Strange New Worlds 2x02- 'Ad Astra Per Aspera' ~~ { ** Spoilers Within ** }

ilovesmybrick

Strange New Worlds 2x02- 'Ad Astra Per Aspera' ~~ { ** Spoilers Within ** } Warning: This thread will contain spoilers

AMKC

Just watched it :) .

That was excellent. So much true in it.

Best episode of SNW yet. Real proper Star Trek right there and at its very best. It had me happy and sad and crying too because I too know what it feels like to have to hide one's true self and how hard it can be. Thankfully I do not have to do that anymore and am living as the true me but society still has a long way to go.

It was great to learn a bit more backstory about Admiral Robert April, Captain Pike too and Commandar Una Chin Rileys childhood as well.

Can't wait for the next episode with the full crew back on board.

Agent Coulson

That was brilliant Star Trek at it's very best.

eadrom

I am so here for the emotional Star Trek courtroom drama. Absolutely loved it. World building, character building, moralising, fun, tense, emotional. Perfect Star Trek.

And god this show looks so good. Properly lit, great sets, props, uniforms, and lovely steady shots to soak it all in.

And Spock! "I regret that you had to witness that... outburst" 😂. Falling in love with this character all over again.

10/10.

corkie

https://memory-alpha.fandom.com/wiki/Ad_Astra_Per_Aspera_%28episode%29

Very enjoyable episode and it was paced out well.

Halfway through, I thought they where going to drag it out into 2 episodes.

Edit: -

Continuity

• While on the stand, Spock mentioned meeting Una Chin-Riley for the first time and discovering her love of Gilbert and Sullivan, as depicted in ST: "Q&A".

Spear

It was solid enough, but the basic premise of it being on rails as a court room type episode was always going to limit it a bit.

They kept a decent pace and momentum to it, which would have been easy to lose in this format. A little preachy at points, but kept to a reasonable minimum, but again, the norm for a court room episode.

The main twist was well executed, and the slight detour into attacking Pike kept it a little less linear.

AMKC

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120748700#Comment_120748700

A little preachy at points, but kept to a reasonable minimum, but again, the norm for a court room episode.

Really? Where did you see that? I did not funded any if it preachy.

I thought it was just a brilliantly well executed Star Trek courtroom Drama episode.

Spear

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120749548#Comment_120749548

Just the speeches about past evils being legal etc. Which are valid points and all, but this is the context of me expecting a court room/trial trope episode to lay it on thick. I didn't have high expectations for this one, so saying they kept it to a minimum is me praising it.

PhiloCypher

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120749548#Comment_120749548

I think Spear may be referring to the point where Una's lawyer points out that there were laws on the books about race, gender, sexuality , customs etc and that that doesn't make a law just. It was a bit more on the nose then previous Trek shows from previous eras would have been, but given those previous Trek shows were seemingly so subtle that a worrying amount of fans didn't realise Trek has always been Woke , I don't think it's necessarily a bad thing making the implicit explicit every now and again .

ilovesmybrick

As with the above, I think it's if not one of the nest episodes of SNW, it's one of the better episodes of Trek. And it was fun, I wasnt gone on Spocks quip on the bench, but I honestly laughed when Spock apologised for his outburst early in the episode. It might be a bit of a cliche Spock move, but it landed for me and that's entirely down to Ethan Peck.

I also like that it feels like a proper team, but one that is working in a professional setting. Uhura shooting down Khans log request was a small thing, but I do think it's important. Yeah, she was to an extent protecting her friend from a legally dubious idea, but it's also the rules and I do think it's important to have that too. As was shown in the episode, rules can be broken, but there is a certain chain of command and a way some things have to be done.

Obviously riffing heavily from Measure of a Man, but what harm. That's still a great episode and if you're going to borrow some ideas, borrow from the best and implement them well. Unlike Into Darkness....I do see Spears point, but I will say this is a way to do it right, it's not like Measure of a Man was particularly subtle, but unlike Discovery you don't see them prepping the trowel to laz it on thick.

Also I loved the call back to the utterly ridiculous TOS dress uniform medals. Chefs kiss there.

breezy1985

Keep forgetting it's out Thursday now.

nachouser

Bloody asylum seekers, taking our space jobs.

But yeah, it was a fun ep. And Pike's hair has never been more magnificent.

corkie

https://www.inverse.com/entertainment/star-trek-strange-new-worlds-dress-uniform-the-cage-costume-design-interview

“We actually call the formal dress uniforms on Strange New Worlds, ‘The Menagerie uniforms’,” costume designer Bernadette Croft tells Inverse. “It’s our colors and our fabric, but we’re really leaning into the nostalgia.”

Cool use of the uniforms in the episode.

If you look closely at a photograph in Pike’s quarters in the Season 1 finale, you’ll see the answer. In the photo, Pike and April are rocking very velour, retro Starfleet uniforms. But, Croft reveals this wasn’t a Photoshop trick.

CastorTroy

Not that I've seen them all, but I do enjoy court episodes of Star Trek, for some reason.

Have the Eugenic Wars featured in a season of Star Trek outside of being talked about or having the likes of Khan show up? Surprised it hasn't been done in a multi part time travel series of episodes. Or is it a case of no one would want to do it?

corkie

@CastorTroy Have the Eugenic Wars featured in a season of Star Trek?

https://www.perplexity.ai/search/0f0dfb38-1a66-4cc2-a169-0b7e4cff10fa?s=u

There were a series of (non-canon) novels by Greg Cox that reimagined the 1990s where the Eugenics Wars were happening behind the scenes, but it appears the Picard team decided it’s best to just fudge with the numbers a bit so the Eugenics Wars didn’t happen in the 1990s, so they don’t need to be addressed in the 2024 seen on the show.

Note: - Above link is AI Powered search result.

Has only been talked about, but don't think it has been show. Augments featured in a few episode of Enterprise.

Back to the episode:-

https://www.perplexity.ai/search/89c1d68f-ad90-488b-8d5e-203066e0b896?s=u

Note: - Above link is AI Powered search result.

fritzelly

Wasn't expecting to enjoy a court room based episode but surprisingly entertaining - even the arguments in court

breezy1985

I really enjoyed it. I hadn't really liked Una last season but she was good in this.

I was really expecting the big reveal to be that the lawyer ratted Una out to get her big day in court (although thinking about it they ain't gonna sht on a civil rights lawyer)

Good decision to have last week being able the other officers seeing as this week was very Pike and Una.

Evade

Pretty good episode. It could have easily gone down the too preachy route but kept it to a necessary minimum. Nowthat the crew's all back together hopefully they get out into space for the rest of the a season.

This episode brought up a little more confusion about L'aan. She's descended from the original augments and if she's worried about going all megalomanic doesn't that mean she's still an augment and should also be barred from Starfleet?

TheValeyard

Been a while since we had a court room episode.

Wasn't that fantastic, no pew-pew or boom boom, just dialogue and debate.

Great episode.

corkie

From the wiki entry about her: -

La'an never demonstrated the abilities of an augment, like Khan's enhanced strength, suggesting that after many generations his superior genes had diminished in her family. Also, La'an would not have been allowed to serve in Starfleet if she were enhanced, since the Federation had banned genetic engineering.

Evade

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120751656#Comment_120751656

So it's just an irrational fear then?

Slydice

That was grand. I thought the court bits didn't feel particularly ground break but I really liked how much it reminded me of the Star Trek Prodigy season finale. They even had the Tellarite judge which was nice.

DoctorEdgeWild

Another excellent outing for SNW. This is when Trek is at its best for me. Didn't lay the moralising on too thick, managed to generate some believable TV 'peril' for the crew and the supporting actors were particularly good.

It all worked for me, as has SNW as a whole so far. Looking forward to it every Thursday like I used to look forward to new TNGs and VOYs. Excellent.

These writers get it.

squonk

Really loved this episode. It really brought me back to watching TNG as a kid where you forgot about canon and went along with the laughs and the serious points being put across. I even find myself questioning if I lived up to the ideals of the federation watching this. I think there’s good trek like we get at times and deep core good trek that we get less often and this episode is one of those. Someone I’m going to sit down and compile my top 10 or 20 trek episodes and this could well be featuring.

~Rebel~

That was excellent, thoroughly enjoyed. Really strong start to the season.

MarkR

Pike with 2% oxygen level left: I'll wait. :-)

Great episode. Great world building, the supposed conversation between spock and mean vulcan prosecutor was hilarious, with spocks outburst.

The LGTBQ+ force was strong in this episode, from the passing phrase, to the straps on Una's leg brace.

On passing, Una and her lawyer looked as human as each other. What was the passing stuff?

corkie

The wiki changed the link or something so posting this corrected link: -

https://memory-alpha.fandom.com/wiki/Ad_Astra_per_Aspera_(episode)

Evade

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120754358#Comment_120754358

I think the greenish makeup on the receptionist was intended to be her natural appearance but it didn't really work because it just looked like gaudy makeup.

CramCycle

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120750679#Comment_120750679

Set my alarm for 6pm, back to the good old BBC2 days, no adverts, brilliant.

CramCycle

Fantastic episode,

muckwarrior

SNW continues to be the best Star Trek since the 90s.

Stark

Good episode. Pure Trek at its core.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120751099#Comment_120751099

Nope and I think it would be hard to get right from a continuity standpoint as they were set in the 1990s but various Trek outings since have had time travel back to that era and no sign of a world war. Some vague hints that the 21st century World War III might have been a retcon of the Eugenics Wars (sort of like the Terminator Franchise keeps shifting the date of Judgement Day as the real world overtakes the films).

breezy1985

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120765202#Comment_120765202

It the very end of PIC 2 Wesley makes a joke about how the last time he messed with history he set events back 100 years.

I assume this was an explanation for how PIC 2 took place after what the previously known WW3 date was.

TheValeyard

Think STN alludes in the pilot episode that the Second American Civil War, Eugenics War all eventually become known as WW3.

Think they reconned it cause in Trek timeline we'd all be living through the age of horror now

They've never cleared up the Denoblians. Have they had to stop genetic modification too?

Always preferred if that law had stayed human centric

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120765945#Comment_120765945

That's a strange one.

I would have preferred if they just stuck with their own consistent timeline.

Eugenics wars was Asian based, in the 1990s. Then you had the sanctuary cities and Bell riots around now, and then WW3 which was still being crawled out from in 2063

Considering you have tent cities in major economies and cities, race riots back on the menu, massively spiking cost of living, and accommodation crisis in so many western countries we're not "that" far off what Sisko and Bashir saw in those episodes

pixelburp

That felt like an episode that could only have happened in season 2: no space battles, phasers or high octane adventure; just a pure "ideals Vs the law" court room battle that has often dictated the best of Trek. I feel like SNW had to earn the runway to basically do a really old school Trek episode, earn the audience's trust - and those upstairs.

And that was a cracker, really was. Hands down one of the best of this series so far and wouldn't look out of place in an overall Best of Trek if I'm honest. Really so much to enjoy from it all, and fundamentally acted as a nice little bit of rounding on Oona's character too. Good speeches, some tense back and forth - and all of it underpinning the inclusive ideals Trek aims for, without being obnoxious about it either.

So far so excellent; Treks back, baby.

Gotta love the dedication to recreating all those nostalgic aspects such as the dress uniforms. And the sets were fabulous; really impressive for what is basically an Case of the Week structure. In sure we'll have a bottle episode yet but damn, this is one good looking show.

I am kinda sick how interchangeable Starfleet and the Federation has become in this universe, it's a bit of a quibble.

breezy1985

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120770018#Comment_120770018

The only thing about this that keeps it from being an all time classic is I dont really fell sorry for the augments. IRL we were probably all thinking about homosexuality or racism but in universe the Illyrians could just choose not to mess with their kids which they had promised to stop doing.

My favourite so far has been the one where society sacrifices the child every few years (even they could just fek off to another planet when you think about it)

Cookie_Monster

It was a good, enjoyable watch but felt like a bit of a copy paste from measure of a man tbh

santana75

I have to go against the grain here and say that I thought it was a pretty poor episode. Heavy handed with way too many preachy speeches. I think this is the type of episode that is best placed near the end of a season, preferably after an all out high octane actioner, kind of like a catch your breath episode. I found it contrived and forced.

pixelburp

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120770112#Comment_120770112

They mentioned the "culture" and I think it just needed a little more context through flashback; some sense of why augmentation wasn't just a necessity cos of the planet's environment, but also something established as a social or cultural construct, important to the people as part of their identity. Not sure how you make genetics part of a cultural identity mind you, not in the space of a courtroom episode.

Stark

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120770112#Comment_120770112

I actually really enjoyed some of those more nuanced elements. The Federation is a progressive and inclusive society but like all societies that strive to be progressive and inclusive, it has to tread a line between respecting the culture and traditions of others but also upholding its own moral values. Just as say European societies have to decide what counts as a culture's rights and freedoms and when should child protection overrule those freedoms. And I like how the episode introduced those dilemmas but didn't preach the answer, just left it as something for viewers to reflect on.

TheBigEvil

Couldn't agree more. It was a brilliant episode, everything about it was just spot on, a classic Trek episode, and you do really feel, Star Trek is truly back.

And I loved that they didn't try and dilute the episode with a sideline story, it was focused on one story line, and for me it nailed it.

As you said the attention to detail with the dress uniforms, the crew watching everything that was going on, the real feeling that this crew are a family and have each others back, like Trek of old.

The right balance of tension and humour. Spock apologising for his "Outburst" 😂 in what was pretty much a staring competition, just brilliant.

I don't think I've enjoyed Trek as much in a long long time, probably since DS9.

Long may it continue !

Evade

If the Illyrians have a better grasp of genetic engineering than Earth scientists from the 50s and haven't accidentally created power hungry ubermensch why shouldn't they continue it?

breezy1985

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120770480#Comment_120770480

Well we know in Ireland how the word "culture" can be warped. Honour fights, arranged marriage and the denial of education in the name of "culture"

I have sympathy for No.1 as she had no choice but little for her parents or the lawyer. It was emotional because we can all draw real world meaning for the discrimination aspect but not for in universe reasons.

pixelburp

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120770503#Comment_120770503

Exactly; I didn't think this episode preached at all. Far from it, it tried to put the conundrum in front of the audience, let them think on how to square the circle of inclusivity without prejudice. And it smartly didn't try to upend the table either - maybe canon prevented them? - instead opening the door a crack for other people to peek through, Oona free on a technicality, rather than some grandiose moment where hooray, the Ban on Genetic Manipulation is overturned.

Can't have that and Julian Bashir's parents taking punishment,to keep him in Starfleet

Sleepy

In today's world where the misadventures of 5 idiotic billionaires gets more headlines than the sinking of a refugee boat with 350 on board, I loved how the principle of asylum was brought to the fore. Couldn't have been more timely.

_Kaiser_

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120773704#Comment_120773704

Asylum/economic refugees and their risky attempts to reach new worlds are very much at the fore of most people's minds - in Europe anyway and certainly here at home.. but that's for another thread and indeed forum on this site.

Definitely a solid episode of Star Trek that was far better than the season opener. Couple of good twists but it's hard to feel too concerned when we know the character survives into the TOS pilot. The problem with prequels.

Still, very enjoyable for all that.

corkie

@_Kaiser_ when we know the character survives into the TOS pilot.

Which character and what pilot?

'The Cage' happened before SNW series.

Chronologically, the events of “The Cage” happened in 2254, which is about two years before Discovery Season 1

https://nerdist.com/article/when-does-star-trek-strange-new-worlds-take-place-star-trek-timeline/

Star Trek: Strange New Worlds is billed as the longest pilot-to-series pickup in television history. Technically speaking, the original pilot was shown to Desilu Productions in 1964 and featured Christopher Pike as the captain.

_Kaiser_

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120831744#Comment_120831744

You're right.. With all these reboots and prequels I thought this was set before The Cage. I gave up on Discovery after S2 and have succesfully blanked it all out of my mind. Time for my medication 😂