Harassment- Kids Playing and Parents abusive behavior

marauxsal

Hi there,

I am looking for your suggestions and support on an ongoing issue we are facing.

We bought a detached house and moved into an established estate last year. We are in the middle of a row of houses. the house has small fence around the property and shared by other people on either side without a gate. There is a small green area in the front of the property and a common road between the green area and our property with a walkway in the front allowing pedestrians to pass through. We had noticed in the past 6 months the kids on the far side of the estate are playing ball games and hurling constantly running into our front garden and throwing balls on our cars. I made acquaintance with the neighbours after the move and things were fine until I asked the kids to stop coming to the garden and throwing balls on the car. The parents since ganged up on me and my partner and abused us verbally. They do not see anything wrong in playing ball games in our front garden and the hurling. They said they lived there for so long and nothing can stop them from what they are doing now. Since this incident they have ganged on other neighbors that we never met and invited kids from other estates and some are teenagers to continue to target us. It is obvious their behavior is deliberate and they are sitting right in front of my property watching us to harass us and creating noise pollution when we come home to relax. Your home must be your safe heaven and we invested a lot in our property and feeling so helpless. They play until 10pm and all day during weekends and if you have handled similar issues in the past and could you please share some insights as to what steps might help to resolve this issue?

Shield

Mod: Moved to Accommodation & Property. Can’t think of a more suitable forum.

-Shield

spaceHopper

Do nothing schools start back soon and with winter nights they won't be out as much. They are looking for arise from you don't give them one. If it's still and issue in November the talk to the local Gardai and see if they know the family or the kids. There is very little you can do in reality and you don't want to add fuel to the fire.

herbalplants

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/2058308616/harassment-kids-playing-and-parents-abusive-behavior

Ignore them, they are looking for a reaction off you. The more you react the more they act badly. Pretend it doesn't bother you and they will go away.

Ezeoul

Are the kids actually playing within the boundary of your garden (inside the fence) or are they playing on the green area and running into your garden to collect stray balls?

anndub

Are they not just playing ball on the common green? Kids have always and hopefully will always use green areas in housing estates to play. I can see why your neighbours night be upset being asked to stop their kids playing there. Many people specifically buy houses with greens out front so their children have a communal space to play with other neighborhood kids

Xterminator

from what i read te kids are playing on the common green & thats what they are entitled to do. OPs complaint appears to be the kids entering hos property to retrieve balls etc. Again understandable.

so im at a loss why the neighbor's think OP seeks to stop kids from playing where they are entitled to play.

OP the question is why do your neighbors think you want to stop the kids playing on that green. Can you advise what created that impression? Was it something said ? Did you ask kids to stop playing there? Did you ask parents to prevent it?

padd b1975

Lawn sprinkler.

marauxsal

Hi there thanks for your response. We have not asked the kids not to play in the green area but not to enter our property to fetch the stray balls hitting our property.

The issue is getting out of hands at this stage, the parents have placed a big tent infront of our house on the green and constantly stalking us by standing/sitting infront of our bedroom windows. When we asked them to stay away from our property their response is no they can’t which is a total lack of respect and privacy. Secondly they have also passed racist statements and we fear they are deliberately doing this by joining with other neighbors that we haven’t met. Very stressful and frustrating how one can’t see this is trespassing. We have since reported this to thế Garda

Ezeoul

Have any of the parents entered your property? By that, I mean stepped within the boundaries. The green area, and the footpath outside your house are not your property.

To be honest, it sounds like you may have unwittingly caused this to escalate.

Kids playing ball on green areas and running in to fetch stray balls is all part and parcel of normal everyday living in a housing estate.

marauxsal

Hi there yes the parent climbed over the rear fence without our knowledge when we were away and stalking us hence the reason why we are concerned about our safety and privacy. We have mentioned this to Garda and they suggested that I raise a formal racism complaint. It is deeply saddening to say the least that people don’t respect boundaries and others privacy.

herbalplants

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121063607#Comment_121063607

I would be fuming some stranger climbing my rear fence especially when I was away. You have every right to be annoyed. You paid so much for your property and you are entitled to your boundaries. Best you reported to Garda.

Mrs OBumble

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121063607#Comment_121063607

How do you know they climbed the fence?

Giblet

Is this a piss take?

Ezeoul

Why did they climb over the fence? Was it to retrieve a ball?

And how is it racist?

I have to admit I'm finding this all quite fantastical as well.

I think you're being more than a little paranoid, OP.

HazeDoll

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121061557#Comment_121061557

Can you clarify what you mean by 'a big tent'?

And when you say they are in front of your bedroom window, am I correct in thinking this means your bedroom is at the front of the house on the ground floor?

marauxsal

Hi there,

There’s some background to this the neighbor was stalking me for sometime and felt like I was being watched and followed initially didn’t think anything of it but later it was creepy. When we politely asked the neighbors and their kids to stop entering our front garden they used racist language and this was captured in our cctv and hence the reason Garda suggested that we lodge formal complaint. We are two busy professionals living in Ireland for a very long time but never experienced any racism issues to-date. This experience shook us both to the point we have completely last sleep and worried about our safety.

the tent was large enough and could easily accommodate 10 to 12 adults and he think he owns the green area and sat outside my bedroom stalking us.

The above incidents aren’t allegations we have video evidence to back up everything. They have now ganged with neighbors at the rear part of the estate some don’t belong here and allowed teenagers to play now and they are even more dangerous than younger ones.

marauxsal

Yes three of my bedrooms including the living is directly facing the green.

the tent I believe can accommodate 10 to 12 adults easily. This was like a camping site even the passersby’s have asked me about it.

Deeec

OP If I understand the situation correctly you are in a row of houses, there is a road on front of your house and the green area is behind this road. So it seems like a common enough set up. Surely the balls are going into your neighbours gardens aswell.

Are balls constantly being fired at only your house? I find this hard to believe.

Is it such a hassle allowing someone into your garden to get a ball?

Is it a bungalow you are living in considering 3 of your bedrooms are facing this green. If its a 2 story I cant see your issue with the bedrooms.

Why would a tent across the road from your house annoy you so much?

Ezeoul

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121064672#Comment_121064672

What difference do you think it should make, that you are two busy professionals?

You should be aware that there are laws around capturing video of public places, eg the footpath outside your house, the green area, and especially of other peoples' children or anywhere kids are playing.

If your cameras are constantly recording your neighbours' activities, or their children on the green beyond your property, you could find yourself in some hot water.

So, when are you going to lodge that formal complaint?

1874

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121064919#Comment_121064919

Can you quote this law which prohibits video recording of public areas? dont think so

mode1990

My in laws experienced similar issues , they had over a dozen roof tiles busted from a leather football being continuously kicked onto their roof , ceiling s destroyed , it took the promise of a prosecution to put an end to it , however , they ended up moving, that's not an option for most , so cctv cameras to record any harassment, kids today are worse than vipers !

1874

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121064779#Comment_121064779

Not sure how you find it hard to believe someone may have their brats kicking balls at a persons house, sounds very much like the kind of thing petty cowards would have their brats do. While the OP may have unwittingly drawn the attention of the kind of pathetic people that would engage in this by approaching them and thereby highlighting something pathetic people latch onto, Id have suggested a more discreet solution, prickly plants that are hardy and low maintenance, some kind of fence or wall (that may now draw attention for vandalism). If the OP has evidence of someone coming onto an enclosed part of their property which sounds like trespassing and racist comments as well, I wouldnt hold back making a formal complaint, the latter is one of the few things that will get the Gardai off their arses. There is no reason for someone from a group of people who have been asked/told not to come onto your property to then climb a wall of a backgarden boundary. Report the person who made racist comments and likewise for someone getting into your backgarden, no business doing so, Id leave it for a while and disregard kids in the front garden, but consider doing improvements that dont make your garden so readily an extension of a public area.

Ezeoul

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121065380#Comment_121065380

I didn't say recording of public areas was prohibited. Don't put words in my mouth.

I said there were laws about it. Which there are, it's quite a highly regulated area, involving data protection, data processing, GDPR, and ironically, the right to personal privacy which seems to be a huge concern of the OP.

From the Irish Council for Civil Liberties:

The OP needs to ensure their CCTV cameras only record within the boundaries of their own property.

Google it, if you need more specific information.

1874

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121065489#Comment_121065489

Must have hit a nerve, getting tetchy, I didnt put words in your mouth, You said "there are laws around capturing video of public places" You make it sound like there is some law that limits recording but cant quote the law and directing meto google it tells me you know sfa. but still spouting GDPR. You brought it up, so lets hear what the laws are? What are they? There are no laws preventing a private individual putting security cameras on their home, GDPR is spouted as a reason for many things, has nothing to do with a private citizen recording their property for whatever reasons and happens to record a public area in,around or near it, the DPC may advise against it but if the OP has genuine concerns and isnt distributing the recordings (other than to the Gardai) then they havent done anything wrong. The OP at best only needs a small CCTV sticker inside their window highlighting that.

the14thwarrior

i'm finding this a bit hard to believe, most of it.

stalking?? can't see it? a dangerous claim to make and thus if not true, you can see how other neighbours would be annoyed at him. just because someone set up a tent in a common green area opposite your house.

inviting neighbours and teenagers from other estates just to annoy you? i'm sorry i don't believe this.

build a fence, a high one. if you are that irritated by people coming into the garden to retrieve balls, and it can be irritating a bit, but it is normal. so what? if you are that offended by it, good fences make better neighbours

i've no time for racisim, and yes, report it to gardai.

however, with some of the statements being made, it all seems very exeggrated

Ezeoul

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121065552#Comment_121065552

Can you please quote where I said it was prohibited?

Can you also please quote where I said there was a law against it?

I can wait.

In the meantime, the OP needs to be aware that if their CCTV cameras are persistently recording their neighbours and/or their kids activities in public areas as they have alluded to when they said they have "evidence of all of this", then they are leaving themselves open to a claim of harassment - from the neighbours.

I've already provided a screenshot from the ICCL.

1874

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121065653#Comment_121065653

There is no restriction on a private individual having CCTV for security reasons, there is a domestic exemption.

You said "there are laws around capturing video of public places" what are these laws? You insinuate someone might be harassed if they were in a public place and happened to be in view of a cctv camera recording footage. Added to the statement by the OP that racist comments were involved tells you the kind of people they are dealing with. I find it difficult to believe harassment will find any support if a person can simply walk out of view of the cctv. The only consideration a private owner of cctv needs to be concerned about is that their footage doesnt record someone else's private property.

THE ICCL doesn't make laws in this country.

A private person can have CCTV cameras on their property for security reasons, that's a legitimate reason and they dont even need that reason, domestic exemption is included within the GDPR. Private individuals routinely make recordings with cameras, phones, cctv, dashcams in public.

Now, until you come back to me with the law that specifically prevents, or limits or has any influence on someone recording cctv footage (security of your private property is allowed) and there is no right to privacy in public, especially when a person might do as the OP is doing so, then there is no point in me wasting my time engaging with you, you brought it up, lets hear what this law is?

Ezeoul

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121065732#Comment_121065732

Still waiting for you to come back and quote the post where I said it was prohibited.

But you can't, because I didn't say that.

That was your word.

Nor did I say anything about restrictions on installing CCTV cameras on private property or recording on private property, so again, please stop trying to put your words in my mouth.

I referred only to the OPs cameras recording their neighbours in public areas. And if the OPs cameras are doing that persistently (you might want to look up what that means) then they are open to a claim of harassment.

I hope that clears this up for you.

1874

Ok, so you cant provide this non existant law still, goodbye, waste of time

astrofool

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121065653#Comment_121065653

This is what you said:

The OP needs to ensure their CCTV cameras only record within the boundaries of their own property.

The notice does not say that, it say if someone thinks it is harassment, they can report it.

In this case they (the neighbors) would be reporting their own bad behavior that is on record with the garda.

People who throw out GDPR for every little thing without understanding GDPR are the worst (and they often drag unrelated threads off topic while doing so).

Ezeoul

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121065805#Comment_121065805

All your posts here have been a waste of time.

I asked you more than once to back up what you claimed I said by quoting my posts, and you couldn't.

So goodbye to you too. Enjoy the rest of your evening. :)

Mrs OBumble

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121065880#Comment_121065880

Exactly.

When someone quotes the ICCL as a source, you can fairly safely ignore.

OP, if this is your first experience of racism here, you're doing well.

gameoverdude

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121065975#Comment_121065975

That's disgusting. Where was racism involved?

Usual rubbish posts.

Ezeoul

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121065880#Comment_121065880

That is only part of what I said, and I stand over it.

Look, do your own research. Its all online.

If the OP's cameras are persistently recording their neighbours (or their neighbours kids) activities in public areas like on the green or on the road outside their boundary, they could face a claim of harassment.

There is a reason why cameras now come with the ability to set up motion zones and privacy zones. Protecting yourself from claims of invading your NEIGHBOURS privacy being the main one.

As for the alleged bad behaviour? I tend to believe that a lot of what is being claimed is paranoia on behalf of the OP.

Ezeoul

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121066023#Comment_121066023

It was the OP who alleged there was racism involved.

Ezeoul

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121065975#Comment_121065975

Oh, this is rich, coming from one of the most frequently ignored posters on the forum! 😂

gameoverdude

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121066061#Comment_121066061

Sounds like neighbours are right with everything. Trouble.

o1s1n

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121064672#Comment_121064672

Honestly OP this is very hard to decipher.

Either what you are telling is completely true and as you are viewing it, in which case you've unfortunately bought in an awful area with awful people and need to move on ASAP as this will never be resolved.

Or some small issues with local kids have happened during the summer holidays, you reacted which then gave rise to further issues and now you are viewing everything people do in the estate as aimed at you when a lot of it might just be paranoia.

Curse These Metal Hands

I don't see why it's so hard to believe that the OP asked kids to stop coming on their property and then the entitled and ignorant parents threw a few slurs at them because they think because they've lived there longer then they have the run of the place.

The fact that they've set up a marquee/tent on the green suggests they are probably in houses owned by the council.

Ezeoul

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121066072#Comment_121066072

It sounds to me like the OP unwittingly antagonised their neighbours over the kids playing, and now they see everything the neighbours do through a haze of paranoia.

The neighbours are watching them? Stalking them? Recruiting other parents against them? Inviting teenagers from other estates to come over and torment them? Setting up a tent outside their house to watch them?

The one thing I could believe is racist language being used towards them, but other than that, I find this all very, very far-fetched.

There is also a lesson here. If you're going to be intolerant of children playing, then don't buy a house facing a green area.

o1s1n

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121066099#Comment_121066099

I'd say there's a chance it's just somewhere in the middle.

Exactly what you said above has happened, but now everything these people do, the OP feels is directed at them.

Ie; they put up a tent in the green, the OP thinks this is to 'stalk' them when it's probably them just putting a tent up in the green for some other arbitrary reason.

Either way, should hopefully die down once the schools go back/the season changes. Does really sour living in that spot though, not sure I'd be wanting to live there long term with that around me.

Deeec

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121065463#Comment_121065463

Well it appears the OP purchased a house on front of a public green area but doesnt want anyone using this green area! Kids playing is what happens on green areas so Im not sure what the OP expected. I am trying to establish if the OP is the only resident with this issue - they mention that they are in a row of houses - surely this issue is an issue for their neighbours also or is the OP over reacting or being over sensitive. It does sound like the OP perhaps dealt with this situation very badly and it has now escalated.

However racist comments from neighbours is disgusting and should not be tolerated.

Being honest probably the best solution is for the OP to move to a country area- it does sound like they are not suited to living in an estate or a built up area.

Timfy

A little while ago when I was still living in the UK, I owned a lovely large house in the centre of an estate. The estate was a busy loop and we were in a cul de sac in the very centre meaning that it was a quiet place with no traffic. An ideal spot for the local kids to play.

We were located at the end centre of the cul de sac and our garden and driveway made an obvious goal for the local kids. The sound of a ball bouncing of our garage door grew tiresome very quickly and so myself and my neighbour, who shared the driveway, purchased a cheap set of goalposts for the local kids to drag out in front of our drive. The kids returned the little bit of respect we showed by always putting the goalposts away when they finished playing.

Bonus points in that we always got a box of choccys at christmas from them too!

Kids are by their very nature noisy, dirty, sometimes obnoxious little creatures but it is rare enough to find truly bad ones. I know that, looking back, I was a little **** when I was a kid but never acted out of malice. Live and let live!

Racism though, that's just wrong and should be reported on every occasion.

marauxsal

Thank you all for taking the time to respond and for sharing your comments and thoughts.

I understand some of you might think this issue is exaggerated but no one can understand unless you are experiencing the harassment or racism unless you are in that situation so suggest please stay non-judgemental.

Secondly to answer your question about why being in a professional jobs matter- yes it does matter one we have no time for this nonsense second we can’t lower ourselves to their levels of creating issues to harass others. We come to relax and your hOme must be your safe heaven not otherwise.

I find it extremely hard to understand how some of you have started to focus on the CCTV/data protection and forgot about the main issue which is harassment, stalking and racism. I am baffled. I wouldn’t be here looking for suggestions if I felt the issue is petty and I have invested time, money and efforts to develop relationships with these people and to receive this extreme behavior is unwarranted.

Regarding the CCTV, we are aware of its purpose and use and we have a sign up on our property and our neighbors have been advised and they have similar cameras. It is installed to protect our property/us and no data has been captured beyond its purpose so let me end the point there.

The genuine question here what are my legal options and that’s all and if there are none so be it.

We have spent a lot on this property which is a bungalow type with separate driveway and front garden and a small fence outside and asking people stay away from our property is a reasonable ask one may find. This is trespassing and to your answer question the ball doesn’t run into other neighbours property yes it doesn’t but only within our property.

marauxsal

we are not being paranoid about every action and they are deliberately provoking us which had became apparent with every action. Anyways my purpose of coming here is to find solution to this issue.

spaceHopper

@marauxsal you are handling this all wrong. Kids playing on a green is a good think. They will lose the odd ball and will go after it. It's one of their most prized possessions. They have no interest in harassing or stalking you, they just want to get back to playing football. You were advised to do nothing, kids are back to school this week, GAA and Soccer starts back up. There will be a natural drop off in activity. Please listen and take that advice.

We've put tent up on the green for the kids to play in, more than one parent has. They have better things to do that stalk and harrass you, they put big ten up for their kids to use, or to have a neighbourhood street party, lot as estates do this.

The advice still stands, take as step pack and let the winter cool everything down. You are the one escalating this. If you can't take a step back then it won't resolve itself you will only make it worse. At that point you be better for moving.

marauxsal

Hi there thanks so much for your lovely suggestion. I genuinely spent a lot of time, effort and money on our neighbors and their kids. Bought chocolate box and very single weekend for the past 8 months with a hope they would be good and change their behavior but they have total advantage of our good nature and think they own our front garden and our rear garden now which is annoying.

SteM

I don't think anyone will be able to give you the legal options you are hoping for but I'd agree with the earlier posters that the ball playing will stop over the next few weeks as the weather turns and the days get shorter, ignore the kids because no matter what happens you will never win against a bunch of brats.

Personally I would be looking to move rather than live around people that are openly racist but I understand that's not always an option. If the Gardaí tell you to report every racist incident then that's what you should do and hopefully people get whatever punishment they deserve.

marauxsal

Hi there,

I am not the only one with an issue, my next neighbor does experience the same but she is very old cannot do anything about it. We lived in Dublin estates for the past 21 years and are very patient people don’t create noise and best neighbours one could have and that’s the reputation we have developed over the years. We have moved to county side with a Hope of developing and growing old with a community but of course we made a bad decision of choosing a neighborhood that’s not inclusive which is the issue here. We have invested heavily and cannot go anywhere we are struck unfortunately have to face them. One thing we can’t tolerate is harassment so we need to face them otherwise their behavior can only get worse in my opinion.

marauxsal

Thank you so much genuinely appreciate your guidance on this. We never had an issue with kids playing on the green the issue was escalated because he was stalking me and looking through our bedroom windows. It was creepy and hence stopped my club membership. At one point we thought of moving but unfortunately cannot afford to move out given the property price. The neighbors are not inclusive and racists end of story what more can be done. I have exhausted my options here by talking or explaining so need to make a formal complaint so I can’t take this anymore. Thanks again we will follow your guidance for sure