Is it a bit disrespectful to excercise a dog at the grounds of a war memorial ?

sxt

I was wondering others opinion

I happened to visit the national war memorial garden in dublin a fewvt8mes recently. Every time i visited ,there were dogs there with their owners. One time with a Frisbee, another time a dog was lifted 5 feet to play in one of the empty fountains, another time a big Alsatian walking through the rose garden area

Would you consider that a bit disrespectful or would you consider it much ado about nothing

Jequ0n

Not Disrespectful

Why would it be disrespectful? Dogs have served in wars for a long time.

sxt

It just wouldn't feel right to me to bring my dog to a place like that to play

HazeDoll

Not Disrespectful

Such a strange thought process.

Baffling.

ZX7R

As long as they pick up dog feces I can't see a problem.

growleaves

Yes it is imo. No one should be playing frisbee at a war memorial or messing around in the water fountains.

But it is so normal now for people to draw a blank when it comes to any sense of the sacred that I wouldn't get too worked up about it.

Exiting this thread now before some mouth-breather asks me for "evidence" that war memorials are meant to be treated with an aura of silent dignity.

Strumms

Disrespectful

No problem with walking a dog, but throwing frisbees around is not appropriate.

Jequ0n

Not Disrespectful

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120337366#Comment_120337366

Would you be ok with people playing on the green or enjoying themselves?

spakman

Not Disrespectful

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120337340#Comment_120337340

Sacred?

Strumms

Disrespectful

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120337384#Comment_120337384

Why wouldn’t I ? We are discussing a war ‘memorial’ as opposed to a green though.

pauliebdub

Not Disrespectful

It's a nice park and people are free to use it to walk dogs and have picnics and generally to just to relax. I don't think many people go there to bow their heads and contemplate the devastation and loss of world war 1.

thegame983

Not Disrespectful

Soldiers are made of sterner stuff. I'm pretty sure they would be fine with it.

corner of hells

My sister had her wedding photographs taken there on a bitterly cold November day ,

one of pictures is of herself on her own taken in black and white,

weeks later when she collected her album , in the background of her black and white picture , there was a ghostly image in the distance of a WW1 soldier,

and a dog , with a frisbee.

Deregos.

By that logic we should ban all children from going anywhere near the monument, especially if they're happily running around playing hide and seek.

You'd prefer to see that we all bow our heads in faux solemn grief as we slowly trudge by . . . Nonsense.

Montage of Feck

Not Disrespectful

We don't have a military we sent on imperial escapades, so no need to make up fairy stories about heroic cannon fodder or hide behind pious tabloid jingoism around military monuments.

Gregor Samsa

Not Disrespectful

The Heritage Ireland website (The OPW's heritage section) has a "Restrictions" tab for each location that they manage.

The page for the National War Memorial Gardens (https://heritageireland.ie/places-to-visit/irish-national-war-memorial-gardens/) mention no restrictions.

Some others, such as The Garden of Remembrance (https://heritageireland.ie/visit/places-to-visit/garden-of-remembrance/) say "Assistance Dogs Only" or "Dogs On Lead" (Grangegorman Military Cemetery: https://heritageireland.ie/visit/places-to-visit/grangegorman-military-cemetery/)

Obviously people can have their own opinions, but the body that manages the Gardens clearly have no issue with dogs being there. That said, the presence of dogs and the behaviour of dogs are two different things. One should always be sure that one's dog behaves in a respectful way anywhere in public.

sxt

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120337654#Comment_120337654

There is definitely at least one "no dogs allowed " sign at one of the entrances to this area, I presume there are more...

Gregor Samsa

Not Disrespectful

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120338125#Comment_120338125

Google Street View shows an "All Dogs Must Be Kept on Leads" sign

sxt

This is the one i saw

https://c2.staticflickr.com/6/5645/22034332481_6de06a07f8_b.jpg

gmisk

Not Disrespectful

I regularly walk my dog in the war memorials (early) and have for many years. Rarely go to the actual war memorial part at the top...but I do occasionally...I don't see what the issue is?! I pick up after my dog obviously I am not an absolute tosser.

During the summer people regularly drink, play games (even play music...which is a bit annoying to me tbh because the music is awful) etc in that part is that disrespectful too? Are you going to give out to them?

Riddle101

Not Disrespectful

Bring a dog for a walk in the memorial park sure, but just try to be sensible about it. Playing frisbee or letting them play in a water fountain is a bit too much, and make sure to clean up if it goes to the toilet. Other than that, as long as it's kept on a leash and is well behaved then I would have no problem with having dogs in a memorial park.

85603

Disrespectful

Went with disrespectful. But only barely. I probably wouldnt notice without it being pointed out.

As a rule the public will always eventually end up taking the piss. There will have been a time where having the dog in the fountain was a bit much.

Next it will be a barbeque and some bluetooth speakers, only having some craic like, whats the problem ye spoilsport.

So yeah, if theres to be a line drawn at all then its probably around about now, or just dont bother and redesignate it as a barbeque disco park.

If its a memorial then the whole point is for it to be a place of a certain separate atmosphere. If its to be a barbeque disco park then fair enough, but just put the memorial somewhere else.

xhomelezz

Not Disrespectful

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120337340#Comment_120337340

I would guess,that soldiers would be glad to see happy people and their pets..

whisky_galore

Disrespectful

Being cynical, people may have more of a problem with someone playing with a dog in the Garden of Remembrance as opposed to the War Memorial Gardens...some conflicts seem to matter more than others.

Anyhow many people with "fur babies" seem to ignore signage telling them to have their "babies" on leads in designated areas. Ah but my "doggo" is very well trained...cue owner shouting themselves hoarse while dog gleefully ignores them.

Graces7

Not Disrespectful

........

Jim2007

The people whom we are remembering laughed, played, had dreams and did all the things we do. Do you think they’d want a place dedicated to their memory to be a sad boring place where nobody goes? It would be a God awful place. So enjoy all the park has to offer, but spare a thought and a little prayer, if you wish, for those who did not get share it with you.

Furze99

Not Disrespectful

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120338962#Comment_120338962

Couldn't have said it better, have a great uncle buried there and knowing what little I know of him, I'd be thinking he liked his dogs.

Tombo2001

Not Disrespectful

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120338163#Comment_120338163

One of about ten gazillion laws that are routinely broken in Ireland (Hello urban speed limits!!).....

people in glasshouses etc.

breezy1985

Not Disrespectful

What better way to respect the people who died for the country than to enjoy yourself in said country.

I would have some serious problems with the behavior of people and their dogs in parks but that's all parks not just the "sacred" ones.

corner of hells

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120339485#Comment_120339485

In Islandbridge ?

artanevilla

Not Disrespectful

It's not a graveyard like.

I'm sure lots of the war dead were dog lovers and would love nothing more that to see dogs having a laugh.

cml387

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120337557#Comment_120337557

Thanks for that, coffee spitting out excepted.

As a dog owner, I think it would be a bit disrespectful to have a dog widdling up against a memorial.

85603

Disrespectful

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120338962#Comment_120338962

From time to time they also would have drank cider, pissed in various bushes and walked around topless with a fag hanging out of their gob kicking a ball to Damo.

Doesnt mean you should do those things in a memorial area.

The whole purpose of a memorial park is to be something different than the usual park, where you behave differently than in a normal park. Otherwise they would have just called it 'something park'. Without the 'memorial' bit.

Almost everyone when asked will say they respect those that fought in the wars associated with the memorial, because words are cheap. And thats the right answer.

The way to put a price to those words, to prove you actually mean it, is to briefly refrain from walking around barefoot while rolling joints and washing your dog.

Then again I suppose there will be those who just dont care, and dont care if its known they dont care. Just the way things are going. The original builders probably should have foreseen that putting an enjoyable facility in a public area would lead to people eventually doing whatever they feel like.

Is there any area which you can design as a memorial which wont be taken over. I was thinking of a memorial room, at the top of a long stair case, but theyd just start doing coke in it. Memorial lake? Jetskis.

Larbre34

Not Disrespectful

The green line is the Gardens, the yellow line is the memorial area within.

While I haven't walked my dog there, I would have no bother doing so, but I would make sure there was no interference to the memorial area in terms of leaving dog waste or playing with the dog within it. I would pass through it with a dog though no problem and I would, as I always do, stop a moment at the monuments and give a little word of silent thanks for the sacrifice.

Likewise, as the Covid restrictions opened up, we met with extended family in the WMGs to picnic and chat and kick ball, but we did it outside the memorial area and we took the opportunity to walk the kids through and explain the memorial to the ones who were old enough to understand the reference.

The WMGs are one of Dublin's hidden treasures, in my opinion, but when I was a kid they were left to rack and ruin, because at the height of the Troubles on this island, nobody wanted to take on the care of a testament to the sacrifice of Irish men made while Ireland was ruled by Britain. It might seem petty now, but at the time it was very serious and divisive.

Anyway, in time they received the remediation and care those men deserved and we have that beautiful space to remember them by today.

I don't think they or their families would especially care if they brought a dog along with you, as long as you have respect in your heart and in your actions.

Far better an active living memorial of people stopping by and reflecting as they do, than some dusty cenotaph behind a locked gate. They did die, after all, so that others may live on. Even their pet dogs.

Kurooi

Not Disrespectful

Those memorials are put in middle of parks specifically to be part of the city life, with all the people, screaming children ball games and indeed dogs around them. If the intention was to put them somewhere somber then we must wheel them out to some remote island off the coast.

Usual rules and human decency applies. Clean up after your dog.

Not Disrespectful

I haven't been to the WMGs since I was a child - we used to go there regularly at the weekend with my grandparents who lived not too far away. My grandmother lost six of her brothers to WWI. They used to bring their dogs along for the walk. I remember it as being quite big, there is a lot more to the WMG then just the memorial area itself.

corner of hells

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120341039#Comment_120341039

That’s a record, because originally it was 5 Collins brothers from Waterford.CWGC would be very interested in that.

when the 5th Collins brother died , the 6th brother was sent home on compassionate leave

Not Disrespectful

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120341350#Comment_120341350

Who are the CWGC and how do I get in touch with them?

That's what she always said, six brothers, and I think it was all on the same day, or in one battle? Obviously she is long passed away herself now and only 1 of her own children is still alive, though elderly and has dementia.

corner of hells

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120341576#Comment_120341576

Central Wargraves Commison.

they have details of where all soldiers died , memorials if they’ve no grave , along with basic service records.

CWGC can googled, also have an app.

Not Disrespectful

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120341600#Comment_120341600

Great, thanks, you've piqued my own curiosity now! I never had any reason to doubt her....

SEPT 23 1989

Not Disrespectful

I think the men they are commemorating, if they had once chance to go back would be firmly focused on wine,women and song in the terrible knowledge the moment they were shot down how short a life it can be

I don’t think a dog knocking around the party would annoy any of them

HazeDoll

Not Disrespectful

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120339485#Comment_120339485

I don't think anybody is actually buried there, are they?

Are they, Furze?

I used to spend a considerable portion of every day there with my dog and I thought I knew every inch of it.

elperello

I suppose if you behave yourself and keep the dog on a lead that should be enough.

For the frisbees, footballers and picnics the Phoenix Park is nearby.

deirdremf

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120337653#Comment_120337653

Quote from the heritageireland website:

They are dedicated to the memory of the 49,400 Irish soldiers who died in the First World War.

Furze99

Not Disrespectful

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120342011#Comment_120342011

Apologies, my mistake - looked at it quickly and assumed talking about Blackhorse Ave

iffandonlyif

Disrespectful

I’m going to be controversial and alienate myself from both sides by saying it’s not objectionable because it’s a war memorial but because it’s just generally antisocial to allow your dog run wild in a formal garden.

One of the reasons I so like the War Memorial Gardens (which commemorate a relative of mine) is that they are open and welcoming. Unlike Parnell Square, you are invited to relax and enjoy yourself without the expectation of solemnity. Obviously there are limits to that – no children should be climbing on the cenotaph, for instance – but the prevailing rules are just those of any park, which are for the enjoyment of others.

And chucking a ball to your dog in a formal gardens is against those rules! Like OP, I have seen someone situate themselves at one fountain in that memorial section and catapult a ball almost as far as the other fountain. I was standing at the cross, at the foot of the ceremonial steps, and couldn’t enjoy the effect of the symmetry when there was a dog zipping back and forth. Another poster shows on a map that the memorial is just a small section of the gardens. There is ample room to unleash your dog outside of that (not to mention Royal Hospital down the road and Phoenix Park across the river).

On the same day a large family had left their possessions strewn across a wide distance while they were off exploring the rose beds. As they moved between the levels, their dog ran between bushes. That to me isn’t disrespectful to the dead, it’s disrespectful to the living. I left the park early because I felt that it had been taken over by these people without regard for others. That disregard is all too common in Ireland, and the response of posters in this thread gives me no confidence it will change any time soon.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120337340#Comment_120337340

They died so we can frisbee

whisky_galore

Disrespectful

There is plenty park space outside of the actual gardens themselves, it wouldn't be too much to ask to keep the doggy hi-jinks out there, bearing in mind to clean up your dog sh1te and not to annoy other park users.

If it was a similar memorial garden in an overseas country, you'd be at least told off, or having to explain yourself at a police station or at worst, be given a few kicks up the hole from ex servicemen for doing whatever you feel like.

cml387

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120341600#Comment_120341600

It's the Commonwealth War Graves Commission.

corner of hells

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120356319#Comment_120356319

i have the app on my phone and still got it wrong.

blackbox

I'd have no problem as long as the dog was kept on a lead and the owner picks up its faeces.