Smoke/Heat/CO Alarms - Supply and Installation

Hippodrome Song Owl

Apologies if this is a very basic question, but I have no clue about this at all.

Are there specialist companies or individuals who supply and fit smoke, heat, and CO alarms for your home, rather than just commercial premises? Or do you buy the alarms yourself and organise an electrician to fit them?

I have just moved in to a 3-bed semi-d that came with no alarms. Temporarily I have just got 2 basic battery operated smoke/CO alarms and best I could do was to stick them up with those sticky/magnetic pads. I want to get a decent permanent solution in place though. I assume a wired system is recommended but no idea how to go about getting it sorted.

All advice appreciated, thanks.

Conversations 3

Any electrician should be able to supply and install them for you.

Hippodrome Song Owl

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120252670#Comment_120252670

OK. So it's just a matter of finding an electrician and they will source the appropriate alarms and install them?

Would most people have their (older) house up to current regulations for new builds? So smoke alarm in every bedroom, landing, hall, sitting room, and then heat alarm in kitchen. I don't actually know anyone who has that many, but is that now the norm when getting them installed?

meercat

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120253700#Comment_120253700

You’ll also need a co2 detector wherever there’s a gas appliance or open fire. If a chimney breast passes through a bedroom a co2 is required there also

kirk.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120253807#Comment_120253807

CO 😁 did that myself a while back

Hippodrome Song Owl

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120253807#Comment_120253807

Yes, that makes sense thanks. So are the CO alarms always separate - you can't get combined ones like with battery operated ones?

Sounds like an expensive job for so many alarms to be supplied and wired up. Does anyone have a rough idea of costs?

meercat

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120253952#Comment_120253952

Yes. The CO2 should be separate and not interlinked (to make it identifiable should it activate)

costs will depend on layout of installation

Hippodrome Song Owl

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120254363#Comment_120254363

Even a very rough ballpark figure for a totally standard 3-bed semi-d in Dublin? 3 bedrooms upstairs, sitting room and kitchen/dining room downstairs. A basic alarm set up covering the essentials. Are we talking 1k, 5k, 10k?

farmerval

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120253700#Comment_120253700

Check the standards before you go. The standard for apartments is the one with alarms in every bedroom etc. For apartments there are two systems, a; a Landlord system, which is for all the common areas and one heat alarm inside the door of each apartment. This system has to have a sounder in every bedroom and living area, so if a fire is anywhere in the building everyone will be made aware.

Domestic recommendation is an alarm at each level I believe, but I am out of the game for a while so may be wrong. Obviously you'll know where you want them yourself above and beyond.

meercat

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120254479#Comment_120254479

Less than €1,000

kirk.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120254646#Comment_120254646

Would depend on the alarms though

The EI optical or multi-sensor will be a lot more expensive

Hippodrome Song Owl

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120256636#Comment_120256636

So would we we be talking €2k or €5k if these were to be installed?

kirk.

I was mistaken on pricing. The basic EI optical model isn't actually that expensive ( bout 30 on Eurosales) so may not work out too bad

AFAIK EI don't make ionization alarms anymore .Eurosales have some no name brand of ionization model on their page.

Hippodrome Song Owl

Just to update this in case it's any use to anyone in future.

I finally got this done, and combined with getting 5 double sockets added and two new lights wired and fitted (no light there previously), it came to €1100 cash. I can't say for certain what supply and fit for the alarms was, but it was a lot less than I anticipated.

kirk.

What Model type alarms?

Hippodrome Song Owl

They aren't EI. They are Evolec - photoelectric smoke alarms, a heat alarm, and CO alarms.

kirk.

Might be alright , they're optical anyhow but EI is best by a long way

https://www.eielectronics.ie/product-category/accessories/

They have all the accessories to add to basic alarms

embracingLife

Hello Op and anyone interested in this topic.

Btw Op do you have any requirements for getting these sensors fitted? Apart from your own

Generally the rules for smoke alarms especially in rented property is covered by the LD2 fire regulations which is similar to the picture of the house that other poster added.

LD2 states that all habital rooms require a smoke alarm Which are to be Interlinked to each other. Also if the fuse board (also called a consumer unit) is located in a separate cupboard then a smoke alarm should be fitted beside it. Excludes bathrooms.

There's also the LD3 regulations which cover "escape route", generally hallways and bedrooms but not living rooms but seems LD2 is what the Op is interested in doing.

(This is separate to the building having a separate communal fire alarm system installed,which would be installed too in the case of apartment blocks/office buildings & other commercial properties)

You can get wired sensors which run off the mains, usually wired off the ceiling light in each room and also have a separate wire running to each sensor to satisfy the interlink requirement, but the hassle of running the interlink wire to each room sensor is hassle /cutting ceilings & walls etc but generally use wired sensors when doing a major renovation of the property.

(The interlink is when one sensor detects fire/smoke etc it instantly sends an electric current to the other sensors which then all sensors sirens start screeching! If no interlink then people may not hear a siren from further away in the room with the fire etc.)

Normally the best way to fit these sensors is using wireless smoke alarms which are commonly called Radio Frequency smoke alarms (RF). These alarms run on internal battery which have a life span of either 7 or 10 years (usually lithium battery) but it's says on the box what life span is the battery. The fire activation signal is sent wirelessly to each sensor etc-self explanatory, don't want to sound too big headed but better to explain fully to everyone.

To activate/programme the interlink during installation the installer presses a button on the alarm on each one and the sensors match up to each other and beep once the process is done. Instructions come with each sensor.

Also there's usually a control sensor which is the "base" unit and usually install this one in a central location and this one is wired to the mains - live and neutral wire-from the nearest ceiling light. Then the other sensors are independent/battery ones.

Also anyone handy can install these, handyman etc.

I surprised none of the electricians replied to this thread.

embracingLife

Also these RF sensors are at the moment about 80 euros each.

The mains powered sensors are about 30 euros each.

You can calculate the total number of sensors and work out the price yourself etc.

embracingLife

Op. Generally no, residential houses are not up to spec with the present fire alarm regulations re smoke alarms, as you can see from most of the replies nobody seems to know anything thorough about the matter.

It's only new builds and rental properties that "should" be up to date. Then again a lot of houses and apartments built towards the end of the 2000's/celtic tiger years would have been fitted with LD2 smoke alarms but not all. It's only really the past 5 years or so have the LD2 regulations been implemented mainly due to insurance companies queries to their customers when people are renewing their insurance policies!

Majority of houses have probably only one or two smoke alarms in the house but generally not interlinked.

Lenar3556

Just a couple of observations on that;

The requirements for bedrooms in LD2 only came in with the introduction of IS3218:2013, Prior to that smoke alarms in bedrooms weren’t required, except where LD1 was required. This is why you will only find bedrooms covered in newer houses.

There is no such thing as LD3 in Ireland. There is in the UK.

Smoke alarms are not usually wired from the ceiling light in each room. The standard requires that since 2013 that a readily identifiable cable is used (usually pink in colour). Smoke alarm circuits are typically wired with this cable directly from the consumer unit.

Wireless interlink is based on mesh communication, there is no master ‘control sensor’. Each smoke alarm, mains powered or otherwise plays an equal role in communicating between alarms.

embracingLife

Lenar3556

The last paragraph where you say there's no master control sensor is incorrect. With the Ei brand there most definitely is a control/master sensor. I fitted several and they work as I described.

kirk.

embracingLife :

That system you describe

Wireless RF alarms wired from lighting points is common in UK where they use 3-plate lighting wiring

The system here is usually wired interconnect and alarms wired on a separate MCB

kirk.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120828242#Comment_120828242

Mesh

Maybe you're thinking of something else a "radiolink base" or something

There was a "repeater" function on RF alarms , that could be gone now

Risteard81

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120829023#Comment_120829023

It's because BS 5839-6 states that detectors can be connected to a regularly used local lighting circuit. This is often preferred as it is self-monitoring - if the circuit is de-energised people won't be happy without lights but mightn't even notice if it was the smoke alarms. Wireless interlink would never really be used on a new build as it would be cost prohibitive - makes much more sense to wire them.

kirk.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120829130#Comment_120829130

Ya I saw that before

Disadvantage with dedicated circuit is alarms are easily shutdown

Lenar3556

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120828242#Comment_120828242

No, all Ei sensors have equal status and communicate on a mesh arrangement.

You can get a wireless module for some of the Ei mains powered range of alarms to allow communication with other or radiolink enabled devices, but it doesn’t have any master/ control role. I.e if you were to remove it everything else will still work.

These wireless modules for wired alarms can be useful for merging an existing wired interconnect system with new battery only radiolink devices. That might be what you are thinking about?

kirk.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120837104#Comment_120837104

Dunno he came in claiming nobody knows anything and proceeded to post a fair bit of nonsense

Anyway that's what the threads are for to arrive at correct conclusion

embracingLife

No sh1t Sherlock

Maewyn Succat

Can anyone recommend some wireless interconnected smoke alarms please. 6 smoke alarms are required in a house that previously wasn't wired for smoke alarms. Running cables for hardwired smoke alarms is not an option.

I have seen this set on amazon:

Deal: X-Sense Wireless Interlinked Smoke Alarm Detector with Sealed 10-Year Battery, Interconnected Fire Alarm Conforms to EN 14604 Standard, SD19-W, Link+, 6-Pack https://amzn.eu/d/5BpP3Cj

They seem really cheap compared to other options.

kirk.

EI Alarms

https://www.fireproductsdirect.ie/product/ei650irf-wireless-interconnect-intelligent-optical-smoke-alarm/

Not sure if battery only alarms are allowed here , building regulations , I think not

Someone will be able to confirm