LEXUS under performance in Ireland

goochy

Toyota must be delighted with their importers performance over the years, however its hard to see how they are not disappointed with the LEXUS brands performance in its 33 years here .

i would have said Lexus have done a good job in distinguishing lexus from its poor relation Toyota , however why have irish buyers not taken to the brand ?

Tesla have sold nearly as many cars this year as Mercedes , which proves irish buyers are not only will to buy german premium brands .

i can recall passing through Riga in Latvia ( latvia has a pop. of about 1.5 m ) and being amazed to see x2 large standalone lexus dealerships on different sides of Riga

i think when it comes to prestige brands standalone ' destination' dealerships are very important to the buying experience .

Lexus Blackrock which would be the best located dealer being located in South County Dublin , however the dealership is attached to C& K TOYOTA. Toyota have been getting rid of small dealerships so how are they still Toyota dealers ? is it just because if they lost Toyota , the lexus garage would also close ?

Becoming a standalone lexus dealership would be a better idea , but I think standalone dealerships in high profile locations would be better .

i think Lexus ireland should open high profile standalone dealerships in the likes of Dublin and Cork , give dealers the chance to lease / run the dealerships and then possibly buy the dealerships qwhen they are successful and established ( so no risk for dealers)

User1998

Pre 2008 most of their cars were in the €1800 tax bracket which didn’t help sales

Even post 2008 lots of their cars have high tax, €1200 Lexus RX for example

They sold lots of hybrids before hybrids became popular here

Very few diesel options, and up until recently diesel was very popular here

And lots of Lexus’ here are used imports from Japan

Maybe just some of the reasons

ba_barabus

People in Ireland can't see past German brands when it comes to the prestige end of the market.

You mention Tesla but that's only recent and appeals to a different type of buyer.

If I was buying a luxury car in the morning it would without doubt be a Lexus.

Rows Grower

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120971005#Comment_120971005

Lexus were far ahead of the pack when it came to luxury and reliability.

When Mercedes decided to enter the Hybrid SUV market they gave their engineers a blank cheque to find the best option. The answer they got back after much research was the Lexus Hybrid SUV that was in production for the previous 2 years could not be improved on.

Mercedes bought the rights to use Lexus technology.

ba_barabus

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120971056#Comment_120971056

I agree they're technically superior as is the build quality.

But for too many sheep it hasn't got a German badge.

Atlantic Dawn

Their offering to the market is poor at the moment, the CT200h and IS300h have been discontinued a couple of years ago, these were the big sellers here. The UX is just too small and cheaply laid out inside to consider premium. The lack of the LS is surprising, they should keep the flagship available for a premium brand, I see it's still available in RHD form in Cyprus for €100k.

For multi-millionaire airline CEO's that have taxi plates to use the bus lanes the Lexus LM should appeal to them, coming to the UK soon...

https://www.lexus.co.uk/new-cars/lm-world-premiere

User1998

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120971131#Comment_120971131

Looks like a Toyota Alphard. They are JDM but I’ve seen a few of them in London. Very luxurious

bazz26

1. Lexus have little or no presence here in most people's minds.
2. Their dealer network is small and scattered. I bet most people don't probably know where their nearest Lexus dealer is.
3. Their model line up is limited (at least in Europe). The German's have a model in nearly every segment.
4. Lexus seem more focused on the massive US market where they are more successful.

Its hard to distinguish Lexus models from their lesser Toyota cousins. I sat in an ES 300h recently and while the build quality was fantastic, it felt like it was designed 10 years ago. Fiddley small buttons all over the centre console and small infotainment screen with a dated interface. The ES is also about 10k dearer than the Camry on which it is based but doesn't feel worth 10k more.

On the plus side those that like and buy Lexus models tend to be loyal to the brand by continuing to buy them. Their reliability is far superior to their German rivals. If only Lexus could be bothered offering something that more people want.

goochy

Lexus never sold in big numbers here , the amount of uk imports here possibly making someone think loads of ct2000 and is300 were sold here but this years. Sales are up on previous years and there is a new small hybrid Lexus due based on a Toyota but reworked . The LS is available to order ( it’s micheal martins gov car ) but it doesn’t sell well any where as while it looks great it’s flawed . That could be Lexus problem , No great cars all flawed like many Japanese cars but they still sell well in other countries and Audi don’t exactly build class leading Cars . Regarding the es and Camry , I think the €10 k is worth it as Camry is as dull as dish water

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120971195#Comment_120971195

You could apply 1, 2, 3 & 4 to Tesla though.

goochy

Yes there is something about Lexus that just isn’t connecting with Irish buyers , I thought with hybrid becoming more popular Lexus would capitalize on it in recent years but they haven’t

bazz26

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120971370#Comment_120971370

Not a proper comparison. Tesla are not a traditional car company. They sell exclusively online where they have a well established brand and presence even in Ireland. Their bricks and mortar centres are basically just collection points for customers. However Tesla are not a premium brand. Lexus compete directly with Audi, BMW and Mercedes.

Cars registered so far to date - Audi 4446, BMW 3779 and Mercedes 2496 while Lexus were way down at 499.

Flinty997

Do they have any interesting cars in their current Irish line up. I think they've always been seen as exceptionally well made and reliable but otherwise quite dull.

Anyone I know who had one, had nothing but praise for them. Never did anything for me.

ZookeeperDub

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120971536#Comment_120971536

They are a fancy Toyota. Solid as a rock, very little goes wrong with them and they will be around in 100 years.

Toyota itself tried to jump into that market with the Camry which was a upmarket saloon but the market had moved on from cars.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120971370#Comment_120971370

Tesla is not a premium brand. They have dropped their prices multiple times to try shift their cars. The customer base for Tesla is really the people keeping up with the Jones and want something to show off at the golf club.

I find it a strange market at the moment, you have BYD walk in as a "cheap" electric car and they are starting at 40k with people rushing out to buy them. They look ok outside but the interior is f**king dreadful. Renault are selling a Megane for 40k as well because it's electric.

In reality with all the prices Tesla have dropped their cars they should be unable to keep them in stock

DrPsychia

I owned an is300h for a couple years. I was amazed how plush the suspension felt and how solid everything felt in the cabin in comparison to German cars in the same segment, no rattles or creaks whatsoever. However one thing I disliked about the IS300H was the centre tunnel/infotainment, it felt outdated compared to the Germans. No auto-hold button was annoying and I believe they didn't have this option until 2019/2020 meanwhile it was an cheap option or standard in German cars from 2012 onwards.

They didn't grow here in the past 20 years because of the lack of a diesel option and motor tax was very high due to the big petrol engines, such a shame as they are reliable and comfortable cars.

goochy

it doesnt explain why they are successful in other countries and not here , also high road tax hasnt been an issue since hybrids came out .

if they dont succeed here with LBX - based on Yaris x - the importer should be sacked

User1998

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120989866#Comment_120989866

They still had high tax up until 2010. GS Hybrid was still €800, RX was €1,250. Before 2008 they were €1800

It took a few years after the tax change in 2008 for the tax to come down on them.

goochy

Its a long time ago

galwaytt

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120971005#Comment_120971005

Hmmmm, I dunno. I know I certainly can now at any rate.

We have 3 Merc's in this house and 1 996. My C-class and the 996 I'd be happy to change to a Lexus for tbh.

The SO loves her CLS and the YO is keen to move on her A-Class, ironically looking at Lexus too.

TheAnalyst_

Lexus are shite.

goochy

elaborate ? they dont seem to be best drivings cars in their class thats for sure , but then neither are Audi

ba_barabus

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120990159#Comment_120990159

The exception to the rule however. I'd love a Lexus as I just think the build quality is a mild beyond anything from Germany.

galwaytt

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120990173#Comment_120990173

you're succinct, I'll give you that :)

ZookeeperDub

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120989866#Comment_120989866

Why are they not successful here? most people see them as a Toyota and just buy the Toyota instead

User1998

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120991538#Comment_120991538

I’d imagine 90% of people don’t even know that Toyota and Lexus are related

Anyway the same can be said of VW/Audi/Skoda/Seat but they are all popular enough here

I think they went after a very small segment of society somebody in management that like to golf. Traditionally in Ireland the majority of people that drive Lexus are usually older which hurts their appeal.

goochy

the styling is far from conservative these days - brand awareness / image are obviously poor here .

lexus should be surveying buyers of the German three brands on why they havent bought lexus

Shlippery

Imported a ct200h then traded for a 162 is300h, quite happy with it but hate hate hate the infotainment system...not sure if it's much improved in newer models. Not sure what I'd switch to next, not a great selection available.

newmember2

I'm hoping my next car will be a reliable and luxurious Lexus.

goochy

infotainment in jap cars a common problem , who would have thought the one time world leaders have fallen so far behind

ZookeeperDub

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120992081#Comment_120992081

Toyota system was shite as well, still is if you ask me

User1998

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120992118#Comment_120992118

The infotainment in my 2007 Lexus RX was great. Large touch screen very responsive. It even had a calendar to schedule events😂

Then the generation after they fitted a smaller screen further away from the driver and it doesn’t seem to be touch sensitive. Definitely went downhill on that one.

galwaytt

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120992496#Comment_120992496

the aftermarket takes care of all that these days: https://youtu.be/Bpv8K5IUmzI

GSBellew

In my opinion the IS200 and the type of drivers it attracts has given Lexus a bit of a "boy racer" (hate that term) reputation but I am not sure what other way to describe it.

Other brands have these elements too, but the brands were already well established so it is not an over riding factor in peoples minds.

Casati

Best selling Audi’s, BMW’s and Merc’s here over last 15 years all came with a 2.0 Diesel engines and Lexus couldn’t compete.

The Germans have realised EV’s are the future and Lexus are still pushing hybrids

goochy

this could be the cause !!

Hurrache

Their interiors on the current range relatively are pretty poor and feel a bit tinny, I wouldn't rate them as been a very prestigious brand.

bladespin

i would have said Lexus have done a good job in distinguishing lexus from its poor relation Toyota , however why have irish buyers not taken to the brand ?

I'd suggest that wasn't a good idea, Toyota have a firm following here (right or wrong), why spend more on the 'inferior' more expensive brand? Would have been the mindset for my parents anyway.

goochy

i dont get your point , the person buying a corolla isnt the same person buying a BMW 5 series

bladespin

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120995012#Comment_120995012

True but not, the person who used to buy the Corollas etc are the people buying the 5 series/ CLs what have you, that's how the country's finances have changed , speaking for my own parents - loyal Toyota owners all they way through the late eighties, early nineties until the T became a Star, after all it's that age group that make the bulk of Lexus ownership as far as I can see.

kanuseeme

6 years ago I wanted a Toyota hybrid from the UK, looked at Prius, imo at the time, too expensive, ok go down a size the auris, also expensive, then I spotted a cheap one in auto trader, turns out the seller put a ct 200h in with the auris section, I bought one, very happy with it.

I thought about it many times since,

My conclusions are, every one thinks lexus are expensive, and so repairs must be also, so less interest in them, even if you want to spend that kind of money on one, the more bigger brands would seem a better bet.

Lack of advertising, I never heard of them, or never paid any attention to them.

It was one of the nicest cars I owned, bought a prius later, it was awful compared to it.

Juran

My friend bought a lexus RX hybrid this year, middle of the range spec, paid €69k. We bought a Kodiaq diesel, middle of the range style spec, with a few extras, paid €57k. Our Koqiaq is 7 seat, huge boot, etc. The RX is small in comparision. Yes, the RX is lovely, sexy, etc. But I think the majority of Irish adults think of size and practicality (especially those with kids) plus value for money, over cool and sexy.

goochy

you paid €57k for a skoda . FFS

Hurrache

Are you a time traveller that just arrived from the 80s, or just on a shaky bar stool?

goochy

its alot for a skoda , they as expensive as VW now

Hurrache

You're incorrectly basing your judgment purely on the badge rather than the actual cars. It's what makes Toyota, right or wrongly the last decade or so, what they are.

bladespin

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120995645#Comment_120995645

It's more than the VW Allspace Tiguan but depends on the extras etc.

Juran

The Kodiaqs when launched in 2017 were starting at €34k, marketed as inexpensive, which they were. They have increased signifcantly since, high demand added to that. We bought our 1st that year for close to €40k due to extras. This is our 3rd Kodiaq. I know €57k is a lot, but equivalent 7- seater SUV style are more expensive. Kia Sorrento starts at €62k now, VW Tiguan all space would be €62k for same spec car as our Kodiaq, VW Toureg start at €108k for diesel (made in Slovinia) and Audi Q7 diesel starts at €106k. We feel €57k compared to the alternatives is good value.

My friend in the states bought a Toyota Highline, 7 seater, all the extras for $45k. We pay way too much for cars in Europe.

goochy

kia sorrento would seem good value , Tiguan all space for €62k is nuts

Comparing car prices in US not fair comparsion , you pay feck all taxes in US and get nothing in return

galwaytt

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120995012#Comment_120995012

no but a Camry buyer could well be a Lexus buyer....