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Calf to beef thread

14546474951

Comments

  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,416 ✭✭✭jfh


    thanks dmakc, for the updated costs, i got those referenced cost a while back.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 21,013 ✭✭✭✭Bass Reeves


    If you are going for the grant check tge reference cost if the ref cost is high enough the 700 is less than 500 before tax.

    TBH if I was rearing calves I would probably bite the bullet and go that direction or something similar.

    Evennif you want to go away for a coupke of days any decent young lad will check them for you and top it up. Any event that is on you can work the calves around it.

    Even.if you only use it for tge first 3-4 weeks after buying you can watch feed them once a day afterwards

    Slava Ukrainii



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,232 ✭✭✭minerleague


    Sucklers here, widened crush for heavy incalf cows ( tb testing every 4 months for a while ) Was thinking like you of something to narrow full crush but thinking now of short narrow crush just for calves with entry to both close together and sliding gate to deflect cows one way and calves other way



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,197 ✭✭✭mr.stonewall


    Worthwhile to eliminate an potential issue and check over the pumps and heating element. Prefer to prevent problems

    Service is cheaper to do now as they are quiet compared to Jan Feb. Thinking of the top of the head was about 300 ish, but must double check



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,197 ✭✭✭mr.stonewall


    Once a person can pour powder into the hopper and use boards, they are capable of doing the daily checks if you were stuck and calves settled on the feeder

    When calves are on it, makes sense to keep them on it for the weaning. It's hard for a few days breaking calves link to the teat feeder, bit I don't know why you would considering back to one after a bit of time on an auto feeder.



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,743 ✭✭✭weatherbyfoxer


    Hard see the justification for a feeder if rearing under 100 calves to be honest..using a jfc milk cart here with a built-in mixer and a gas water heater that cost less than 200 euro for feeding 80 at a time and no problem time wise.

    What are lads budgeting for buying calves themselves this year?.€500-€600 each?



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 884 ✭✭✭lmk123




  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 125 ✭✭bt12


    I bought a s/h Jfc cart last year with pump and mixer, u will get as lads are fitting automated machines just keep an eye out, there are a great machine it’s mixed perfectly and the pump with meter is super, I’m working full time so need something fast and to do it right, only rearing 30 so hard justify the automatic feeder



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,743 ✭✭✭weatherbyfoxer


    No just mixer,have to cross an uneven yard from on shed to the other when feeding so was trying to keep the weight down



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,636 ✭✭✭tractorporn


    I'm only doing 70 a year at the min but it was the labour saving that pushed me over to the feeder. I wouldn't have stayed rearing calves without it and I have spare capacity if I get the chance to up numbers.

    I gave 450 for Angus calves last weekend, I was hoping not to go over 500 but that doesn't look likely now I reckon I'll have to go to 600 to get them.



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,743 ✭✭✭weatherbyfoxer


    What price will you have to get for them at the end of the line to make a worthwhile margin?.At €600 per 3 week old calf my costings so far will mean a sale price of well over €2200 is needed before the animal is 24 months old.For the calves i rear the average carcass weight is 280kg sub 24 months.so id be needing €7.85 factory paid price to get the €2200



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,636 ✭✭✭tractorporn


    If the price holds should come into 2600/2700 coming out of the shed at 28/29 months. Have autumn calves ready to go into the sheds in the next few months at two years of age, will put them on red clover and meal from Christmas on and kill them out of the shed. Look I need the price to hold but also I need to keep the numbers coming through, if the price for suck calves keeping going I will start buying weaned calves for a bit more and save the cost of rearing, powder, alfalfa, time, labour etc. TBH at over 600 be better off to give 200 more for the weaned calf I reckon, just the date of birth of the weaned calves wouldn't suit the system as well as calves born now.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,451 ✭✭✭limo_100


    its most important to keep the numbers up a lot people where nervous last year and they didn't but enough now they can't get there numbers back up without a massive cost. id rather keep my numbers up even if I had to take a small hit so be it. calves will always grow into money anyway



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,743 ✭✭✭weatherbyfoxer


    Most calf to beef men I talk to will buy calves regardless of how dear the get it seems.."sheds have to be filled".



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,451 ✭✭✭limo_100


    the most important thing in a business is to turn over regardless of profit turnover keeps it going in farming you need stock to do this. tbh cattle bought dear this year might be cheap next year if beef hits 9/kg I always try to look at it with a glass half full kind of way and be optimistic.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,636 ✭✭✭tractorporn


    Look I see where they are coming from but you need to be clever with it too. Imo there is no point in buying suck calves at 750/800 and spending another 3/400 getting them past weaned when you can get already weaned calves with the majority of the work done for a couple of hundred more. You run a tight ship and I get what you're saying about margin but people told me I was mad paying 250 for calves this time last year and it turned out to be a good decision. Unfortunately there's a good element of gambling when it comes to buying cattle.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 21,013 ✭✭✭✭Bass Reeves


    I disagree turnover is vanity,profit is sanity.

    If replacements are too expensive you let them off. Now calf to beef or summer grazing have the disadvantage of sometimes have to work off a projected profit as your sales in summer grazing are 6-8 months away and in calf to beef the next time you are selling may be 3-9 months away.

    Autumn born calves are always more expensive than spring born due to less numbers and the advantage of two full grazing seasons. The cost if rearing a calf to 6 months is little different indoors or outdoors. However a 6 month plus calf going to grass in Feb/March is a serious animal coming back.into the shed at 14ish months. At 36 months if fairly well done he can eith be finished at thst age off grass or finished and slaughtered Jan/Feb in what is usually a price peak time.

    Slava Ukrainii



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 2,751 ✭✭✭DBK1


    The other side of that is there’s no point selling or killing all your stock at good prices this year, buying no replacements because they seem too expensive and then giving half your income from what you sold to the tax man. What you buy today you could add 20 or 30% to their value by year end and relative to last years stock figure if you’ve the same numbers at year end this year there should be a decent stock relief to be claimed. Money sitting in the bank in the hope replacements will be €50 or €100 a head cheaper next spring won’t be much good if half the money is gone to revenue by then.

    As @limo_100 said above too, what’s been bought today at seemingly mad prices could look cheap next spring or summer.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,743 ✭✭✭weatherbyfoxer


    Id agree with bass,..not suggesting buying no stock but Im not sure the 600 euro angus calf is profitable animal.For example there is plenty of 400kg angus stores about at the minute for €1600.They should hit grass next march/april at 500-550kg..i think it is a safer bet then a reared calf costing around €1000 hitting the grass in may/june which has a much longer risk period that the store



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 2,751 ✭✭✭DBK1


    I would agree with that too, no way would I give €600 for a suck calf, I’d definitely be going with the 400kg at €1,600 instead.



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,416 ✭✭✭jfh


    That's the best value at the moment, Store heifers could be picked up easily enough last Saturday in smb.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,451 ✭✭✭limo_100


    I don't think them stores will stay at 1600 for long cattle have started to rise towards the end of the week farming indoors say 33cent lift in the mart then 1600 stores could have little change out 2k in a few weeks. its a hard situation to be in either way. Im lucky I have sucklers as well and have good weanlings to help the calf to beef



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 21,013 ✭✭✭✭Bass Reeves


    While I agree that ideally you have to replace you have to have a price point. If that means spreading your buying over a longer period adapting your system then you do that. However we are not in the business of hope value or futures trading.

    As In insurance speak values can go down as well as up. @weatherbyfoxer gave a breakdown of what he woukd need for a.300. euro calf to. turn his margin it was 7.85/ kg. Now his figures are for spring born. Autumn calves would be a but heavier. Maybe lads selling them at present are reflected the price. However if the figures do .ot stand up you stand back.

    Slava Ukrainii



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 21,013 ✭✭✭✭Bass Reeves


    Foxer you are farming full time. If you have a job and are time poor considerations are different. The high tax rate and TAMS maje it viable for 50ish calves.

    Lads often have no problem spending multiples of that buying or upgrading machinery. Ya if you are fulltime farming and only the 20% tax rate ( or limited 40% available) then the milk cart works

    Slava Ukrainii



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 2,751 ✭✭✭DBK1


    Yea it’s up to every farmer to make their own decision but I’d be advising anyone that’s considering not buying and holding onto the money in the bank to have a discussion with their accountant about it to see what’s the best approach.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,743 ✭✭✭weatherbyfoxer


    Won't be much tax issues when a €600 euro calf is sold 16-18 month later for todays €1600 store price.Regardless if its from a full or part-time farmer.

    I have a friend involved in the calf exsport business,he explained to me the other day that now that we look to have avoided blue tongue again their calf buyers will be given the orders to leave nothing behind this spring.The demand will be greater than last year as there is less calves due this year



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,451 ✭✭✭limo_100


    so going by what your friend is telling you isint that confirming that in 18months later beef will have to go up based off what the exportors are planing to buy next spring. If that happens and the exporters keep going with the weanlings then I can see beef getting dearer over the next few years.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,743 ✭✭✭weatherbyfoxer


    Possible yes,but will factories play ball with prices to consistently give €7.50+ per kg to allow a profit on exspencive stock?



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,451 ✭✭✭limo_100


    if its not there I can't see how they don't keep increasing base price tbh its supply and demand if there's no supply then it has to go



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,636 ✭✭✭tractorporn


    Rolled the dice on another 4 Angus calves today, 520 at 6 weeks of age.



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