Suing your Property Management company

Long Sean Silver

Not sure if this topic has been covered before. Apologies if so...

I am the owner of an apartment in a block of apartments. As is the norm, a property management company has been contracted to manage the day to day running of the block. A leaking roof has been reported over 2 years ago, but to date nothing has been done and the roof continues to leak, resulting in ongoing damage to the apartment and it's inhabitant's property. Repeated attempts have been made to work with the Management company, but to no avail. Emails and phone calls are ignored. Little or no attempt has been made to fix the leak.

Am I within my rights to sue the Management company for negligence and/or failure to fulfil their contractual obligations? Would this be the best course of action having exhausted all others? What damages if any am I likely to get?

Geuze

You are a member of the OMC.

Would it not be the OMC who should chase up the managing agent for not doing work?

L1011

As a member of the OMC, I believe you cannot sue it as you cannot sue yourself.

The OMC can take actions against its management agent, however.

You need to sepearate/clarify who you were talking to here, the management agent (who is contracted by the OMC) or somoene involved with the OMC?

Long Sean Silver

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120426049#Comment_120426049

Yes we (the Owners Mgt Company) have tried repeatedly to chase up the Property Management company/Agent without success.

Long Sean Silver

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120426078#Comment_120426078

I am talking about the Property Management Company/Agents appointed by the Owners. They the agents have been appointed/contracted to carry out repairs and look after the day to day management of the block.

AndrewJRenko

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120426088#Comment_120426088

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120426090#Comment_120426090

First step would be for the owners to change the Managing Agents, give the contract to a different agent.

markpb

There are three relevant parties here: the owners, the board of directors (who are also owners) and the agents (who are appointed by the board of directors). You need to determine who isn’t doing the repair work. If it’s the agent, then the best course of action is for the board to fire them and hire a new agent. If it’s the board, the best thing is to call an EGM and find out why or replace the board. It’s possible that there’s a reason the work hasn’t been done (lack of funds) but this doesn’t explain the lack of communication with the affected owners.

I own my apartment plus another in a different area, and there are annual OMC meetings, which in my experience are always attended by at least one person from the property management agency. I presume you have brought this issue up at these meetings, and what has been the response?

Long Sean Silver

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120427147#Comment_120427147

Yes I attended the AGM. The issues was discussed and the Board of Directors of the OMC and the representative of the Managing Agents all resolved to survey the roof, get an estimate for works required, and then proceed to repair the roof.

My problem is that was 3 months ago, and despite repeated attempts to move things forward, nothing has been done. It is almost impossible to speak to someone, they rarely/never return phone calls or emails. All I am getting is empty promises with no action.

Long Sean Silver

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120426302#Comment_120426302

No question the Property Managing Agents are the ones who have dropped the ball on this. From my experience they are about as much use a an ashtray on a motorbike.

When it comes to planting a few flowers, or sending a circular about bikes parked in the hallway they are great. But ask them to carryout some urgent repairs to the fabric of the building and they go missing.

I know there is a regulatory body called the Property Services Regulatory Authority, based in Meath. Do you think I should report this issue to them? or a least threaten the Agents with this?

Count Dracula

Highly unlikely to get it fixed whining on about it here?

i am astonished that no action has been taken in 2 years, what are you up to?

AndrewJRenko

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120427698#Comment_120427698

Have you spoken to the Directors of the management company, your fellow owners, about the lack of progress?

markpb

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120427698#Comment_120427698

Owners can’t request the MA to do any work that requires spending money, only the directors can do that. You need to get to the bottom of why the work isn’t being done. It’s possible that the directors don’t believe it’s the OMC responsibility, that they’re waiting for the OMC insurance to process the claim, that there isn’t enough money to pay for it or it’s possible that the MA aren’t bothered. I suspect it’s unlikely to be the last one. You need to find out what’s going on before you assume it’s the MAs fault. The regulator will probably tell you the same thing.

Long Sean Silver

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120427879#Comment_120427879

Yes one of the Directors has been most helpful and pursued the MAs on my behalf. She too has run up against a wall of excuses, inaction and silence.

Long Sean Silver

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120428105#Comment_120428105

The Directors are aware it's their responsibility and have tried to pursue the matter with the MAs, but have gotten nowhere. I know there is a sinking fund to cover these maintenance issues, but for some reason the MAs seem reluctant to spend it !??

Count Dracula

As a member and co-owner of the management company op, it is actually your responsibility to follow this shambles up.

Get the finger out pal, that roof must be stinking something fierce?

micosoft

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120428238#Comment_120428238

Andrew is volunteering his time. If you feel so strongly stand for the board of directors and then move to persuade the other directors to remove the existing agent for a new one on the basis of lack of responsiveness. I had to do this to remove the agent appointed by the builders. I suspect you aren't keen on doing that hard work though are you? Shouting about suing people is unhelpful and as ever I suspect there is much more to the story here. Have you bothered (and I'll assume not) look at the accounts? Do you know how large the sinking fund is? How many neighbours (you?) have not paid their dues? etc etc. The agent can't spend money that's not in the management company can they?

minimary

@Long Sean Silver I own a flat in a complex thats rented out to students.

Back before they started doing electronic transfers, I misplaced one of the cheques they sent me. When I went to do my yearly accounts I discovered it but by then the cheque was out of date.

It was entirely my fault that that happened. I contacted the property managers, apologised and asked that the cheque be reissued, chatting to a lovely woman, no problem, she would reissue it. It never arrived so I contacted them again and the woman I had talked to had left the company but a colleague had taken over her workload. For 2 years he kept telling me the cheque was coming, I contacted him every few months about it by email it never arrived.

I was at the end of my tether and I made a complaint to the PSRA, the owner of the property management company rang me the next day, apologised and offered me the money I was owed and compensation to withdraw my complaint to the PSRA.

I would start with the PSRA rather than going down the solicitor route. It sounds like you've made a good faith effort to contact them. I assume you're paying them handsomely for their services

AndrewJRenko

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120428238#Comment_120428238

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120428250#Comment_120428250

The question goes back to the Directors so, as to what they’re going to do about the non-performing agents.

goingnowhere

The MA's contract is unlikely to cover supporting the management of major structural works...

The MA is instructed by the directors, if they are unable or unwilling its up the directors to acknowledge they are responsible per the companies act and it get on with it

Solution is simple enough

1. Get an engineers out to inspect
2. What is the status of the block, is the developer still on the scene?
3. Dose the 6 year statue of limitation apply to the roof?
4. Is this just general wear and tear, storm damage or poor workmanship
5. The engineers report will advise on what needs to be done
6. Get 3 quotes
7. Call EGM to approve and seek sinking fund contribution

apache

My management fees went up by €500 this year. Shocker. They are over the 2000 mark now.

Long Sean Silver

I would like to thank everyone who contributed, the overwhelming majority of which were helpful and constructive.

The OMC Directors have done everything possible to resolve the issue, but the MAs are being totally uncooperative. We have detailed records of all communication to them, photos of the leakage, damage to property etc. Something's not right, either the money is not there (although the Accounts seem to indicate it is), or it has been mismanaged in some way. Why else would they be so reluctant to utilise it? The MAs are contractually obliged to maintain the property, and use the sinking fund as needs require.

I will report them to the PSMA, who hopefully can carryout an investigation. Failing that I will pursue them under the MUD Act 2011 and seek compensation for negligence and failure to act to maintain the property.

Long Sean Silver

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120428349#Comment_120428349

A leaking roof is hardly a major structural task. The MAs are contractually obliged to maintain the property. They cannot just refuse having entered into a contract to do so. If they do, then they can be pursued and compensation sought.

Long Sean Silver

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120428490#Comment_120428490

most can now be convened via zoom from the comfort of your armchair.

Dav010

As a former Director of an OMC, I can only give you an account of my own experience in situations like yours op.

MA’s are overpaid for what they do and are slow to act unless pushed by the Directors.

The main reason for delays in building works is due to two reasons, difficulty in getting builders to do jobs, and lack of funds due to members not paying their subs. I suspect the former is an issue at the moment, getting a roofer is nigh on impossible.

But suing the OMC is not an option as you are effectively suing yourself and will make you about as popular as a fart in a car.

Del2005

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120428460#Comment_120428460

Why haven't the directors changed the MA if they aren't responding to them? You've had 2 AGMs since the roof started leaking and no one has proposed replacing a company that you are paying money to who aren't doing what they are paid to do.

Dav010

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120428859#Comment_120428859

The op needs to establish the circumstances under which the MA aren’t doing what they are paid to do, is it that they can’t get a roofing contractor to do it, or the money isn’t there to do it.

Long Sean Silver

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120428582#Comment_120428582

i am

Long Sean Silver

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120428814#Comment_120428814

only i do not propose suing the OMC. i intend to sue the MA (who are a different legal entity) for failure to maintain the property as contracted to do.

i do take your point though that finding a competent roofer is very difficult atm.

Long Sean Silver

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120428896#Comment_120428896

one of the reasons they've given is the difficulty in finding a roofer. but 2 years to find a competent roofer seems like an excuse to me, not a reason.

AndrewJRenko

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120428966#Comment_120428966

You have no relationship with the MA to sue them. You have a relationship with the OMC, and the OMC has a relationship with the MA. You need to establish why the OMC isn’t taking action against the MA, whether sueing the MA or replacing them as MA.

The MA wouldn’t have access to the funds of the OMC , unless the OMC has explicitly allocated funds for this work.