Different values around Christmas

Princess Calla

Why are you not staying in your own house?

Let someone kip on the floor if there's not enough beds.

I wouldn't be giving up my bed for guests I didn't particularly want!

LilacNails

Its a difficult one. I can see where your coming from re your sons values, it's a pity your wife can see from the same page. It's a shame Christmas is mostly about appearances and material things.

I dont know the solution but I think u should keep stern and stand your ground with your wife. I imagine she would side with the sister for the sake of it. She's caught in the middle but she needs to talk up to her sister. The sister doesn't sound like a great influence .

Maybe next year, how about u suggest they can come over, but only after Christmas day. The 28th. No presents in the house, just 2 r 3 times. That way your son won't see all the presents or silly fuss, the main day will be over. Shame it effects your mother in law, she probably wants best for everyone and stay quiet.

I dont think u should just stand there and put up with it. Christmas is so special when kids are young and great memories should be made.

Blanco100

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121535869#Comment_121535869

I agree, the MIL just wants everyone to get along. But I'm fecked if I'm spending another Christmas like this.

The sad thing is my wife never visits her family herself, I always have to be paraded as well, she has 2 sisters and there's always a friendliness on the surface but massive competition underneath it all, huge appearances put on for them.

They live 2 hours away, she drives but never did that journey herself, ya know the carry on. We literally can't even sit in our sitting room this eve for the amount of toys stacked high, I just can't over it, it's obscene it really is.

LilacNails

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121535931#Comment_121535931

Suppose the pics are already up on Insta stories? I can feel the misery from your post.

Spell out to your wife, crystal clear, it's really uncomfortable, you want but can't enjoy the day with your son and wife in your own home. Sounds as if ur wife might be easily influenced too.

Purple Mountain

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121535931#Comment_121535931

Ah for goodness sake, there's another sister! The Christmas shouldn't fall on your family every year.

Take the previous posters advice. Invite them on the 27th or 28th next year.

They can get a train to the nearest town and spend the day in your home.

Or if they have to stay overnight, (1 night is enough) invest in a blow up mattress for the SIL and boy. Do not be put out of your bed.

You could suggest to the SIL that both families get a Chinese takeaway and split the costs 😆

marilynrr

Anyway I laid some ground rules with my wife, I specifically asked that she doesn't try to mirror her sister when it comes to lavishing presents on our son this year. It's not a financial thing, rather it's a values thing.

.....

my sister in law is practicing some pretty ridiculous "traditions" Which included one specific one I specifically asked my wife to mention it's not happening here.

Those parts stood out to me. While what you want for Christmas when it comes to the amount of gifts certainly seems like the more reasonable choice I don't think that necessarily gives you the right to lay down the ground rules. Does your wife really agree with your values and what you want for Christmas?

You said your wife agrees with you about the SIL most of the time but then is meek as a kitten in her presence, are you sure you haven't got it the wrong way around because it comes across more like she's appeasing you the rest of the time and agreeing about her sister but maybe she actually wants some of the Christmas 'magic' and traditions even if you don't want that kind of thing for Christmas, Lots of people love that stuff like wrapping doors etc, it's cheap and they see it as fun. I've never done it but I'd see it as a silly fun thing, not something wildly excessive like you think it is.

MakersMark

I think it's time to stand up to your wife, not your SIL.

You sound like you're having a miserable Xmas each year. Not worth it, and not fair on you.

Tell your wife this, and tell her now that next year is just for you.

Don't accept anything else.

You'll regret not doing this.

iniscealtra

I’d be putting a stop to this madness. Leaving your own house on Christmas Eve is not ok.

Talk to your wife. No guests next Christmas.

Friends of mine put a stop to the madness by saying only wooden toys.

Invite them for new Years. Collect them from the nearest bus stop/train or send your wife to collect them.

Go and stay with her mother for a few days during the year and cook for her / bring her out to dinner.

Blanco100

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121536442#Comment_121536442

In fairness wrapping a door is the least of my worries, it's what's on the other side of the door that's the issue. Literally like a toy shop, stuff stacked high.

For me, it breeds entitlement in kids, people might say it's a matter of opinion but I don't think there's any valid argument or reason to lavish that amount of gifts on a kid who has everything anyway.

To suggest I enforce anything is unfair too, it's a fair compromise, I could be a prick and say nobody is coming down, I even stayed elsewhere to save space, took our kid out of his bed to make room.

lbunnae

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/2058328294/different-values-around-christmas

You spent 500 quid on your 5 year old child? Christ the hypocrisy. Sounds obscene to me.

Idbatterim

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121536797#Comment_121536797

There is obscene pressure mostly from the mothers now to do this . E500 is a lot, but not obscene. This money would he far better saved for the kids future or family finances ( rainy day fund ) .

lbunnae

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121537031#Comment_121537031

500 on a 5 yr old is enough to be called a hypocrite in my book. His main problems then were wrapping the door ie not a big deal and then the in laws eating food.

listermint

I read this as the OP being a miser tbh.

Wrapping the door so the kids open it in the morning as a surprise isn't a big deal. Jesus I'd say you murder the joy out of Christmas setting rules. Good jaysus is all I'd say.

AdrianG08

Jesus Christ some of the replies on here beggar belief.

Can 1 million per cent relate to the OPs situation.

He's been called a miser for not letting people blow even more on toys, a hypocrite for spending too much. It's actually unbelievable.

The SIL sounds like a dose and my guess is your wife knows she's explosive so she wants Christmas going off without a hitch. Easier to comply than risk her wrath when weighing things up.

Completely agree with you on your values, don't listen to any other shite on here. And as for being judged on the wrapping the door, I get it that that isn't the issue per se, it's the icing on the cake rather. I had a sister who did the same nonsense, it's not for the kids it's for the parents to plaster on Facebook for likes. Some people's lives are mundane and this is the **** (Facebook validation) that gives them their buzz.

As for leaving your family home to accommodate them? You are a better man than I. And a good husband and father too by sounds of your posts, I wish you and your family a very happy Christmas and new year.

lbunnae

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121537089#Comment_121537089

How is it unbelievable? He spent 500 quid on his 5 year old and is giving out about what a different woman buys her child? And then moaning she is eating food in the house that she was invited to. Beggars belief indeed.

Furze99

Blood is thicker than water they say and it's true, when you marry - you also marry that persons family.

But no way would I put up with that. When things have calmed down in January, discuss between ye what you'll do next year. And be very clear that it'll be stuck too.

Blanco100

Ah FFS you can't win. I dunno if I spent that much, I don't care what she spends I just don't want my lad seeing it. My point was I was responsible for driving them all down here, none of it would fit, so she had numerous massive boxes sent down to our place, which are pretty hard to hide.

She can eat what she wants, my point was she didn't lift a finger, didn't even take her plate away, brought nothing with her. If it wasn't us she was sponging off it would be her pensioner mother, the person we wanted to bring down on her own.

lbunnae

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121537256#Comment_121537256

Next year invite them down on the 27th , simplest solution. I don’t blame your wife for wanting to keep the peace on Christmas Day.

...Ghost...

Christmas if it's to be enjoyed involves compromise on all sides.

With that said, the first problem here is your Wife. She has no spine. She agrees with you in person and then backs her sister when you try to reinforce what you both agreed on. I'd be having words about that. It's complete BS and two-faced if you both agree to ground rules and she caves at the first hurdle.

The second problem is the SIL has everyone walking on egg-shells trying to please her, no matter whose toes she is stepping on. This behaviour is allowed because her mother allowed it. The SIL has never grown up and become a responsible adult. She probably lives in a house funded by the tax payer and expects everything for nothing.

The final problem is you communicated none of your "values" or "rules" outside the bubble of your marriage. Had you set ground rules, they should have been communicated clearly to everyone before the invite was sealed. In your situation, I would have returned the gifts that were posted to the house. Saying something in a joking, jovial way is not enough to have you taken seriously. It was enough to attract the wrath of your Wife, so you should have just been direct and polite about it. Your Wife mightn't have scolded you if you had (1) set the rules out for everyone before hand and (2) were seen to be reinforcing those rules.

I have an entitled sister and I have nothing to do with her. My parents are to blame. Treated like a princess and let away with everything while having no expectations of her. She lives off the state and suffers with mental health issues....no surprise if you have to listen to the thoughts in your own head everyday without making any contribution to society.

OP - Don't invite the inlaws again. When you Wife kicks up about it, remind her that she didn't stand by what you both agreed this year and it took the joy out of Christmas for you. While Christmas involves compromise. it should include you suffering for days for the inlaws.

Idbatterim

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121537266#Comment_121537266

yeah, I would say the wife wants to keep the peace and unfortunately, its probably easier upsetting hubby than the sister...

"The second problem is the SIL has everyone walking on egg-shells trying to please her, no matter whose toes she is stepping on. This behaviour is allowed because her mother allowed it. The SIL has never grown up and become a responsible adult. She probably lives in a house funded by the tax payer and expects everything for nothing." Exactly what I was thinking. half of the country is the working poor, the other significant number, funded by them, is the idle "poor" as RTE etc would call them ... dont work, but live as comfortably as those working pretty much...

Big Bag of Chips

The children are very young at the moment and still waking up at a normal time. What happens in another year or 2 when they wake up at 4-5am and want to check if Santa has been. Meanwhile you're asleep in your parents house and not planning on going to your own house until 7am, when at that point Christmas morning will have been and gone and you'll have missed it.

Before we got married we both separately went "home" for Christmas. The first year we got married we went to my in-laws house for dinner. My husband had 5 siblings, various nieces and nephews/in-laws etc who were all there. I ate my dinner off my lap in the sitting room with a couple of children hanging off my shoulders. On the way home that evening I told my husband that the next Christmas we were staying at home and doing our own thing. And we have done just that every Christmas since.

Now is the time to start making your own family Christmas, but your wife has to be on board. She cannot agree to it now and them come November feel guilty and invite them all again. If she does then under no circumstances should you have to leave your house to accomodate them.

Purple Mountain

OP, you and your wife and child are your own unit. As BBOC said above, you need to start your own traditions.

I get that your wife and yourself would like to include her mum in an ideal world. But that lady has made her choices by allowing her daughter to exploit her generosity and as much as it isn't nice to see, she's an adult and that's her choice.

So for the meantime, you can't really have mum over for Christmas as it would involve the daughter and boy. This is what you will have to explain to your wife.

Tell her it's your house. You and your son cannot be evicted from your beds for selfish sister. You are not a hotel service, while sister sits around and contributes nothing in the form of help of bringing food. You work too hard all year to be turfed out at Christmas from your own bed. And that's before even getting to the ostentatious presents.

As I outlined before. Suggest a compromise. Once Christmas is over, mum is invited to your house for a night or 2 on her own around the 28th or a nice NYE celebration.

Your wife will have to back you on this if mum or sister start querying. There's no room at the Inn essentially. You are all tired after the year and don't want 2 children and an extra adult but mum is very welcome.

YellowLead

This sounds horrendous and not something you should have to endure for every Christmas going forward! My sister is like that - she’d have me washing her feet if she could and my mother the same from since we were small - I started saying no a long time ago and while my mother doesn’t like it and would prefer everybody does what sister wants, she hasn’t distanced herself from myself or my brother as a result, which surprised me.

Your wife needs to grow some balls. As others have suggested - the mother in law can come to you every second year and the sister in laws the rest of the time, and you can treat her to a relaxing dinner on Stephen’s day or something on the years you don’t have her. If she refuses to come at all that is her problem, she may start coming in a few years when she realises it’s a hard no to having SIL every year. The way she takes over your house is beyond unacceptable and unreasonable and I don’t know anybody else who would put up with that.

mykrodot

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121537058#Comment_121537058

he drives 2 hours to collect his mother in law, her daughter and that daughter's son. He then moves out of his own house on Christmas Eve to make room for these people, sleeping in his old room in his parents house! He provides food, drink and accommodation for these people, while they don't even bring a bottle of wine, he then drives them home again on 27th December, that's almost 4 days in his house !!! And you say HE is taking the joy out of Christmas???

Big Bag of Chips

@mykrodot please remember Personal Issues is an advice forum rather than a discussion forum. Posts are required to be directed at the OP and offer advice or opinion to the OP. This is to prevent the OP's thread being dragged off-topic into an over-and-back argument between other posters.

ax530

I have young children and never heard of the wrapping door nonsense.

I feel sorry for you being put out of your house.

Agree that next year stay at home just 3 of you. Say to other we will be here for 3 days after Christmas welcome to visit. See how it goes then.

Sure it must be stressful for your wife too trying to keep them happy.

Give your mother in law a home heating voucher or something like that so she can benefit directly from it.

marilynrr

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121536744#Comment_121536744

I didn't suggest that, I was just going by the words that you used, that you laid down the ground rules. It sounds like your wife completely ignored them so they definitely weren't enforced. I'm just curious about whether your wife genuinely agrees with your values or not.

I think it's clear that you'll never be able to have a Christmas you enjoy if your SIL comes along next year so I agree with others that you and your wife need to do your own Christmas.

There are lots of people that would agree with you about the excessively materialistic side of Christmas, but who still enjoy silly fun traditions like wrapping doorways so hopefully you and your wife can both come to an agreement/compromise that suits you both next year.

Charles Babbage

It seems to me that the issue is not so much that the op laid down the ground rules, it is that there was discussion of ground rules and his wife agreed, but she did not follow through on the agreement or at least did not follow through on his understanding of the agreement. There will be other issues as parents and there needs to be an ability to agree on something, including each parent making their point where required, and then follow through on that agreement. So in this case, either there was not proper understanding or no proper follow through. This general point should be discussed, followed by some subsequent discussion on next and future years.

As your MIL has a bus pass, she should be encouraged to visit from time to time, if only to get away from other sister.

the14thwarrior

You will never change the sister, so ground rules and all that shi)t is worthless.

stop the traditional madness before you end up hating christmas.

can't invite her next year. never again