what the OP wants, as they could be coming from a Santa Fe with oodles of space for all we know.

No mention of environmental concerns from the OP, just that they don't use the car very much.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121813157#Comment_121813157

I've come across a small number of kerbside ped chargers in council estates in North county Dublin when I was in residential sales and when the Leaf and the Zoe were the only game in town. Have seen more in managed estates though.

There definitely need to be regs put in, but maybe the only way this will happen this century is for people to start getting them installed anyway. Look at electric scooters as an example. Had people not used them in large numbers, we would never have seen any legislation for them, because Ireland is painfully slow at these things. We will probably see a a human/animal marriage referendum before we see any push on home charging for people with no off-street parking.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121813171#Comment_121813171

Because more and more people don't want to drive an ICE car and want to switch to an EV. If a little hurdle stopped us from the start, we would never achieve anything or get anything done. The OP is just asking questions.

elperello

In marinas and harbours it's common to see cables bringing shore power to boats.

Presumably the owners of these places have insurance in place as they are providing the power points.

Some of the harbours are open to the public.

_H80_GHT

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121813061#Comment_121813061

Now that's talking a bit of sense.

mfceiling

I wouldn't bother OP. I've a model 3 and I live around 12 - 15 minutes from the Sandyford charger. It's very busy and I find myself having to go later at night so as not to queue.

The nearest ESB fast charger is kimmage SuperValu and that's expensive and nearly always in use, mostly by taxis.

There is an ESB 22kw charger in Rathmines but that is also expensive and you also have to pay for your parking so double whammy.

There is no provision for any roll out of AC chargers so people with no driveways are basically screwed going forward. Banks of fast chargers are great but if you live a 5 minutes away your battery will be cold when you arrive for a charge. This means you will get a low charging speed and will have to stay longer to get charged. That will be the same for everyone who live close by, so there will be queues to charge.

I'd echo others here and just buy a small engine petrol car to save the hassle of looking for an unoccupied charger.

Casati

Running a cable across a public pavement is seeing you create a hazard. You are not mitigating risk, you’re creating one even using a rubber cable tray or extending arm. The public if they have a legitimate claim can as easily take it against you personally as they can any shop or business.

Can you charge in work? If you can’t charge at home then avoid EV’s

andekwarhola

In a similar situation to you OP. Can charge at work but not there every day and there's a reasonable amount of public chargers nearby.

Maybe a PHEV instead of an ICE or EV?

Buddy Bubs

I've no home charger but have 2 EVs. However, I have full time access to 3 x 11kw chargers in work where I spend 8 hrs most days. If I didn't have it, I would have gotten rid of my 1st EV never mind bought a 2nd. When we had 1 charger I was stuck one day and went out to a fast charger on my lunch and charged, which isn't really a long term solution it was a waste of my time and expensive.

There will ultimately be approx 8 EVs using these 3 chargers which should be enough. Very open to installing more if needed for company cars

elperello

A possible solution in the medium to long term would be for a standard to be developed for residential kerbside charge points.

Planning Permission applied for and granted subject to compliance with the standard.

Insurance for the part of the installation that is on public property could be arranged through IPB.

https://ipb.ie/

NIMAN

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121812765#Comment_121812765

Agree.

These would be a definite no-no in this country.

You wouldn't have it installed a week before some person took a 'tumble' over it and you'd have a claim in against you.

Not worth the hassle.

hhmmm?

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121813171#Comment_121813171

I've got a sega but want to play mario because everyone is talking about him

...Ghost...

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121814825#Comment_121814825

The one I walk over infrequently has been there since before covid kicked off. The owner probably hasn't been sued yet despite it being a busy pathway leading to a large community park. I'll take a couple of snaps next time I see it. It's not an ideal solution, but covered or not, it's certainly safer than a kerbside ped which people are more likely to walk into than trip over a low height cable cover, owing the the black colour of the ped on a dark evening. I'd go for the pedestal if given the option, but it's not a safer one.

Anyway, the OP has the info now and can make a decision that suits best.

Ezeoul

Imagine if every house had these cables running across the footpath?

Not so wheelchair friendly then, if its every couple of metres, and definitely not visually impaired friendly.

I've nothing against EV's, considered getting one myself but was advised (after a long discussion with some very knowlegeable EV owners on this forum) that with my particular circumstances and low annual mileage it wouldn't be worth it.

I think that unless you have your own driveway, or have access to chargers at work, your option is to use public chargers if you want to go EV.

I think running a cable across the public footpath is a big no-no.

o1s1n

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121815090#Comment_121815090

That's the thing, when you think of cables running across paths you have to imagine a scenario where every house has this setup.

We live in a fairly densely populated spot in the city centre with doors that open to the footpath. There's on street parking outside every house. It would look absolutely ridiculous and be a huge eyesore if we all had shielded cables running across the path. As you said, would be a hassle for someone on wheels to traverse.

It's a simple fix though. All you'd need is a small trough cut into the path, a cable laid and then the trough refilled for each house. Curbside charging port available to each house then. I really hope that's how it'll all end up down the line.

Ezeoul

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121815126#Comment_121815126

It's a simple fix though. All you'd need is a small trough cut into the path, a cable laid and then the trough refilled for each house. Curbside charging port available to each house then. I really hope that's how it'll all end up down the line.

In fairness, that sounds like a much better idea than some sort of cable cover. If it ever came about.

creedp

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121815145#Comment_121815145

The issue I see with that set up is that you don't own the space outside your house and anyone can park there. Imagine the pain the ass of arriving home with empty battery and regularly finding someone parked outside your door.

Ezeoul

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121815252#Comment_121815252

True.

Or your port is damaged because someone parked a little too tight to the kerb with their tyres when parking.

...Ghost...

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121815126#Comment_121815126

The trough idea is fine if you can get permission to cut into the pathway. We have seen on here many a time where EV owners or those wanting to go EV are ignored or refused by the OMC to install a charge point solution, be it pedestal, or gutter. The council are no better.

It's worth a try of course. Here are a couple of examples.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zOLFtEzg1lc&ab_channel=ColinTownend

Buddy Bubs

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121815437#Comment_121815437

Some nice installations there, once you can park your car where you want to it would work well. And permissions of course as you stated.

With OMCs once the board realise their house value could increase with EV charging capabilities some solutions will materialise

berrecka

Thanks everyone for the suggestions and input. I think we have come to the same conclusion as most here, and having visited a few garages over the weekend, have decided that we are not in a position to go for an EV just yet. Hopefully down the road between community chargers and other safe kerbside personal solutions and improved network, as well as hopefully a drop in price of the things in general, our next car may well be a full electric. We will invest in a 2nd hand self charge hybrid for now. If it lasts as long as our last car did, we will probably be on hoverboards for the next purchase!

josip

I'd be with Ghost on this one. Although you would be possibly liable in case anyone tried to make a claim against you, the key point for me is that you said you live in a quiet cul de sac. You probably know nearly everyone passing by your house. Have a word with your downstream neighbours and discuss whatever solution you planned with them in advance.

TaurenDruid

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121811882#Comment_121811882

And yet shops and companies and offices have things like power-washing services and drain cleaners and similar, all the time, and manage perfectly well for the couple of hours they're in use with cable runners and hose covers and even just cones, without people tripping or suing. (Source: I work in a city.)

ELM327

Always easier to ask forgiveness than permission too.

Steveraf

Is it constantly busy? Say 8am Sunday morning for example? Tesla really need to step up and have at least one more station in Dublin.