Titanic tourist submersible goes missing with search under way

scotchy

Hopefully a good outcome ahead.

Sub named Titan.

https://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-65953872

Just catching it now. Not looking good at all. I had no idea this was a tourist attraction, surely a wildly dangerous activity at a remote location and deep depth!

Atlantic Dawn

Hopefully they have enough onboard to bring them to the surface themselves, I fear they are on their own for solutions.

The NATO sub rescue system can only operate at depths up to 1000m, Titanic is nearly 4000m down, for context the Kursk rescue was only in depths of 100m and that failed.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/NATO_Submarine_Rescue_System

kirk.

Don't think there's anything they can do to help at that depth

Bizarrely uses an Xbox remote to pilot it apparently

knucklehead6

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120737261#Comment_120737261

If space is a tourist attraction, why not titanic? I’m sure that only for the fact that they are war graves and as such still owned by the countries under whose flag they fought that bismark, hood and all the other recently discovered deep sea wrecks would be regarded in the same light

either way, at this stage, with no news it looks like titanic has company at the bottom of the sea

kirk.

https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2023/jun/20/veteran-titanic-explorer-concern-missing-submersible-sub

Reading up on MIR1 and 2 , the second sub was specifically used as backup.

No such system in place with Titan

https://www.encyclopedia-titanica.org/anatoliy-sagalevich-interview-1.html

"Why were two Mir submersibles involved in the filming of the movie “Titanic”?

Working with two submersibles is more reliable, safe and efficient. The second submersible is able to free from the cable or net, bite the cable wound on the propeller. and sure, lighting from two submersibles is better as it was necessary to illuminate the wreck during the movie "Titanic" filming. "

The submarine itself seems very sketchy. You couldn't pay me to get into it.

The construction was plagued with problems including the discovery of cyclic fatigue in the hull. It seems to be running everything (systems, propulsion, comms) off a Windows computer with bluetooth gamepad (!) for steering. I can't see any backup equipment.

It takes two hours to get to Titanic depth and they lost communications at 1hr 45. So they were already extremely deep. I would say they're goners.

emo72

And even if they reached the surface they can't open the hatch from inside. So they will run out of air. Crazy dangerous.

kirk.

They're only doing the basics on the surface , scanning the ocean for the vessel and listening for signals

They won't send anything down there

Has to be seen as a failing not implementing a system like mir with backup vessel on site so to speak

GreeBo

seems they have 2 days of oxygen on board

but pings every 15 minutes seems crazy to me, you could travel a long way in 15 minutes an no one would have a clue

magicbastarder

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120737964#Comment_120737964

assuming power failure say, what would the buoyancy of that thing be? woudl it sink or start to rise?

would it have the equivalent of the lead weights divers carry?

AndyBoBandy

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120738019#Comment_120738019

It would probably depend on ow it was trimmed.. i.e. trimmed to descend (sink) means it will keep descending), but trimmed to ascend, they it would probably keep ascending till it became bouyancy neutral of reached the surface... whatever came first.

and if it was power failure, and the heating system went down, it would get pretty cold pretty fast....

Sad to say, but I'd guess they are long dead at this stage.... and most likely just a few seconds/minutes after losing contact.

Water John

Yes it has weights, which are set to automatically be jettisoned after a certain period of time.

Furze99

I have kinda more sympathy for the several hundred people lost in the trawler off Greece. Than those who can afford a quarter million bucks on a sight seeing trip like this. But no doubt the focus of the western media will be all over this for next few days.

magicbastarder

cheers, i would have assumed (in my ignorance) that jettisoning those weights would have a manual override.

Homer

Sky news reporting that the waiver you have to sign mentions death at least three times on the first page!

knucklehead6

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120738058#Comment_120738058

There is a manual override. The submarine itself is made to be buoyant, it’s the weights that bring it down then they are jettisoned when you want to go back up.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120738019#Comment_120738019

It carries ballast - in photos you can see some semi-circular weights hanging off the bottom on chains. It would be neutrally bouyant at the intended exploration depth. In theory you jettison the ballast in an emergency and it floats back to the surface.

I heard somewhere there is also an automatic release mechanism for the ballast after 24hr.

Alun

On the BBC just now they were saying the weights could be jettisoned using a manual hydraulic system that cuts through cables attaching them to the sub.

screamer

For sure the wreck of the titanic must be amazing to see, but I wouldn’t have the b@LLS to get into a submersible to see it, even if I had the money!

I find it totally ironic that this submersible had no backup sub when visiting a ship where such a devastating loss of life occurred because they hadn’t enough lifeboats.

at those depths with that much pressure, I don’t think there’s anything much can be done to recover the sub unfortunately, but thats the risks I suppose.

kirk.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120738122#Comment_120738122

James Cameron was down there ,.not sure how many times but the MIR had backup and 2 was used to dislodge 1

Had tools outside to work on issues

Outside of that system you're goosed down there ,no rescue going to happen only on surface

CreadanLady

Like, If they found the sub, could they drop a very long line down to the seabed in it's general location, then use one of those subs with claw arms and the like to attach the line to the stricken sub and then winch it up to the surface?

loyatemu

if you're paying for this sort of trip (or to go into space) then it's probably a sign that you have too much money. Nonetheless most of the passengers were crew, hopefully they can re-surface and be found, seems like their only hope.

fergal.b

It seems more like something I would build in my backgarden to get to the bottom of lough Ree than something built to go to that depth, it should have mutable backup systems and tracking. Hopefully there will be a good outcome 🙏

miamee

A little more detail on what the sub looks like. That would be a no thank you from me no matter what I was going to see.

https://twitter.com/SuchandrikaC/status/1671018948513366016?t=uDzHkZpEDJqKxvWgOcGDCw&s=19

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120738162#Comment_120738162

I'm an engineer and thinking of those depths and pressures and using the phrase "off the shelf components" to build the yoke bloody terrifies me.

"Not approved or certified by any regulatory body"

These people are insane.

CreadanLady

I wouldn't go to the bottom of the Shannon in that thing. Cobbled together using pieces from a second hand xbox and camper parts.

Pressure down there is 400 bar. That is mad. The net force squeezing in on the roughly 50m2 of hull is staggering at that depth. Back of fag pack calc gives 198,000 tons squeezing in all around you.

My bet is it simply imploded. They would have been killed absolutely instantly, without even been aware that something was going to go wrong. Crushed and utterly pulverised in the blink of an eye. There are likely going to be no bodies, just scraps of debris found. Its essentially the same as if a bomb went off.

kirk.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120738142#Comment_120738142

I would say no for a number of obvious practical reasons

kirk.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120738185#Comment_120738185

That's what I was thinking too

The MIR was built by the swedish probably to tight military specs

That thing who knows

AndyBoBandy

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120738142#Comment_120738142

The issue is there are not many remote subs that can even operate at that depth to attach cables if they were lucky enough to find it (needle in a field full of haystacks springs to mind), and the chances of getting one of them out to that location in the next 24 hours or so would be slim to none..

If they are submerged, they are on their own. if they are floating on the surface, they have half a chance.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120738210#Comment_120738210

I agree. It's very sad but if they were lucky it was all over before they knew anything was wrong.

Deeec

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120738162#Comment_120738162

Jaysis that is frightening. Very amatuer - it seems safety and mechanical engineering wasnt a priority at all. The laughing and skitting through that video was very irritating. I really do hope though that there is a good outcome.

Not a chance would I have go in that thing!

AndyBoBandy

yeah, having seen that video linked a few posts above...... sorry to say but they are lost.

sniperman

megalodon

the.red.baron

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120738185#Comment_120738185

its like a light in there and a controller

why would you not go off the shelf for that

i'd be more worried about the non off the shelf stuff and the 1200 meters of water

AndyBoBandy

Text messages!!!

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120738297#Comment_120738297

That controller is fine for messing on a computer game in your front room. A sticky button or a minor electrical noise or signal issues wont be noticed.

Not for when your whole life depends on it to control a submarine at crush depth.

the.red.baron

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120738325#Comment_120738325

id wager at least 20 yoyos that the failure point wont be the off the shelf controller or light

in fact they might be the only certified things on the sub

it will be the items not off the shelf items

its not like the light or controller would be under any undue pressure

iwillhtfu

A very sad incident the only hope would be as they suggest the sub has resurfaced and is adrift at sea.

A literal needle in a hay stack to try recover at that depth.

kirk.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Striver_%28bathyscaphe%29

Few of these type vehicles around and have been a lot deeper 10km but presumably a lot better built and specced .Chinese government machine

Weird how all communication is lost ,doesn't seem right. I know communication is difficult but I'd have assumed there was failsafe systems , maybe not

the.red.baron

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120738354#Comment_120738354

you would have to say this carry on is beyond stupid right?

josip

Although people have commented on the $250,000 per passenger, does anyone else find that ridiculously cheap?

How many paying passengers per dive, 3?

So the submersible and the support vessel all have to be funded by less than a million dollars? Something doesn't add up.

knucklehead6

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120738354#Comment_120738354

I’d actually consider that worse. Bobbing around in the ocean, not able to open the hatch, slowly suffocating.

nope. I’d prefer a pressure related incident, all over before you knew something was wrong

the.red.baron

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120738303#Comment_120738303

its under 1k of water, how else do you think they should communicate?

iwillhtfu

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120738372#Comment_120738372

Looking at the videos of the sub I'd see no joy in going down to look at a wreck through a tiny window that will no doubt be fogged of masked with sand. Kind of reminds me of those glass bottom boats on holidays, not exactly what you envisaged. 🤷‍♂️

HeidiHeidi

I haven't read the links, and don't want to - but had this thing been down to that depth before or was it its first dive for real? (I'm tempted to use another, more familiar phrase but I won't).

Christy42

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120738364#Comment_120738364

Any sort of communication device has to be on the sub. So if the sub gets destroyed then all back ups also go down.

iwillhtfu

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120738389#Comment_120738389

I'm not sure either would be preferable but as someone mentioned previously and based on how quickly they lost the vessel. I'd say they went down and are likely lost to us.

the.red.baron

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120738377#Comment_120738377

a million quid per dive doesn't seem that bad

I mean if it cost say 50 per day to run the support ship, that would seem excessive no? probably less than 20k

That video is astonishing. Reminds me of some contraption a couple of overenthusiastic & “carefree” tech heads would put together with a raspberry pi & some discarded parts. The pax signed their lives away, I’m afraid.

Royale with Cheese

Play stupid games win stupid prizes. These are probably the same people who pay huge money to stand in a queue at the top of Mount Everest.