An interesting article about a guy obsessed with conspiracy theories who got out.

King Mob

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121286919#Comment_121286919

But claiming that because there are people researching such topics it means that aliens exist is a neat little marketable package.

Grfiters know that their target audience isn't going to read any of those papers beyond the title with the cool buzzwords.

They'll just see stuff like "wormhole" and "classified" and accept what they are told to. And will pay for more of the same.

Cheerful S

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121286919#Comment_121286919

The documents in question were assigned to the Department of Defense under the umbrella of a study on UFOs and observables.The claim that the Advanced Aerospace Threat Identification Program (ATTIP) was not investigating unidentified flying objects (UFOs) that could originate from somewhere other than Earth is incorrect. In fact, ATTIP was specifically dedicated to studying and analyzing encounters with UFOs, including the possibility of extraterrestrial origin or other.

Experts within ATTIP carefully analyzed the collected information to discern patterns, characteristics, and potential explanations for the observed phenomena. Grusch has been assigned a crucial role in this program, which involves conducting thorough investigations across various databases and engaging in discussions with potential sources who would have information about hidden crash retrieval programs. Grusch revelation suggested the presence of a clandestine group with a separate civilization, operating beyond the control of the US government, and deliberately concealing vital information.

The discovery of this breakaway civilization operating outside the control of the US government was a significant revelation here. It suggested the existence of a parallel power structure, capable of conducting activities beyond the scrutiny and accountability of the established authorities.

The Inspector General of the Department of Defense (DOD) has given his support to Grusch, ensuring that there is no mere hearsay involved. However, there is a significant challenge in providing the information related to this matter, as it is of a classified nature. Until the members of Congress obtain the necessary clearance to communicate with him, the sharing of this information remains restricted. The sentiment suggests that there may be a lack of support or interest in sharing this classified knowledge with the public by some in government.

The anticipation for more UFO whistleblowers to step forward with bombshell news in late 2023 and early 2024 is high. I hear things across the internet looking promising.

robinph

@Cheerful S

The documents in question were assigned to the Department of Defense under the umbrella of a study on UFOs and observables.The claim that the Advanced Aerospace Threat Identification Program (ATTIP) was not investigating unidentified flying objects (UFOs) that could originate from somewhere other than Earth is incorrect. In fact, ATTIP was specifically dedicated to studying and analyzing encounters with UFOs, including the possibility of extraterrestrial origin or other.

Yet still none of which supports your claim that UFOs = aliens.

There is "unidentified" things. The US government departments are trying to identify the things. They are open to all possibilities being investigated, however crazy, so that doesn't rule out extraterrestrial. That they haven't ruled ET out doesn't do anything to support a claim of it being ET though.

If you have any such evidence then I'm sure they would be delighted to hear from you. Saying that something odd happened which we cannot yet explain does not count as evidence of ET though, just that there is currently a gap in our knowledge.

silliussoddius

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121287125#Comment_121287125

All of which are cool stories spread like a game of telephone by true believers.

Cheerful S

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121287348#Comment_121287348

the phrase "let's see how it all plays out before deciding what the truth is or not" serves as a reminder to exercise caution and patience when evaluating the veracity of a situation. Conspiracy theories are taking up an increasing amount of my time and attention today. I've going to back out of these threads for a period of time including the 9/11 one. I will be back if anything new happens around the UFO topic, as the terminator says. 

Dohnjoe

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121287438#Comment_121287438

You've been posting conspiracies here for years, none of it has come true

Over the last decade I haven't seen any user conspiracy here that turned out to be true

It's not like if we wait long enough it will turn out that satellites are fake or Covid wasn't real or Sandy Hook was an inside job.

robinph

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121287438#Comment_121287438

Which might make sense if any of the "theories" amounted to something more than "something odd happened which I don't understand". There then might be some part of the theory which could be tested, or some evidence to back up even one small part. Then you could pull on that thread of a theory and see where it leads.

People have been inventing ever more daft ideas around the various theories over the years. None of which have ever amounted to anything. Zero evidence of anything odd having actually happened in any of the conspiracy theories, and zero evidence of why anyone would ever want to go to the trouble of carrying out any of the crazy ideas in the first place even or how they would have got away with it, except for some "pesky kids" on the Internet who were the only ones to be able to see through the cunning plans.

Baldrick came up with far better plans with more of a grasp of reality than any of the conspiracy theories currently doing the rounds on here.

King Mob

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121287472#Comment_121287472

The perfect illustration of this is the thread when people were asked for conspiracy theories that were proven true. None were provided and the thread ended with cheerful arguing that 16 people rigged the WTC towers for demolition over a weekend. And Markus arguing for a flat earth.

Meanwhile actual events occur that should be ripe for theorizing but you never see any interest in.

Like possible collaboration between US government officials, up to and including the president and armed fascists trying to storm the capital and over turn an election? Barely a mention here by conspiracy theorists.

Remember the Panama papers and how the reporter who broke that story got blown up by a car bomb? Conspiracy theorists don't.

A small group of lobbyists with strange beliefs gaining support in government to obtain public funds for their "research" while using dramatic hearings to boost their own fame and credibility? Conspiracy theorists don't want to look into that.

Cheerful S

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121287518#Comment_121287518

Pentagon has taken an unprecedented step by initiating an internal investigation to examine the validity of long-standing conspiracy theories. Unlike previous instances where civilian bodies led such inquiries, this time, the Pentagon itself has taken charge.

This internal investigation holds significant implications for both the Pentagon and the wider public. If the claims are found to be unsubstantiated, it will debunk the conspiracy theories that have persisted for years.

It is indeed nonsensical to label Grusch as a liar when his claims were presented as credible and urgent by the Department of Defence Attorney General. That's a big deal overlooked here.

Given his clearance for all SAPs, including black projects, it is reasonable to expect that he should have been taken seriously. This raises the question of why he would fabricate such a story about a UFO crash retrieval program? It is unlikely that someone with his background and access to sensitive information would risk their credibility by spreading false information. The issue of secrecy has been a topic of concern among a group of 40 whistleblowers too.

The lack of open communication between whistleblowers and the public may indicate that there are individuals within the government who are highly dissatisfied with any mention of these covert programs. To them, individuals like Grusch and others who bring such matters to light may be seen as traitors.

The UFO conference in question was organized with the intention of facilitating an open discourse between members of Congress and key officials from the DOD. However, a group of DOD representatives made it clear to the Congresspeople that they were not willing to entertain discussions related to a specific material Grusch discussed. The refusal left the congresspeople bewildered and frustrated, by a refusal to facilitate a SCIF.

Access to information and the ability to hear claims made by individuals are fundamental aspects of a democratic society. However, when it comes to Grusch's claims, security concerns have restricted the ability of Congress people to listen to these claims right now. Of course, if was all wild claims that wouldn't happen.

King Mob

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121300468#Comment_121300468

And yet, he did present a false and very ridiculous story about a UFO being retrieved in the 30s in Italy.

That's a story that is so ridiculous, most UFO researchers admit that it's false.

However not only was Gruash presenting that story under oath to congress as an example of a credible incident, he was acting as if it was classified to congress, but then had no issue blabbing all about it on some rando podcast.

So either he is lying or his a crap investigator. Either way, he's already torpedoed his credibility to anyone who looks into what he actually said beyond the headlines and what conspiracy theorists want to believe.

Believers have not at all addressed this red flag. They avoid and ignore it because they can't address it.

They do this with every point that makes them question or doubt their beliefs.

Cheerful S

In Europe, cases of UFO sightings were rarely reported, especially in the past. The documentation on such cases is difficult to come by. However, there was a UFO researcher who dedicated his efforts to investigating UFO sightings in his own country, Italy. This researcher discovered that the stories of UFO crash in Italy had some truth to them as early as 1996. In fact, he even released some documents to the newspapers, possibly providing evidence to support the claim of a crash?

The very same one Grusch talked about—odd or just a repeat of what he heard (read link)—Grusch, not a ufologist, may have come across stories related to UFOs during his work. However, it is important to note that these stories may not hold much significance

. What truly matters is whether there was a real concealed program aimed at retrieving crashed UFOs. The focus should be on uncovering the truth behind such a program, rather than getting caught up in mere anecdotes and tales told around crashes. 

www.popularmechanics.com/military/research/a44466099/researcher-says-he-has-evidence-of-1933-ufo-crash-in-italy/

Skepticism surrounding claims of UFO crash retrievals, with many debunkers doubting the existence of such programs. Consequently how would you go about verifying the truthfulness of Grusch's claims about a UFO crash in Italy anyhow?

The fundamental premise again in another way is that individuals over the course of seven decades have encountered unidentified flying objects and concealed them from the world. So, therefore, if true, would the Italy crash not be part of this recovery effort? Again, nobody knows for sure where they got these UFOs from.

Sensitive Compartmented Information Facility (SCIF) plays a crucial role in safeguarding classified information. Grusch was going to tell them wild stories DOD would let him in with them and laugh at the process. Refusal says a lot about Grusch credibiity.

King Mob

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121300485#Comment_121300485

More waffle.

Gruash was refering to a specific case in Italy in the 30s. This case came from an obviously fake document and the testimony of a crank who wrote letters about his father being involved in every single UFO event ever.

It's a false story. It's obviously false.

Yet Gruash is presenting it as one of his best cases.

So he is either lying, or he's a bad investigator.

You don't want to deal with this red flag, so you ignore.

Cheerful S

 Your viewpoint on the UFO subject remains unaltered. Despite the enduring interest and ongoing discussions surrounding this topic, you consider it to be devoid of verifiable evidence and regard it as the same old stuff. In his presentation, he admitted that it was not one of his best cases. He discussed a fascinating topic, the UFO crash retrieval program, and proposed that it could have taken place before the infamous Roswell incident. This challenges the commonly held belief that Roswell was the first significant UFO crash retrieval event.

Whenever Congress people say that this is all disinformation, that's a red flag for me.In place of all this nonsense that some in DOD are engaging in, Grusch should already be SCIF telling Congress what he knows here.

King Mob

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121300510#Comment_121300510

My view point remains unaltered because as usual you are not addressing any points.

That's why the majority of folks do not get convinced by your arguments.

When you guys ignore points and red flags about your theories, readers aren't fooled by it. They don't think that your dodging was some kind of brilliant tactic that you cleverly employed.

All they see is that you aren't able to handle the point and that you are being completely dishonest about it. And addition they see you assuming they are idiots who would be fooled by the fingers in the ears tactic.

Maybe like the guy in the article, you should start wondering why you have to do this yourself.