Strange New Worlds 2x02- 'Ad Astra Per Aspera' ~~ { ** Spoilers Within ** }

Stark

Good episode. Pure Trek at its core.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120751099#Comment_120751099

Nope and I think it would be hard to get right from a continuity standpoint as they were set in the 1990s but various Trek outings since have had time travel back to that era and no sign of a world war. Some vague hints that the 21st century World War III might have been a retcon of the Eugenics Wars (sort of like the Terminator Franchise keeps shifting the date of Judgement Day as the real world overtakes the films).

breezy1985

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120765202#Comment_120765202

It the very end of PIC 2 Wesley makes a joke about how the last time he messed with history he set events back 100 years.

I assume this was an explanation for how PIC 2 took place after what the previously known WW3 date was.

TheValeyard

Think STN alludes in the pilot episode that the Second American Civil War, Eugenics War all eventually become known as WW3.

Think they reconned it cause in Trek timeline we'd all be living through the age of horror now

They've never cleared up the Denoblians. Have they had to stop genetic modification too?

Always preferred if that law had stayed human centric

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120765945#Comment_120765945

That's a strange one.

I would have preferred if they just stuck with their own consistent timeline.

Eugenics wars was Asian based, in the 1990s. Then you had the sanctuary cities and Bell riots around now, and then WW3 which was still being crawled out from in 2063

Considering you have tent cities in major economies and cities, race riots back on the menu, massively spiking cost of living, and accommodation crisis in so many western countries we're not "that" far off what Sisko and Bashir saw in those episodes

pixelburp

That felt like an episode that could only have happened in season 2: no space battles, phasers or high octane adventure; just a pure "ideals Vs the law" court room battle that has often dictated the best of Trek. I feel like SNW had to earn the runway to basically do a really old school Trek episode, earn the audience's trust - and those upstairs.

And that was a cracker, really was. Hands down one of the best of this series so far and wouldn't look out of place in an overall Best of Trek if I'm honest. Really so much to enjoy from it all, and fundamentally acted as a nice little bit of rounding on Oona's character too. Good speeches, some tense back and forth - and all of it underpinning the inclusive ideals Trek aims for, without being obnoxious about it either.

So far so excellent; Treks back, baby.

Gotta love the dedication to recreating all those nostalgic aspects such as the dress uniforms. And the sets were fabulous; really impressive for what is basically an Case of the Week structure. In sure we'll have a bottle episode yet but damn, this is one good looking show.

I am kinda sick how interchangeable Starfleet and the Federation has become in this universe, it's a bit of a quibble.

breezy1985

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120770018#Comment_120770018

The only thing about this that keeps it from being an all time classic is I dont really fell sorry for the augments. IRL we were probably all thinking about homosexuality or racism but in universe the Illyrians could just choose not to mess with their kids which they had promised to stop doing.

My favourite so far has been the one where society sacrifices the child every few years (even they could just fek off to another planet when you think about it)

Cookie_Monster

It was a good, enjoyable watch but felt like a bit of a copy paste from measure of a man tbh

santana75

I have to go against the grain here and say that I thought it was a pretty poor episode. Heavy handed with way too many preachy speeches. I think this is the type of episode that is best placed near the end of a season, preferably after an all out high octane actioner, kind of like a catch your breath episode. I found it contrived and forced.

pixelburp

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120770112#Comment_120770112

They mentioned the "culture" and I think it just needed a little more context through flashback; some sense of why augmentation wasn't just a necessity cos of the planet's environment, but also something established as a social or cultural construct, important to the people as part of their identity. Not sure how you make genetics part of a cultural identity mind you, not in the space of a courtroom episode.

Stark

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120770112#Comment_120770112

I actually really enjoyed some of those more nuanced elements. The Federation is a progressive and inclusive society but like all societies that strive to be progressive and inclusive, it has to tread a line between respecting the culture and traditions of others but also upholding its own moral values. Just as say European societies have to decide what counts as a culture's rights and freedoms and when should child protection overrule those freedoms. And I like how the episode introduced those dilemmas but didn't preach the answer, just left it as something for viewers to reflect on.

TheBigEvil

Couldn't agree more. It was a brilliant episode, everything about it was just spot on, a classic Trek episode, and you do really feel, Star Trek is truly back.

And I loved that they didn't try and dilute the episode with a sideline story, it was focused on one story line, and for me it nailed it.

As you said the attention to detail with the dress uniforms, the crew watching everything that was going on, the real feeling that this crew are a family and have each others back, like Trek of old.

The right balance of tension and humour. Spock apologising for his "Outburst" 😂 in what was pretty much a staring competition, just brilliant.

I don't think I've enjoyed Trek as much in a long long time, probably since DS9.

Long may it continue !

Evade

If the Illyrians have a better grasp of genetic engineering than Earth scientists from the 50s and haven't accidentally created power hungry ubermensch why shouldn't they continue it?

breezy1985

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120770480#Comment_120770480

Well we know in Ireland how the word "culture" can be warped. Honour fights, arranged marriage and the denial of education in the name of "culture"

I have sympathy for No.1 as she had no choice but little for her parents or the lawyer. It was emotional because we can all draw real world meaning for the discrimination aspect but not for in universe reasons.

pixelburp

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120770503#Comment_120770503

Exactly; I didn't think this episode preached at all. Far from it, it tried to put the conundrum in front of the audience, let them think on how to square the circle of inclusivity without prejudice. And it smartly didn't try to upend the table either - maybe canon prevented them? - instead opening the door a crack for other people to peek through, Oona free on a technicality, rather than some grandiose moment where hooray, the Ban on Genetic Manipulation is overturned.

Can't have that and Julian Bashir's parents taking punishment,to keep him in Starfleet

Sleepy

In today's world where the misadventures of 5 idiotic billionaires gets more headlines than the sinking of a refugee boat with 350 on board, I loved how the principle of asylum was brought to the fore. Couldn't have been more timely.

_Kaiser_

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120773704#Comment_120773704

Asylum/economic refugees and their risky attempts to reach new worlds are very much at the fore of most people's minds - in Europe anyway and certainly here at home.. but that's for another thread and indeed forum on this site.

Definitely a solid episode of Star Trek that was far better than the season opener. Couple of good twists but it's hard to feel too concerned when we know the character survives into the TOS pilot. The problem with prequels.

Still, very enjoyable for all that.

corkie

@_Kaiser_ when we know the character survives into the TOS pilot.

Which character and what pilot?

'The Cage' happened before SNW series.

Chronologically, the events of “The Cage” happened in 2254, which is about two years before Discovery Season 1

https://nerdist.com/article/when-does-star-trek-strange-new-worlds-take-place-star-trek-timeline/

Star Trek: Strange New Worlds is billed as the longest pilot-to-series pickup in television history. Technically speaking, the original pilot was shown to Desilu Productions in 1964 and featured Christopher Pike as the captain.

_Kaiser_

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120831744#Comment_120831744

You're right.. With all these reboots and prequels I thought this was set before The Cage. I gave up on Discovery after S2 and have succesfully blanked it all out of my mind. Time for my medication 😂

AMKC

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120831744#Comment_120831744

Maybe for the next big Star Trek Anniversery in 3 years time they could redo that whole episode with the new crew. That is of course hoping that SNW will still be around. I think it will be. That could and would be cool and certainly worth looking into. Who thinks so?

mewso

Late to the party on this. Like the episode a lot but yet again some distrust of the viewer in evidence. We don't need the flashbacks as she is reading out the Starfleet code. We get flashbacks, close ups on Una, looks from her lawyer towards her as it is read out. Do you get it?????

GreeBo

The flashbacks to 5 minutes in the past were a bit heavy handed, but I really liked this one, brought me back to The Measure of a Man from TNG

AllForIt

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120770451#Comment_120770451

I agree totally. At the point it was uncovered she turned herself in I was like oh please pass me the sick bucket.