Utility door size is too small to fit a standard washing machine

hypheni

Couple of weeks back before our final move in, I discovered that the utility door under the staircase has less than 60cm door width which cannot accommodate a standard washing machine. When I checked with one of my friends from the same builder's first phase, the size was measured at 69cm. My neighbour are facing the similar issue and the builder has not yet provided any resolution to this. The estate is still under construction and we are the very first few to move in.

As a side note, the intension of the under staircase utility room is to have a washing machine as they have fitted the in-let and out-let for the washing machine with an exhaust fan.

On another note, from my end I did probably most of the things to fit the washing machine, i.e., removed the wooden door, dismantled the washing machine door to make it a bit slimmer but still its not going in. Now, some people might argue why don't I get a smaller machine but is that something builder will decide what would be my family requirement in terms of washing/drying.

Can anyone provide any advice what can be done as a next step? Here next step as in how to deal this kind of things with builder.

DOCARCH

Mad! Can door leaf be taken off temporarily to get the washing machine in? What is measure of door ope frame to frame?

mykrodot

are you not already posting this query on another forum OP, and you got a good few responses there as to what to do, i.e. get a smaller washing machine and the control knob can come off too to allow for getting it in the door sideways?

10-10-20

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120899289#Comment_120899289

In fairness the OP is not looking for a workaround but more-so they are wondering what the next steps are when talking to the builder as the builder hasn't offered a solution yet.

At the end of the day it would seem to me that the builder has put them at a disadvantage in terms of the selection of washing machines and dryers as they are now restricted to <60cm devices.

I suggested that they post here as there would be more experience with dealing with these type matters, rather than on the previous forum.

mykrodot

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120899323#Comment_120899323

ah ok, thanks! I thought it was solutions/workaround.

hypheni

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120899248#Comment_120899248

I should have clarified this in my original post, I did everything, i.e. removed the door, removed the washing machine door as well (yes dismantled the brand new €1,000 washer/dryer just to fit it inside). Frame to Frame the gap is about 59cm and if you keep the door probably only option is to go for some 55cm either width/depth. And yes @10-10-20 is absolutely right, I am looking for suggestion how it can be handled with builder. Why would I do all these when I paid more than €365K for a newly build house..

Water John

Is it a block wall or just timber and plasterboard? The second is the builder gets in a carpenter and plasterer to resize. If it's the first a more difficult problem.

hypheni

I believe its a plasterboard. But the point is how do I convince builder that its a fault and it should have been rectified.

Water John

Somebody didn't think of the obvious. Builder can blame architect or engineer, but it's his problem to fix. Are all monies paid over?

Is it a problem for a group of you?

Odelay

Is this room also the downstairs bathroom?

hypheni

Yes we moved in last week. The room is just an utility area to keep washing machine. The washroom is next to it which is surprisingly big enough.

Gumbo

Another thing to consider. Maybe the space should not be used to contain appliances. The stairs is the escape route.

Is there a risk from fire from this “room” to the underside of the stairs?

Is the house 2 storey or 3 storey. There’s been court cases in Dublin over something similar.

BK5

Will it fit in if you take the door frame out OP?

I had to do that to fit a small chest freezer under my stairs a few years ago.

Jim_Hodge

Washer/dryer under a stairs is a fire hazard.

Ginger83

It's a bad place for appliances but if that is where it is set up for its not a major job for a carpenter to fit a wider frame and door.

Tell the builder that you have purchased a standard size machine which will not fit in the planned location and you expect the issue to be rectified. If more houses have this issue approach the builder together.

emeldc

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120901326#Comment_120901326

Correct. I would have thought the ceiling above the washer/dryer needs to be double slabbed with fire rated plasterboard as the stairway is an escape route.

hypheni

I guess the door that they have provided is fire safe. I can tell that from the weight of it as when I removed the door, it was really heavy.

10-10-20

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120902653#Comment_120902653

Hmm ok. Does the door have strips down the sides, like plastic inserts all down the length of it?

hypheni

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120902662#Comment_120902662

No, nothing like that. Just a normal door with 3 strong metal hinges.

As a matter of interest, why is this a problem for the builder? All they need to say is that the space is designed for slimline appliances.

hypheni

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120902743#Comment_120902743

Yes that's an excuse; If you look at their first phase houses, there the size is 69cm which is about 10cm wider than my one.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120902832#Comment_120902832

Designs get updated between phases though. What's to stop you buying an extra large machine or suite of furniture which won't fit through the front door and blaming the builder because they didn't take it into account?

I fail to see why this is a problem, there are machines available that do fit.

hypheni

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120906681#Comment_120906681

Design should be updated to fix things not break things. We do call this bugs in software development and here in case of building houses, I guess either it was deliberately done because of saving cost by cutting down 10cm door width or simply a real disaster made by the architect or whoever made the choice. I guess most of you is not getting the point here, i.e., dealing with builder which is what I am asking. I have already tried couple of mechanism to dismantle the washing machine and fit it inside but isn't it the builder who should be supporting home buyers in such kind of situations?

After sales support is the key to win reputation and run businesses in long term. I am definitely not gonna leave this here and will take some action for sure. If you cannot feel the problem, please don't say there is no problem.

Again to repeat myself, the question is why would home owners be limited to use a smaller washing machine for a prominent builder's fault.

C3PO

I really don’t fancy your chances OP! I think you would have to prove that the builder claimed that the room would accommodate a “standard width” washing machine which I’m sure he didn’t? I know hindsight is easy but surely you would measure the width of a door before buying an appliance that needs to pass through it … particularly when it is obviously not a full size door?

mulbot

First thing you should do is get a copy of the design plans-that'll show what size that door should be.

Doop

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120915767#Comment_120915767

This is the main point is it built as as designed? it is that design that you agreed to purchase... ie did you get what you paid for?

Gumbo

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120906770#Comment_120906770

Maybe the builder is attempting to limit the use of the space under the stairs to protect you and your family in the case of a fire.

Mellor

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120906770#Comment_120906770

You haven't established that its the builders fault. It coud be, it could be the architect/designers fault, or it could be your fault. All depends on what the contract and documents show.

Do the contract plans show a design for larger than 60cm door, but builder has built ir smaller. If so, it is builders fault.

Do the plans (specifically door schedule) indicate that the door is in fact <60cm with the expectation that it is a standard laundry. Then the designer is likely at fault.

Or do the plans indicate that it is a compact laundry suitable for a given size of washing machine, but you wanted a bigger one. Well, that's not the fault of the design or the builder.

C3PO

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120924131#Comment_120924131

Do most contracts for housing estate builds not include a “get out clause” for design alterations?

Mellor

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120936153#Comment_120936153

I’m actually not sure exactly what you’re getting at tbh.

But if a purchaser made alterations to a design during construction. That would absolutely indemnify the designer abd contractor.

C3PO

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120945184#Comment_120945184

Sorry, what I was trying to say is that I think most contracts for houses in estates have a clause that gives an out to the builder to make design small changes as they deem necessary.

kirk.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120923645#Comment_120923645

In that case surely they wouldn't supply taps

What are the building regulations on this , surely it complies ?

Gumbo

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120947372#Comment_120947372

Taps are different.

The provisions of electrical outlet, waste and water connection would mean it was intestinal alright.

Building regs that apply could be Part B (Fire Safety), protection of the escape stairs. Then subsidiary to that, it’s a higher risk area, so IS3218, Fire Alarm and Detection Systems come into play. But that’s my opinion. Others may be more lax than me.

Mellor

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120947365#Comment_120947365

What do you mean by an "out"?

If the builder changes the design, they are responsible for those changes.

Jim_Hodge

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120948140#Comment_120948140

I think he means that contracts usually have a disclaimer that all measurements aren't exact.

Mellor

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120948216#Comment_120948216

If that's what he means, it's still incorrect.

Measurements can vary within reason as long as what is constructed is compliant and functional. But a full door becoming an 580mm door is not reasonable. I mean, if the washing machine can't fit into the utility, then it isn't functional. May even be non compliant.

greasepalm

If you buy a 4 bedroomed house you would need a big washine machine as loads more washing to do.

1 bed house would have little washing to do but big things are limited in size..

It was an oversight indeed .

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120948302#Comment_120948302

A washing machine can, just not the one the OP wants. Sure you're not even supposed to buy furniture for a new house until you measure it - no point measuring the neighbours or even an earlier phase just in case something has changed. "as built" after all.

Wildly Boaring

Whatever the ins and outs it's a terrible idea.

Washing machines are known to go on fire, more than any other appliance.

You'd be jumping out a first storey window if it happened at night, once you get over the confusion of smoke flying up the stairs in the dark.

sydthebeat

I'd love to see a photo of this door?

StrawbsM

I just went onto curry’s website and the width of all their washer dryers are 590mm and over. If the frame to frame opening is 590 then no washer dryers are getting in.

Appliances don’t last forever. If you need it repaired or replaced, you would have to remove door frame every time just to get the thing out! That’s not good.

Is there nowhere else you can put the appliance and use under stairs for other storage?

muffler

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120948361#Comment_120948361

So would I.

The most talked about door on Boards.

Mellor

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120948355#Comment_120948355

It's one thing if somebody wanted a massive commercial unit and it didn't fit. But if a standard washing machine doesn't fit into a space that is supposed to be for a washing machine. Then there is an obvious issue. As-Built is an excuse to build what you want.

People are advised to measure before buying furniture because people are usually terrible with judging sizes 🤣.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120948361#Comment_120948361

I'm more curious how big the "room" is. Wonder at which point does part M apply?

FJMC

I once had to remove the door and the door stops to get a large fridge freezer into a kitchen.

Appreciate you might not have door stops - possibly a rebated frame - but if so could you remove the rebate and use door stops thereafter.

Not sure if the utility door has a fire performance so you might need to check if that can still be achieved.

There wouldn't be a great deal of difference in cost for a 2' door and a 2'3" door - so not sure why the builder changed the door size unless space was a critical issue - assume this is for a utility cupboard rather than a utility room.

Longer term it might be worth having a larger door - you should probably speak to the builder on this - especially if building is still ongoing - easy enough to modify if they still have people on site. Should be fit for purpose.

F