Double yellow lines for taxi pick-up

asaptaxi

Hi everyone,

I am a taxi driver. Yesterday, customer stopped me to pick them up in a double lane, why I stopped using the warning light on the leftside to pick-up my custmer, the gardai flash the blue light. I came down, showed the garda of my warning light and asked my customer to enter my taxi. The garda called me to the back of my car and said, I parked on double yellow line that, he is issueing me 2 points for so doing. My question now is that, is it not allow to pick or load on double yellow line?

No it is not, because it's the rules of the road

asaptaxi

Do you mind address the section of the road traffic code, that say, you are not allow to pick or load on yellow double lines. I did not say park on double yellow line.

Trampas

Double yellow lines mean you can’t park at anytime. So unless the person jumped into while you were still moving you would have parked the car. I know a lot of taxi drivers think they are exempt from the rules of the road but they’re not

Seth Brundle

It might be helpful to you to read this a few times before you get in the car again...

https://www.rsa.ie/services/learner-drivers/resources/rules-of-the-road

asaptaxi

You clearly have no idea what this topic is about. This is not about parking, it is about loading and dropping off in double yellow lines. Pls only reply, when you understand a topic.

cython

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120963636#Comment_120963636

Much and all as I despise the lack of regard for legislation and other road users exhibited by many taxi drivers, it's worth noting that

• RRM 008 (double yellow lines) marking is stated as indicating "that parking of vehicles is prohibited at any time on that side of the roadway", whereas
• the similarly intended RRM 010 indicates "a school entrance at which part of the roadway, the stopping or parking of a vehicle is prohibited".

Given that the latter expressly prohibits both parking and stopping, while the former only refers to parking, it's not unreasonable to conclude that stopping a vehicle on double yellows briefly is distinct from parking on them, and not necessarily prohibited, provided it was safe to do so and not causing an obstruction or hazard.

asaptaxi

Thank you tphase, the truth is that, The gardai got angry because, i showed him that my warning light was on and as a result, my customer location is where I am oblige to pick them up. Again, there was extra lane for the gardai to drive through. I think, it is about power in this case.

geographica

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120963687#Comment_120963687

Did you load and drop off whilst moving? If not, it’s parking and illegal.

asaptaxi

Thank you. Cython. I very much agree.

Peregrinus

It depends on why the double yellow line was there.

There's a whole list of places where you cannot stop or park — adjacent to junctions and pedestrian crossings, in a bus lane, at a vehicle entrance, at a place where the footpath kerb as been lowered, etc — and many of these are often marked with double yellow lines.

(For the nitpickers — you can stop at these places if you are unable to proceed because of an obstruction or because the way is not clear or because a traffic signal requires it (e.g. in a traffic jam, or at a red light). But you can't stop by choice.)

The J Stands for Jay

The road traffic acts specify loading as covering goods or refueling a vehicle. You were doing neither, so you were parked and therefore illegally parked.

dazed+confused

"I came down, showed the garda of my warning light" are you referring to hazard lights here?

I think the argument here is whether stopping to allow a passenger to alight counts as parking.

If you dont agree with the Garda's interruptation of it then appeal the notice when it arrives and take it to court, do let us know how you get on!

Eldudeson

Another grey area in the rules of the road.

The rules say double yellow means "No parking at any time"

The next section specifies even if there's not a sign for No Parking, you "must not stop or park" in a list of various scenarios, none of which are double yellow lines.

This can be read that they have made a distinction between "stopping" and "parking" in each, so technically stopping is not the same as parking!

Now, I'm only going by the Big Bang Theory of reading the law (leave me alone, I liked the show), but if something in a law is ambiguous, then the decision goes in the favour of reading it each way.

I wouldn't use the last line in front of the judge OP! Best of luck.

Seth Brundle

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/2058308882/double-yellow-lines-for-taxi-pick-up

Am I misinterpreting the scenario but from your OP, you were out of the car speaking to the garda (as you pointed out your hazard lights [were you a hazard?]) who I take it told you to move the vehicle. You then left and guided the passenger into your car and the garda called you back.

In a subsequent post, you mention that the garda was on a bit of a power trip. To be honest, you seem to have ignored the instruction of a garda (a greater offence than parking on double yellows) and they could have done you for this but chose not to!

Trigger Happy

Classic case of someone asking a question, presuming to know the answer, and hoping that everyone agrees with them.

Anyone who doesn't 'does not know what they are talking about'.

g g murpho

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120963636#Comment_120963636

But do the UK not distinguish between stopped and parking 🤔

Hence they have double yellow lines and double red lines. Correct me if I’m wrong.

delboythedub

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/2058308882/double-yellow-lines-for-taxi-pick-up

I think that a commercial vehicle is allowed park on yellows for 10 minutes

28064212

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120964251#Comment_120964251

30 minutes: https://www.irishstatutebook.ie/eli/1997/si/182/made/en/print

5(2)(e) a prohibition on the parking of a vehicle imposed by article 36(2)(a) shall not apply to a vehicle parked while goods are being loaded in or on to it or unloaded from it, for a period not exceeding thirty minutes from the commencement of the parking.

36(2)(a) is the article prohibiting parking on double yellow lines. Doesn't apply to OP's case of course, since the exemption is only for loading/unloading goods.

OP, if someone is able to enter or exit a vehicle, you're going to have a very difficult time trying to persuade a judge you were "stopped" instead of parked. But by all means, appeal, and let us know how it goes.

Oh, and having hazard lights on makes absolutely zero difference to whether you're allowed stop, and the fact that you're a "professional" driver that doesn't know that is deeply worrying (but unsurprising).

Trampas

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120964147#Comment_120964147

Not sure what the UK has got to do with this

Peregrinus

Well, we've got reg. 39(2) and (4) to think about:

(2) A person shall not park a vehicle in a bus lane during the period of operation of the bus lane . . .

(4) Sub-article (2) shall not apply to a taxi or a wheelchair accessible taxi which is stopped while picking up or setting down passengers in the course of its use.

The inclusion of sub. (4) implies that the prohibition on parking in sub. (2) would extend to stopping to set down or pick up passengers. If it didn't, sub. (4) wouldn't be needed.

g g murpho

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120964354#Comment_120964354

Never said it did.

I’m simply pointing out that stopping and parking ARE NOT the same thing. The Garda was wrong in this case.

I’m simply pointing out that the UK recognise the difference between stopping and parking, hence the distinction between double yellows and double reds.

Peregrinus

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120964398#Comment_120964398

Mmm. They're not necessarily different things either.

I think they are overlapping concepts. At one extreme, stopping at a stop sign or a red light is clearly not parking. At the other extreme, stopping to have a cigarette, read the paper, wait until your scheduled appointment time, etc, clearly is parking.

I have suggested above that reg. 39 indicates that stopping to set down or pick up a passenger would be parking. Generalising from that, if you stop the car to attend to any business or activity that isn't driving, that's parking. But if you stop the car because it would be impossible, unsafe, unlawful, etc to proceed, that's not parking.

Trampas

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120964398#Comment_120964398

In your opinion they are wrong. Make sure you report back how the court case goes as I think we are all interested in this one.

g g murpho

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120965197#Comment_120965197

I’m not the driver in question 🤡

wandererz

Why not put in a query to the RSA for clarification or to the Taxi Association.

dickdasr1234

Has common sense become a thing of the past?

A taxi driver spots a customer at the side of the road, but it's double yellow for a 100 yards. If he pulls over, winds down his window, and tells her she needs to move 100 yards down the road, does he get done for parking?

I have seen umpteen cars momentarily pull over to drop passengers off on South Great George's Street (and have done it myself) with nary an issue.

If a judge has a problem with such behaviour from a driver conducting his daily business, the law is truly an ass.

I'd be taking it to court.

Seth Brundle

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120965439#Comment_120965439

A taxi driver spots a customer at the side of the road, but it's double yellow for a 100 yards. If he pulls over, winds down his window, and tells her she needs to move 100 yards down the road, does he get done for parking?

I would imagine that it is because in general taxi drivers (and many regular drivers) have a sense of entitlement that they can do as they wish on the roads, so why would they need to ask a fare to walk down the road.

I have seen umpteen cars momentarily pull over to drop passengers off on South Great George's Street (and have done it myself) with nary an issue.

South Great George's Street is a perfect example of why we need double yellows and fines for drivers stopping (parking) along it - I'm surprised someone would choose it as an example against double yellows!

If a judge has a problem with such behaviour from a driver conducting his daily business, the law is truly an ass.

That's the sense of entitlement that I referred to in my first paragraph! Someone conducting their daily business does not give you permission to break the law.

the.red.baron

id be going to court too, picking up dropping off is not parking

Witcher

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120966048#Comment_120966048

“park”, in relation to a vehicle, means keep or leave stationary, and cognate words shall be construed accordingly;

Section 3(1), RTA 1961

Again, unless the OP kept the car moving, he was parked.

Charles Babbage

Are passengers not the goods that taxi drivers are licensed to pick up?

dickdasr1234

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120966044#Comment_120966044

I break laws on a regular basis.

The bus lane on the Oscar Traynor Road, for instance. Idiotic planning to the extent that local Gardai ignore trespassers.

100kph on the M50 in light traffic on a clear dry day?

80kph on a dual-carriageway flyover with the original heavily-populated road going under it legislated to be legal for 100kph (if you're insane)?

There are many speed limit anomalies throughout the country.

40kph along the Quays after the last pedestrian crossing at the bridges? Why?

80kph through several pedestrian crossings on the Tallaght bypass?

EchoIndia

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120966402#Comment_120966402

What's idiotic about the bus lane on the OT Road? I don't like it either but I struggle to see how it's different from lots of other bus lanes. There is often a camera van at the eastbound lane just after the motorway slip road and that suggests that some policing of compliance is being undertaken. It certainly leads to car drivers not shooting into the bus lane there.

pgj2015

Very petty of the Guard in my opinion, 2 points for that is crazy, best of luck, hope it gets thrown out in court. no judge will be happy to see you get 2 penalty points over that non event.

my local train station this week, people parked on the footpath all day to head off to the Fleadh, no tickets issued but this guy stopped for a few seconds and gets treated this way, bad form.

dont mind all the people who seem delighted by your run in with the Guard, they are just taxi driver haters, as if none of them ever did similar.

Taxi drivers have to pick people up in awkward locations at times, nature of the job, the guard should have had some consideration and cop on.

Its like one time a female Guard started roaring at me for stopping in town on a very busy night, as I was driving through the town, a group of people approached me in the middle of the road, they stood right in front of me, obviously I stopped, what else could I do? she roars at me "you cant stop there" ah what am I supposed to do run them over?

elperello

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120965439#Comment_120965439

Common sense is often uncommon as in this case.

A taxi is an SPSV not a private car.

It makes no sense to be prosecuting an SPSV from fulfilling it's function by picking up a member of the public.

asaptaxi

People can hay an spsv on their own location. Should the driver, then ask the customer to keep walking till you reach a place without double yellow lines?

AndrewJRenko

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120967347#Comment_120967347

And by 'have to pick people up in awkward locations' you mean 'don't bother their arse finding a safe, legal location' presumably.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120969019#Comment_120969019

Well, yes.

pgj2015

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120969244#Comment_120969244

Yes, sometimes you have to stop to accommodate elderly people who cant walk far, I stop in one way streets often, has to be done as there is zero parking in my local town, the cars behind just have to wait, thats the way it is, I dont mind if it happens with other motorists. im lucky the Guards are very easy going usually in my local town and in Ireland in general.

machiavellianme

You "came down" - does that mean you got out of your car? If so, you parked and illegally so if still on the double yellow lines. Read the rules of the road and follow them in future.

Jim2007

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120963629#Comment_120963629

You are the taxi driver, you should know the rules and if you don' then YOU are the one who needs to go and look them up and when you do you can come back and tell us. Otherwise what you are basic telling us is that you should not be on the road.

pgj2015

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120971954#Comment_120971954

No she didn't. I would love if she had tried to give me a ticket, I have dash cam and cctv in the car.

whomitconcerns

Is this not the section for boards.ie feedback and questions?

Shield

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120973051#Comment_120973051

Mod: Moved from Feedback to Current Affairs/IMHO.

-Shield

Nigzcurran

To be honest if the taxi was not blocking the road and only stopped very briefly I dont see the problem, I reckon there is a bit more to this story that the op has not told us

Ezeoul

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/2058308882/double-yellow-lines-for-taxi-pick-up

Where does the OP state the garda was female?

And what difference does it make if they were?

The J Stands for Jay

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120966261#Comment_120966261

No

Beefcake82

While still in your car you were only "stopped" on double yellow lines for pickup, however you were caught as having parked the second you left your car. By definition parking your car is "the action of bringing a vehicle that one is driving to a halt and leaving it temporarily, typically in a car park or by the side of the road." and as you left your car to engage the guards they had cause at that time to cite you for parking, which there is no recourse for.

Had you remained in your car and passenger quickly entered and you drove away, i would say it is unlikely you would have picked up a fine/points.

Seth Brundle

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120973666#Comment_120973666

The mysoginistic and abusive replies were in relation to this post...

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120967347#Comment_120967347

prunudo

And then the gardai wonder why they loose the respect of the general public. A person who was out trying to earn a living, stopped for a brief period to pick up a fare. Yes you're not allowed park on double yellow line, but if the garda was any way decent, they'd have a short chat, explain its not permitted and not to do it again. Why get normal peoples backs up while scumbags run rampage in the city, easy targets, that is all.

Killinator

For those unsure, the interpretation section of the 1961 Road Traffic Act states parking is:

“park”, in relation to a vehicle, means keep or leave stationary, and cognate words shall be construed accordingly

bucketybuck

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120964490#Comment_120964490

But stopping at a red light is parking, its just not illegal to do. The phrase "parked at a red light" or "parked at a junction waiting to go" would not be unheard off.