American Highway Appreciation Thread

Kermit.de.frog

Never in the history of humanity has a nation built such a great project as the American highway system.

Let's start with a Dallas night tour (and yes this thread is not for greens)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ay2LIfk8fN0

Let's move to Hueston

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gVcJXkvCjaY

One of very many LA approach highways

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OBli5W0cevU

Much more to come.

KrisW1001

It's Houston.

That Dallas video was done very late at night, because those roads are notoriously congested at peak times (the video is also 13 years old - ). A former job involved several of those roads, and you're lucky to see 30 mph on the non-tolled lanes of these highways morning and evening. Daytime is a bit better, but it's what we'd call "busy" traffic.

Dallas-Fort Worth and Houston are the finest examples of how induced demand makes it impossible to build your way out of urban traffic congestion. Dallas-Fort Worth-Arlington has another, more pressing issue with traffic than just delays - because these cities sit in a large natural hollow in a hot climate, the whole area has appalling air quality. Cars are the number one contributor to this, and the days of new highways are well and truly over. Dallas's current long-term plan is to re-densify its urban centre, reduce parking, increase public transport investment, incentivise higher vehicle occupancy (you pay half price on many toll lanes if you've got someone else in the car) and basically do all the stuff that European cities do. Road User Pricing is also being considered for highways without toll lanes.

(Another example of the same "bowl of bad air" is Los Angeles)

SuperBowserWorld

Highways to hell.

It's kind of like saying nuclear bombs - let's build more.

Or plastic, we need more plastic.

Or industrial meat farming, what an incredible achievement by humanity.

KrisW1001

Yes. When you finally get out of your car and walk around, most of Dallas is a horrible place - all asphalt, parking lots and flyovers. Basically, those roads are a hugely expensive monument to the failure of the private car as a method of mass transportation, and the traffic is still awful, day in, day out.

In fairness, the city government knows this, and has changed its planning rules to encourage the creation of proper walkable neighbourhoods. Some of the newer developments in Downtown Dallas wouldn't be out of place in Dublin: street-side parking, closely-spaced blocks of three floors over retail/cafes on ground. Dallas also has the best public transport in Texas - I know that's not saying much, but it does have a multi-line commuter rail service (called DART - theirs opened a year before Dublin's)

AugustusMinimus

I’ve done a lot of driving in the US and I’ve rarely encountered the chronic traffic levels of lore. Traffic in Ireland is much worse in my experience.

Thats not saying the American way is the correct one. Most cities there are just parking lot after parking lot.

KrisW1001

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121092257#Comment_121092257

One Friday evening on I-35 in Austin, TX it took me 70 minutes to travel 8 miles. "Yeah, that is a little worse than usual" was all the sympathy I got.

In the States, the traffic doesn't stop as frequently as here, but it can get really slow. Most people drive automatics, so you end up in a mass of cars, creeping at 5-10mph or so. It's only when you check the time that you realise how bad the traffic really is.

confidentjosh

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/2058313042/american-highway-appreciation-thread

You've obviously got a major agenda to "drive home" the fact that US highways are the best in the world (even though most of them are crumbling and falling apart) and looking at your posts on other threads it seems you want Ireland to import the same level of road infrastructure. This delusional thinking is laughable on your part. You do realise that the states is a continent in terms of size/scale and that we're nearly as small as their smallest state? Please stop embarrassing yourself with these moronic posts and engage your brain before posting.

Fwiw I think the Autobahns in Germany are the best plus they have a cracking modern train infrastructure to go with it.

Manic Moran

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121099547#Comment_121099547

Autobahns are certainly good. Rail system is a wash. Good for passengers, but no other country can touch the American rail network when it comes to freight.

That said, there's some seriously impressive road-building in the US. Interstate 80 through the Sierra Nevadas was a common route of mine. I get to drive San Antonio to El Paso next weekend, it's just set the cruise control to about 85, turn on the radio, and watch nothing but desert go by for the next 500 miles. Very pleasant.

Norteño

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121099570#Comment_121099570

I thought that the speed limit in America was 55?

plodder

I-280 from San Jose to San Francisco is a very nice, scenic drive, up in the hills over Silicon Valley.

https://tinyurl.com/mrds52xw

Norteño

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121099649#Comment_121099649

I always wondered why some American cars had those...thank you.

An awful hell-hole of a place to find yourself is an American Highway. When you get sandwiched in between multiple big rigs, take comfort in the fact there is an excitable commentator whirling overheard in a helicopter broadcasting your final moments as you burn to death in a fiery wreck, watched on by families tucking into dinner in front of the TV.

Norteño

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121102863#Comment_121102863

Sounds like the M50 at rush hour..

The difference between Irish and US roads is the US have worse drivers, higher speeds, more HGVs during the day, crazy police pursuits, more dangerous vehicles.

Norteño

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121105155#Comment_121105155

(See my previous post)

plodder

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121105155#Comment_121105155

I don't know. I remember the first time I was there, I stood watching a black and white police cruiser go down the street. I was actually expecting it to do a sudden u-turn or roll over or crash into something with the officers coming out shooting, until I realised this is reality, not the movies.

wotzgoingon

It's a massive rich country with a large population of course they would have good roads. But saying that I was in New York and New York state and the roads aren't that great over there. You cannot compare the highways there to roads here with our tiny population.

Kermit.de.frog

Driving in Dallas.

The scale is so impressive and nothing remotely like it in Europe or anywhere else which is why the US is by far the only superpower. They think big and do things right. The interstate system is so big, so vast, it just does not compare with anywhere else in the world.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-y1kVbVt_Uk&t

How the M20 between Cork and Limerick should be 🙂

https://youtu.be/MEICF6BwmZo?t=225

No one can deny the engineering splendor on display.

https://youtu.be/KUNqsCRO3rE?t=247

loco_scolo

Awh that's nice. The roads guys are getting nostalgic for roads. Penny dropping is it?

😂😂

Norteño

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121107586#Comment_121107586

Not dropping as low as your I.Q, fella..

Cookiemunster

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121107402#Comment_121107402

The reason you don't see roads in Europe on the scale you see them in the US is because they're not needed in Europe. Unlike the US, most of Europe has excellent public transport.

And no the M20 should not be 4 lanes each way. Parts of it barely required a dual carriageway. A 2 lane motorway will be more than enough for decades to come.

You seriously need to get over you fetish for US roads.

Norteño

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121109692#Comment_121109692

If you've nothing nice to say, why not try saying nothing?

No-one asked you to comment on this thread.

AugustusMinimus

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121111775#Comment_121111775

There’s one thread on this forum talking about US roads. As you say, let Kermit have his thread. I don’t understand some of the replies in here.

Cookiemunster

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121111775#Comment_121111775

Unless a mod tells me otherwise, I can comment on any thread I want to. If you don't like that, put me on ignore.

Kermit has a long history of demanding massive US highways in Ireland and Europe and calling us a backwards because we don't build roads we don't need. I was directly responding to a post along those lines, which I'm fully entitled to do.

BTW, if my mod powers extended to the infrastructure forum you'd have been sanctioned for questioning somebodies IQ. Maybe you should take your own advise and say nothing, if you've nothing nice to say.

Kermit.de.frog

I think we need to think bigger in everything not only roads.

Our metro will be a glorified tram. Why? Why not go all out? Why not be ambitious? We have the money to do it. Other places do it - some poorer than us.

Infrastructure and future proofed scale is important and in Ireland we have always thought too small to our cost.

Look at the M50, had they built it wide enough in the first place it would have saved us €2bn and the job is still not done. More flyovers and lanes required in places soon.

Just do it properly the first time. That should apply to everything.

Kermit.de.frog

In Arizona the I-17 between Flagstaff and Phoenix which runs north/south drops over 1,600m in elevation in the space of 140 miles distance. Hence it starts out with conifers and greenery with snow in the Winter, Spring, Autumn down to hot desert and cacti in Phoenix.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=el3lLaTUZ_M

KrisW1001

That video is typical of the cross-section of most of the Interstate system. Pretty much the same as our Type 1 DC.

Also in Arizona is I-19, the only highway in the USA to use Metric units on its signage.

2K22 (EP 11) Interstate 19 in Tucson, Arizona: The Metric Interstate - YouTube

It was built in the late 1970s and the signage was intended as a pilot for re-signing the rest of the system. This was back when the USA was still planning to adopt to the metric system by 1980. Unfortunately, Ronald Reagan got elected and he had no time for things that were new, and the plan was stalled and stalled and eventually abandoned. But the road had been opened by then, and the cost of re-signing was big enough that it was left as-was. The signs, when needed, are still replaced with metric ones, and exit numbers are numbered as km from the start of the route.

There are some small signs of the metrication push still around: I once came across a small roadside distance sign that was in both km and miles in the wilds of San Benito County, CA.

Kermit.de.frog

I-5 outbound Los Angeles/Orange county

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V7sisr3WVLs

Rubberchikken

God love those videos.

A dream of mine to drive or be driven in the states. More than likely will never happen but it just sounds a fantastic experience. The skies, space the roads (and I don't care if they're not great at times😊).

Nice😁😁

Kermit.de.frog

Europe can only dream of roads like this (I-10 Pheonix)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZHP82X9-LFo&ab_channel=ScrewdUPClickV2

KrisW1001

"Dream"? You're kidding, right? There are more impressive roads in continental Europe (and the US) than this stretch of pretty bland suburban freeway.

Norteño

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121162220#Comment_121162220

Sure the M2 foreshore in Belfast is wider and more impressive than that.

cantalach

Got back Monday evening from the 2 week road trip in CA and Nevada. We covered about 1,500 km which is not huge by US standards but enough to give a feeling for things.

A recurring observation as we drove along was that a huge percentage of the freeway mileage in CA is in appalling condition.

• Surfaces are bumpy, heavily patched, and noisy.
• Lane markings are worn away in lots of places.
• Shoulders at the median and on the right are strewn with debris, sometimes shockingly big items like parts of TVs and microwave ovens.
• Safety 'furniture' is broken, dislodged, or missing.
• Signage is battered and in some places has clearly been shot at.

It doesn't come close to the quality of the motorways I've driven on in Spain, Germany, France, and Italy. Our own M50 is superior in quality to 95% of the freeways I drove on in CA.

End of empire stuff I'm afraid.

kirving

The quality of German and UK motorways is poor in comparion to Ireland too, but to be expected given the traffic volumes really.

End of an empire I don't think so, the US are investing in their highway and bridge network, over $350bn over the next few years. But yes they likely need much more. It's the cleanliness and general maintenance that gets me though - even in the richest states, they can't keep up with the litter.

Drove to Corpus Christi last weekend, the new bridge being built is seriously impressive. 62m over the water, with the longest span being 500m.

https://www.google.com/maps/@27.8111479,-97.396252,3a,60y,311.78h,92.35t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1suMlnAX1vecRREpBLIr15Ng!2e0!7i16384!8i8192?entry=ttu

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Harbor_Bridge_Project

Cookiemunster

The US has ignored transport infrastructure maintenance for decades. It's now crumbling. Bridge collapses on major road and rail routes are a semi regular occurrence.

They're spending now because they have to. And if Trump had won reelection then none of that would be happening. Biden got it through congress.

Norteño

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121172330#Comment_121172330

How do you know Trump wouldn't have done the same if not more?

cantalach

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121172121#Comment_121172121

The Corpus Christi bridge hasn’t gone smoothly:

https://youtu.be/j9ODgfIaxc4?feature=shared

Cookiemunster

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121174110#Comment_121174110

Because he did absolutely nothing in the 4 years he was in power, despite promising to do so during the election. He wouldn't have done any different during a second term.

Norteño

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121175245#Comment_121175245

Ah right, I see.

Lend us your crystal ball when you get a minute, would ya?

Jayuu

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121176680#Comment_121176680

All of this infrastructure work is being done as part of Biden's support of the renewed push towards a green agenda. Trump and the Republicans on the other hand have absolutely no interest, and are downright hostile, to that agenda.

Manic Moran

Couple of shots from my recent drive to my reserve military training (800km or so).

This is what American infrastructure does that Europe cannot (And, in fairness, has no need to). That train's well over a mile long. You want to move lots of things long distances with very little in between (If you check the map, you'll find pretty much nothing of note between San Antonio and El Paso), the US rail network can't be touched.

I took the scenic route home (Ft Stockton to Del Rio). Over this 100km stretch to Sanderson, I saw probably two dozen vehicles in total. When you're dealing with that sort of traffic density, it's understandable that the road repair budget isn't to European standards per mile.

You also get weirdness like this.

KrisW1001

Yes, outside of the metropolitan areas, there's simply enormous pockets of feck-all in the States.

But those trains only look impressive: they're actually the problem with rail transport in the States. The rail network is extraordinarily slow, which is why the trains are run so long. Sections of the track aren't capable of higher speeds, so to get the throughput up, they use super-long trains. This isn't so much a lack of investment as a conscious decision by the railroad companies, all of whom are freight movers, and this is the cheapest way to transfer the largest amount of freight.

But the fact that virtually all the rail corridors are owned by freight companies is what has hamstrung any attempt at medium-speed passenger rail in the States. In Texas, Dallas to Austin is 315 km, about 2h40 by road (assuming you don't get stuck at either end in I-35's appalling traffic). The same trip would be around 2h by rail without any fancy high-speed track or rolling stock (assuming two intermediate stops). Want to know the actual journey time...? Four hours. Those mile-long freight trains, and low-speed sections, make the lines useless for long-distance passenger use.

plodder

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121172121#Comment_121172121

The quality of German and UK motorways is poor in comparion to Ireland too, but to be expected given the traffic volumes really.

German motorways are pretty good in my experience. Their standards of signage and road markings are much higher than here and the UK. And they spend a fortune in maintenance every year.

I suspect motorways are probably in a better state here than the UK because they are much newer here.

kirving

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121174569#Comment_121174569

Really interesting having just seen it up close, thanks! Impressive nonetheless

cson

As a US resident I wish they'd concentrate on high speed rail over interstates.

A country of their wealth and technology should really have their own version of the Shinkansen/TGV, certainly on the Northeast corridor from DC to Boston.

Brightline is a step in the right direction at least.

Norteño

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121190026#Comment_121190026

Seeing as though they are literally trillions in debt, and have to keep lifting the country's overdraft limit every month to even more ridiculous and unsustainable levels, I'd say it's not surprising that they've no money to fix the roads and rail they have, never mind build new ones.

cson

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121191886#Comment_121191886

Household budget =/= Government budget.

They can issue as much debt as they want, it won't make a difference to their standing in the world.

Kermit.de.frog

A trip through the Continental Divide (the Rockies). Extraordinary engineering and the heights are unreal. The lowest peak on this road is over 2,400 meters. The highway transitions from Kansas, East Colorado flat land to mountains and to desert is wonderful.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ggZ8mxPE4pQ

In terms of sheer ambition the project announced by Eisenhower was monumental and an incredible undertaking.

The actual roads themselves are of abysmal quality and easily the worst I've ever drive on.

I'm now off to start an American Highspeed Rail Appreciation Thread.

NSAman

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121191886#Comment_121191886

When they do build roads they do it right.

i90 Chicago to Rockford, 60 miles, 27 or so bridges replaced, completely lit, gone from two lanes to three lanes and then widened IN chicago suburbs to 5 to six lanes. All built in 2 years? Speed limits ( if you can call them speed limits) went up.

Travelling from outer suburbs of Chicago to O’Hare is a trip. Speed limit is 70, average speed is 90. Schaumburg to O’Hare is now 10 minutes.

Im not sure how long the M7 between Naas and Newbridge took, seemed like YEARS!

veryangryman

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121873683#Comment_121873683

Ireland not as rich or densely populated as America shocker