Picard 3x01- 'The Next Generation' ~~ { ** Spoilers Within ** }

ilovesmybrick

Picard 3x01- 'The Next Generation' ~~ { ** Spoilers Within ** } Warning: This thread will contain spoilers 

eadrom

Ah, that was pretty good. Nothing too special really, and that's fine. Was just nice to see Beverly, Riker, and Picard and it did feel enough like them this time, and enough like Star Trek.

Early days though. On the down-side, everything with Rafi was bad. The character herself, the Garret statue, the terrorist attack. However that's all going to mix into the main arc, I have a feeling it won't be good.

Titan is a bit unexceptional looking. Looks like a barely redressed Discovery bridge? Exterior shots all looked a bit computer-gamey.

Really hope that's not somehow Picard's kid.

Plenty of ways this could all go poorly anyway, but I enjoyed the episode.

AMKC

So half way through the this episode and some cool things I have noticed are the Eaglemoss ships displays in the bar at at Picards House especially the Gold Enterprise-D.

There has also been some things I am not too happy about like for one

Spoiler Warning

Beverly going out on her own and cutting herself off from the rest of the crew. I do not believe she would do that.

Also Riker when he goes on board the Titan embarrassing the young cadet with CrashLaForge.

I do not believe he would do that. It not very nice or very professional either.

I was hoping they were going to steal the Titan. That would have been cool but at least its a starship unlike what we had in the last two seasons.

I think its strange that most of what happened the last two seasons seems to have just been forgotten about.

Maybe we will see or something of it as this season goes on.

Awe come on Beverley has another son as if Wesley was not enough. I wonder who she had this son with.

On the plus side go Seven and yes I agree the Titan did look very CGIied and not in a good way.

What was that about the Number 3 and Picard being Locutos? They were two separate incidents as far as I remember and Picard was around for the one with the number 3 being everywhere. It was Data that copped the Number 3 everywhere must refer to Rikers suggestion to decompress the cargo bay in that TNG episode as the Tractor beam would not work.

eadrom

@AMKC --

What was that about the Number 3 and Picard being Locutos? They were two separate incidents as far as I remember and Picard was around for the one with the number 3 being everywhere. It was Data that copped the Number 3 everywhere must refer to Rikers suggestion to decompress the cargo bay in that TNG episode as the Tractor beam would not work.

Yeah, that was a strange one alright. It's like they ham-fisted in a reference to something which we didn't even see happening. There was a computer virus element to Best of Both Worlds but it was Data infecting the Borg cube with the "sleep" command, not the other way around. Unless I'm forgetting something?

And as you said, there was also the incident with the number 3 -- but that was nothing to do with Locutus and actually I don't think even Riker would remember that because it was part of a time-loop which they broke out of "before" the events occurred.

It's passable I suppose, in the sense that I'm sure a lot of things happen which we don't see on screen, but with a show already so heavy with nostaligic references to episodes and things we've seen before, it seems a bit daft to throw in even more that they've just made up on the spot.

corkie

https://memory-alpha.fandom.com/wiki/The_Next_Generation_%28episode%29

Why the discussion about 'Number 3' was it mentioned in the episode? Must have missed that.

https://memory-alpha.fandom.com/wiki/Cause_And_Effect_%28episode%29

As for 'Rafi' at least we are not looking at a season long mystery of who/what is

Spoiler Warning

'The Red Lady'?

https://www.thedigitalfix.com/star-trek/rachel-garrett

https://memory-alpha.fandom.com/wiki/Yesterday%27s_Enterprise_%28episode%29

I thought she got killed before the ship went back in time. Also the timeline is restored so no memories of it.

eadrom

@corkie --

Why the discussion about 'Number 3' was it mentioned in the episode? Must have missed that.

When Picard and Riker are discussing how to make sense of the co-ordinates from Crusher and the message "hellbird", Riker "remembers" that the computer virus which infected the ship during Picard's time as Locutus was called Hellbird. The virus messed with ships navigation by adding the number 3 to all coordinates, so they added the number 3 to the coordinates from Crusher and found what they were looking for.

But for one thing that sounds like a silly idea for a virus and for another they didn't mention any of it in Best of Both Worlds. So it's like it's a silly idea in the first place, oh but it's okay because it's a reference to the old show... oh, except it isn't actually.

AMKC

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120249510#Comment_120249510

I thought she got killed before the ship went back in time. Also the timeline is restored so no memories of it.

Yes but she would still be remembered in the Prime universe as having stopped a war but yes the events of Yesterday's Enterprise would not be known about.

ilovesmybrick

Fool me once, fool me twice, fool me three times...? I think it was a pretty decent episode. As was said by a poster above, Raffi is just the worst. But aside from that I pretty much enjoyed it. The captain is a right prick, so they could do something interesting there I'd say, and Frakes was having a ball, really enjoyed him in this. Like above, I thought the CGI on the Titan was a bit, ropey? The visuals for everything else seemed great, but the Titan looked like it was missing textures. Don't get me wrong, looked decent, but not as fine tuned as everything around it. I thought the Helios, Crushers ship, was pretty cool though, I have an awful soft spot for those really small starships when they're done well

Few nitpicks, but to be honest it is mostly nitpicking. The sheer number of callbacks in the first five minutes alone got a bit much. Some were fun, but Crusher having her dancing award out (caught my eye immediately, since she was so embarassed aabout it in Datas day, missed the sex candle though if that was there), and Picard and the **** flute story, come on. Now, don't get me wrong, The Inner Light is one of the best TNG episodes, and the flute popped up before centrally, like when he was hooking up with the piano Lieutenant, but the story was a bit too much and just reminded me of a phenomal episode that this couldn't live up to.

And absolutely f**k off that no one wanted to buy a model of the D in the bar. That is sacriledge and I'll be having none of it! You could have had the Eaglemoss models of all the other Enterprises, but not the D, and turned it around and said it was because that was the ship everyone wanted. It still would have been a really cringey scene, but wouldn't be sacriledge. Maybe I'm over thinking that one, but it really annoyed me!

How it will pan out, lets see. The first two seasons started pretty well too and we saw how that went. But I've very little to complain about based on this. Not great, but not bad, and potentially interesting. We all hope...!

Slydice

That was freakin great!

Gah damn right Rachel Garrett gets a dedication statue! Hell Yeah!

Gah damn right you'll help Beverly after all she gave in All Good Things!

The directing and action in this were top notch! The fight at the start reminded me of the fight on the station at the start of Star Trek Generations!

Space Dock! Awe Yeah! Whoever was doing the music for the episode was clearly a fan!

Damnnnnn! What an opening episode!

Slydice

Aha! There she is! THERE SHE IS!! 🙂

Stephen Barton: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stephen_Barton

Season 3: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Star_Trek:_Picard_(season_3)

Music

Stephen Barton composed the season's score, replacing Jeff Russo from the first two seasons, after working with Matalas on the series 12 Monkeys.[60] The pair began work on the season's score by April 2022,[61] composing new themes together including the theme for the USS Titan-A.[62] Matalas said the music was strongly influenced by the work of composers Jerry Goldsmith and James Horner for the Star Trek films.[22] He added that themes from four different iterations of Star Trek would be used together in the score,[24] which Barton described as a "6 1/2 hour love letter in music" to Goldsmith, Horner, and the Next Generation composers.[63]

Terry Matalas is the showrunner.

sioda

Loved it tbh yes I could pick holes in it but what's the point.

Did feel the ship at the end was a big evil version of the Andromeda ascendant.

I watch more and again if it was crap I'd watch anyway like i did all of last season 🤣

martingriff

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120249614#Comment_120249614

Just in relation to a virus (still to watch episode) Viruses have been doing stuff like this. Take a car put a virus like that in it. You are going 60KPH and put on cruise control that starts a virus that put a 1 in front so suddenly you go 160KPH and splat into something. Similarly with coordinates say you were going to location 123 just before an orbit of a planet all nice and safe. However instead of 123 you go to say 1233 that could be right in the middle of an asteroid belt, a sun or the atmosphere of a planet (yes the sensors should show it. But if not go out of warp and no time to do an adjustment or more mundane far away from where you are meant to be so you can't stop something

Spear

Story wise, the preview stuff pretty much spoiled all of it, so no surprises there.

There does seem to be some massive changes in tone in some aspects of the production. The music was often a copy of James Horner, and felt like a very deliberate attempt to emulate the movies. Same for some of the intro titles, minimal as they were.

The end credits re-used the First Contact theme too.

There seemed be more a cold war political thriller tone to the Raffi bits.

They got a dedication to Annie Wersching in after the credits at least. If anyone hadn't seen, the actress who played the Borg queen in season 2 died a few weeks ago, having been diagnosed with cancer during filming.

I'm a little surprised that Shaw is an asshole like that. Badmirals may be a tradition at this point, but seeing a hero ship like the Titan go into the hands of a dickhead is unexpected.

I suspect some reveal about the true nature of the grunt baddies. The pointed reference to the ash and the changing faces, makes my think they're synthetic or something along those lines.

breezy1985

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120249510#Comment_120249510

She would be remembered as the captain who died in a rescue attempt that brought peace between the Klingons and Federation.

The episode was alright. Couldn't give a sht about the big bad plot that feels like it's all been done before. Don't care about Wesley - A and who his daddy is (why does he have an English accent, are accents hereditary ?)

The art direction is still absolutely terrible too. Phaser machine guns, Blade Runner planets, overly pointy alien ships and Titan is a 23rd century STO design that looks stupid in this show and its absolutely dumb to think it's a refit of Rikers ship.

It's fun to see the old crew and great to see 7 in a uniform but it didn't do much for me.

fritzelly

Put this in the main thread but here again

Well I thoroughly enjoyed that first episode - Picard does Star Trek

Can't wait for the next episode

Agree with the above that the external shots of the Titan looked very game-ish - guess there's a fine line between not having too much detail and having something in HD where you can see everything. All a bit too shiny

Picard looked less frail but it's still there, Seven just risking a court martial seemed off - don't buy that, the dinner table made me laugh and then the bunk beds

The tone of the first episode feels more like ST then the first two episodes - hope it continues like this and maybe better

fritzelly

Was checking the age of the TNG actors - amazing to know they are all late 60's and into their 70's now - but don't look it at all

TheValeyard

I enjoyed it. Delighted they dropped most of the previous two seasons.

Titan A is a bit frumpy or does look like an early STO ship. Hate the bridge design and I'm sure we'll see more of Captain D1ckhead.

Is cyberpunk world a Federation planet or not? Thought the Federation was a Utopia, so probably not?

Liked the music, early film references.

It's a good start. BUT Picard S1 started off well and turned into a sh1tty B copy of Mass Effect.

The virus 3 thing also confused me.

~Rebel~

Oof, I struggled with that to be honest... the writing is just absolutely atrocious throughout. Everyone talks too much. It's like nothing internal can stay that way for long. Like the way Seven launched into her whole diatribe at the drop of a hat, when it could've been played much simpler, and saved an emotional beat for when it was actually earned. There's also this insistence that we saw from the trailer, that Picard's Enterprise actually behaved like Kirk's Enterprise, rascal'ing around the galaxy with all guns blazing or something.

(Also is it really that hard to rent/borrow a warp capable ship? Space seems to be bloody full of warp capable ships!)

breezy1985

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120251449#Comment_120251449

This yoke seemed to be the 24th century version of a Ford Fiesta there were so many going around

pah

Why can't it just be Beverley and the big conspiracy without the WMD's? Maybe they didn't get ris of all those alien parasites from "Conspiracy" and they're back?

Captain D1ckhead must have watched a youtube collage of TNG's best fights and 'splosions before his dinner. Definitely some modern writing issues but I'm cautiously optimistic. Loved the score.

feelings

The score was the best part. Liked the end credits taken from First Contact, nice touch.

Spear

Some rampant speculation on my part, but I've spoiler tagged it in case I'm right:

Spoiler Warning

During the inspection, there's an ops ensign who gives a notable glare at Picard. And that ensign is named and played by a professional actor. Lore appears later on, wearing an ops ensign uniform. There's a comment that the people chasing Crusher changes faces. There's weird ashes left when they get phasered. Crusher says don't trust anyone in Starfleet. My reckoning is that synthetics are infiltrating Starfleet, with shapeshifting tech, and that's really Lore in the corridor.

pah

Also, why did the phaser rifle have a pump action effect? stupid

breezy1985

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120253813#Comment_120253813

And shout out to all your enemies that you are out of bullets.

sioda

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120253813#Comment_120253813

Did Picard make a comment about it not being a standard phaser or is my head filling plot holes 🤣

McFly85

The Good:

It’s a joy to see Frakes and Stewart share the screen again. Really get the sense they are enjoying working together.

Shaw is an interesting enough captain. I hate the idea that the Enterprise D crew were thought of as action heroes, but I can imagine such a strait laced captain would hate them by reputation, especially of the crap films!

The Bad:

Raffi. Couldn’t care less about her or her mystery handler.

The ship design! Everything is too dark like they want to have the interior aesthetic of space submarines. Also the Titan looks like a few classes mashed together.

The general plot so far is contrived. A celebrated admiral and captain should probably be able to get a warp capable ship without having to nick one. Also please not another potential Picard offspring plot.

So far it looks like it will be average at best.

pc7

Does rafi have a kid? Is it her and sevens? I can’t really remember season 2.

I enjoyed it as others said, bar rafi, she’s a melt.

Anyone tell me how to spoiler on mobile? Want to ask a question thanks

breezy1985

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120254500#Comment_120254500

Just to make myself feel better about Shaw I reckon he and many others don't get to hear about the million gaseous anomalies the Enterprise studied and only hear about the big galaxy saving missions. The D crew are like in Logan where the X-Men were both real and comic book heros.

Shaw probably spent the Dominion war jumping into escape pods in all those cannon fodder Mirandas or sitting it out in a Cali class.

He is dead right not to trust them but also the "Hansen" thing is bad writing because surely he would be straight up to HR for not letting 7 choose her own name.

AMKC

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120254530#Comment_120254530

Anyone tell me how to spoiler on mobile? Want to ask a question thanks

It's below when your texting just click the first box on the left and it's in there.

corkie

@Spear They got a dedication to Annie Wersching in after the credits at least.

She was also in 'Timeless'. Thanks for mentioning it.

@pc7

On mobile, you will find that icon at bottom left of the comment box.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/2058199126/how-can-i-a-users-guide-to-the-new-site#latest

Slydice

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120253925#Comment_120253925

It was definitely brought up between Riker and Picard like they were making a point of it! Hard to miss 😁

Rawr

So far, so very good….

*SO FAR* (Glares angrily in Kurtzman’s direction) This has a load of promise (just like Season 2’s start), but don’t f*ck it all up! (like Season 2).

I enjoyed that first episode, good hour of Trek. I’m pleased to see that the fodder they added to the trailer was all taken out of context and that the actual scenes were good. Like the dinner scene on the Titan. That Captain is a total bastard, and find myself hoping that Seven will get an excuse to deck him at some point. The dinner scene was well done, and the Titan’s captain is an interesting antagonist of sorts. I’m thinking something Borg-related happened to him or someone he cared about. Possibly a Wolf-359 survivor.

It was a bit slow overall, and the Raffi stuff was a bit of a drag, but otherwise OK. I do kinda like Titan-A, and although the interiors are way too dark, at least they’re not polished all over the place.

I do however wish they’d tone down the pew pew new-Trek phasers. They just seem silly and make it harder to follow the scenes. Otherwise though, the camera work is missing all of the bad habits of Discovery and is nice to look at.

If we can get to Episode 4 or 5 without them jumping off a quality cliff, I’m going to be hopeful.

Rawr

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120254530#Comment_120254530

I think that might be Raffi’s grand-kid. Her son had gotten together with a Romulan girl and I think we see her pregant there in S1. However she appeared to be astranged to her son at the time.

pc7

Spoiler Warning

Thanks for tip -the ship at the end, is it Romulen, borg? Are we meant to know?

Evade

Is there really a need to spoiler things in the episode thread?

That was actually kind of good, imagine if this was how season one started? Picard knowing Seven aside. The CGI was a but ropey but things kind of made sense but that could all disappear in a few episodes. Having the old crew as guest stars should mean they won't have to tread water so they get screen time every episode.

Garret gets to be the hero of Narendra III and hence the Red Lady because no one outside of the Romulan Empire, and possibly Guinan, knows she was dead at the time and Callisto and Yar were responsible for the outcome of the battle.

EDIT: I have just seen elsewhere they still don't know what a refit is.

pc7

Sorry wasn’t sure and didn’t want to ruin anything if we had to spoiler

Evade

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120253813#Comment_120253813

The Federation is the California of the Alpha Quadrant. Civilians can own "military style assault weapons" (nonsense term by the way) but they have to be modified in ridiculous ways to make them annoying to use.

corkie

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120254846#Comment_120254846

I will spoiler too as well, because it was cliffhanger and we will probably find out more next episode.

Spoiler Warning

The ship starts wobbling as a massive pointy ship (unfortunately very much resembling Nero’s ship from Star Trek ’09) emerges out of the nebula, https://www.highonfilms.com/star-trek-picard-season-3-episode-1-recap-ending-explained/

CastorTroy

How long will they drag out the mystery of where the son got his accent from?

Evade

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120255205#Comment_120255205

He looks a little old to be 20. Hologram?

EDIT: I looked him up, the actor is 34.

odyssey06

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120255205#Comment_120255205

Downton Abbey and Outlander.

In case wondering where seen before.

flazio

I enjoyed it overall but I do have to agree that the external space shots looked like something touched up from Lower Decks or Prodigy. (Still no California class ships lurking in the background)

fritzelly

Little breakdown of the ending credit sequence

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OT6y68_JcJk

Slydice

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120254978#Comment_120254978

Was definitely thinking it looked like that ship.

Stark

Not bad. Though similar quality to season 2 ep 1 and we know where that went.

Captain Shaw doesn't seem that believable. Can't see how someone with such piss poor people skills could make it into the captain's chair. Trying to do a Jellico without displaying the things that made Jellico indispensable as a captain despite some leadership skills being a bit off.

The writers of Picard seem to have no concept of how big space is. From Earth to edge of Federation space is months worth of travel even at warp 9.99. Not something you do while the captain is taking a nap.

That kid has to be Picard's son, he inherited his British accent.

Rawr

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120255897#Comment_120255897

I’m going to give Shaw a little benefit of the doubt here. He’s clearly anti-Borg, and I can’t help but wonder if having Seven on his bridge has soured him to the point of near begrudging anyone to do with her or the Borg generally. The prospect of having her on his bridge for the next 5-odd years might be giving him a permanent head ache.

His rank might also be down to his service history. I might guess good service during the Dominion War might have pushed him up to that rank, and with so many Captains lost to the conflict they might not have been so picky in the years after. Would be nice if we got a bit of the aftermath of the War, since I’m guessing it took years for the Federation to recover from what was a near defeat to the Dominion.

squonk

I’m not seeing a problem with Shaw. It’s clear from his own words that he runs a tight ship and has his orders for a pre determined mission. That changes when a retired admiral and a semi retired captain show up. Worse, the admiral was at one time a Borg and attached to the collective and instrumental in s devastating attack on the federation. Disjointed didn’t like it trust Picard so I’m not surprised with Shaw here. To make matters worse the two new arrivals look to take the ship off mission for a sorties looking reason that you could also say looked shady and, worse still, his first officer is buddies with the pair and is pitching in to help smooth over the holes in their plan. I’m all this there has been no communication from Starfleet to expect any guests or be mediated for any decision from the planned mission. Even if there was a covert mission involved I’m sure the Titan would have been ordered to the edge of federation space to do the guys off. No need to tell Shaw exactly why he was transporting these guests.

he seems like a proper captain to me, albeit with some anti Borg bias which is entirely understandable. We don’t know what he’s like day to day on the titan and as it turns it, he was right to be dismissive of epicardium and Riker because his first officer then mutinies and takes them where they want to go anyway. Personally as a regular federation officer who has likely lost at least friends if not even family to the Borg, I think he’s spot on really.

Maybe not epicardium but if the tables were turned and Riker was captain dealing with s similar situation I wouldn’t see him acting much different and I’m certain Picard would have also arrived at the same Irvine though with not diplomacy.

let’s face it, shady characters showing up to go off mission followed by a mutiny is a disaster in any starship. No matter what they’re noticed, Picard, Riker and 7 are the bad guys here.

you know it’s down to bad writing but I think in normal circumstances tge security chief would have had a very healthy interest in Picard & Riker’s movements and actions and been ordered to wake the captain at the first sign of trouble. If Shaw is guilty of anything it’s incompetence for not doing sobering like this. Otherwise I still think he was spot on.

Evade

Shaw is being unnecessarily dickish too. Invinting people to a meal and then starting without them and belittling a gift is just rude for no reason. He seems to be a pretty absent captain too, a bit like Janeway in Night, not taking the ship out of spacedock or being on the bridge at all until he was woken up in the middle of the night. I get what they were trying to do with him bit his personality is too grating to have any sympathy for him. He seems like the embodiment of "if you go out and come across an asshole that guy has a problem. If you go out and everyone is an asshole, you're the problem."

TheValeyard

Shaw is definitely a D1ckhead, but from his perspective.....trouble tends to follow Picard and Riker around. Wound you want them on your new shiny ship?

Chemistry between Riker and Picard is good.

Sone real good theory threads on reddit about who the bad guys are this season. .

Also questions are asked as to whether they were really in 10 forward bar or a hologram version of it? Something to so with the end credits?

squonk

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120256514#Comment_120256514

Fair point. I hadn’t considered that and yeah, when you out it like that, he’s but the greatest captain material but I’m guessing to that you need your oriole captains in some situations and your dick captains in others. He might just be the man for the titans job otherwise. I do think though the writers set out to make him a d1ck and really bailed home the message, maybe just a bit too much.

Evade

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120256549#Comment_120256549

I like WWII naval stuff and it occasionally crops up that there are captains who are the absolute best at getting new ships fitted out, through basic sea trials, and ready for line duty that you would absolutely not ever in a million years let into combat. If you've ever seen Band of Brothers Captain Soble was like an army equivalent, great at training bad at everything else, although the series played it up a lot. Being charitable to Shaw, and the writers, he could be this kind of officer.