John Bruton RIP

gormdubhgorm

Here is John Bruton quietly and respectfully holding his own in a from the "Century Ireland" - Youtube channel broadcast in 2014 Primetime near the time of the Scottish Independence Referendum.

The debate was on Irish Home Rule. He even managed to knock a smile out of the normally taciturn Eamon O'Cuiv and Michael McDowell.

https://youtu.be/h8iVuX6Ec2A?si=UjEofBQtg0He8VJo&t=579

Opposing politicians clearly respect Bruton as politician and listened when he spoke, even though they may not have agreed with him.

keeponhurling

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121730406#Comment_121730406

Oh come on, they smiled because he was living in an alternative fantasy world.

Even the presenter was getting fed up of him in the end

deirdremf

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121730406#Comment_121730406

Isn't it absolutely wonderful that people on a discussion programme will listen to one another, though? Where would you get it but in Ireland!

monseiur

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121728792#Comment_121728792

He would have died even happier if Charles had become king of England, Ireland and British dominions beyond the seas🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣 (title of George VI)

L1011

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121728486#Comment_121728486

of latter-day Conor Cruise O'Brien maybe - Cruiser was a TD and Minister decades before he became a Unionist commentator!

The time between the Downing Street Declaration and the GFA was critical, and that happened under his leadership - albeit Spring in Foreign Affairs was probably more important. If things hadn't been advanced in those three years, there would have been no GFA in 1998, it would have taken years more.

Decommissioning, essential to the GFA, started under the Rainbow (and Major, for that matter) governments.

batman75

Just watched the RTE special on the passing of John Bruton. They really lack anybody of gravitas in house to put Bruton's legacy in historical context. Troubled by Alan Dukes's appearance. He doesn't look well. Came across well and hopefully he is not ill. He was the first FG leader I remember growing up.

Oscar_Madison

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121731015#Comment_121731015

Born with a fag in his mouth was Alan- indeed I wish him well too.

I guess all the “greats” or “notorious” are all but gone at this stage. Bruton was a relatively young leader - the people that worked along side him and across from him in the Dail were much older - so very few contemporaries from that era left - he’s outlived them all albeit at a young age of 76

nacho libre

He seemed a thoroughly decent guy.

It's a bit funny Bertie saluting his integrity and decency. I wasn't aware he had that view of the 1916 rising. Hindsight is a great general any way. I wouldn't have agreed with some of his politics, but I get the impression he put the country first in so much as it is possible to do so. I respect him for that. Goodbye John Bruton.

theguzman

John Bruton, traditional old conservative Fine Gael before they got hijacked by the leftwing. A nice man, good politician and had the best interests of Ireland at heart, a patriot. The same cannot be said for Marxist Fine Gael today however.

monseiur

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121729094#Comment_121729094

One man's terrorist is another man's freedom fighter. It takes an unselfish man with a spine of steel, with morals, with a sense of justice to put his life on the line, go into the trenches and fight for his people's rights and when the time comes become a statesman and fight his corner around the ''political'' table. Think the Good Friday Agreement etc.

On the other hand spineless men eunuchs with long tongues become obedient arse lickers. Gerry was well able to separate the wheat from the chaff....his life and that of his colleagues depended on it.

deirdremf

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121731015#Comment_121731015

A special on the day of his death? isn't that a little precipitate or was it a review of his legacy on the news, which hopefully didn'tleave the presenter with brown on their nose.

I'd expect the hagiography to be aired fairly soon nonetheless.

NewbridgeIR

Didn't agree with him on a number of issues. But a solid politician in the early days, good leader and on a personal level, affable and genuine.

May he rest in peace.

I thought this was pretty nasty from Social Democrat stand-in councillor and general Angry Man Karl Stanley.

deirdremf

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121731299#Comment_121731299

Most politicians are affable on a personal level, it goes with the territory and gets them votes.

It has nothing to do their politics or with whether they care about you, their constituents or the country.

On the death of a politician, if you hear commentators talking about what a nice guy they were, or how many babies they kissed, you can be sure that the pol did nothing of value during their career, or even left things worse than they found them.

silliussoddius

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121731299#Comment_121731299

Maybe Karl would like to die on a trolley.

Oscar_Madison

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121731015#Comment_121731015

Reminds me of a scratch Saturday sketch from early 90s

Michael Noonan talking to John Bruton on leadership:

Alan wouldn’t kiss the babies and the babies don’t want to kiss you 😀

Kermit.de.frog

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121730288#Comment_121730288

Leadership is more about doing what is not popular but is in the national interest. A rare thing in Irish politics.

Unfortunately the voters wanted populism so they kicked responsible government out in 1997 and put in Fianna Fáil.

And look how many lives populism eventually destroyed in 2010. All the lives destroyed to this day.

There is a lesson here too for those thinking of voting Sinn Féin. When you vote against stability in favour of populism the price comes due inevitably.

"You can only spend other people's money until it runs out"

10000maniacs

delete

Beechwoodspark

John Bruton head and shoulders above all the current shower of party leaders.

A decent man with solid convictions and a formidable intellect. RIP.

kk.man

John Bruton was a decent politician with great ideas. A self confessed Redmonitte which must not be many around. This view I have no doubt helped build trust with the Unionists. He was not a Unionists like some have suggested here but he had sympathy with their values and beliefs. Anyone who thinks we will still have the tri colour and the nation anthem etc in a united Ireland is living in dream land. I also hope that's not around the corner either. It will be then the legacy of John Bruton will be fully understood.

He was a decent and honest politician RIP.

10000maniacs

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121733202#Comment_121733202

So it's "Irelands Call" for the National Anthem. 😀

I think in any United Ireland, the tricolour and anthem will remain.

90% of the population will insist on it.

When partition happened in 1921, there was still a huge population of Unionists in the South of Ireland. Mostly in Leinster. They were insisting on similar things then, but never got them. The Majority decided then and will decide again when there is a United Ireland.

walshb

Straight-shooter and very principled. Caring man!

nacho libre

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121731887#Comment_121731887

But this is slightly misleading as prior to the crash I didn't hear many of the opposition shouting stop or calling for prudence. If Fianna Fowl had put the national interest first what would the response of the public and opposition have been to such prudence.

Packrat

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121733715#Comment_121733715

There are any amount of books and studies by people who have spent years studying possible UI scenarios. Pretty much NONE of them think we'll still have the tri-colour or Amhrán Na Bfhiann. You're dead wrong if you think we will.

BTW- I personally will miss both but I accept the reality that they would have to change in order for the bigger more important change to happen.

Bass Reeves

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121734092#Comment_121734092

The Tricolour may remain itbis green white and oranges.Amhrán Na Bfhiann no. The 12th will have to be a bank holiday probable

,

10000maniacs

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121734422#Comment_121734422

There will be a huge percentage of the population who will revolt if the National Anthem is taken away.

Hotblack Desiato

The flag is a much larger sticking point tbh.

Most people don't even know the words of the anthem and let's face it, as a tune it's pretty dire

Handing over the tricolour to become the badge of hardline republicanism once again would be a huge mistake.

Oscar_Madison

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121737286#Comment_121737286

Hand needs to be on the Orange part- can we have a leprechaun, a pint of Guinness and a pack of tayto on the green part? 🤪

silliussoddius

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121737286#Comment_121737286

Would the Dal Cais be happy with the Red Hand?