Is alcohol an excuse?

slither12

For bad behavior? It isn't obviously but a lot of people put drunken antics down to "I had too much". As people say, alcohol doesn't make you do anything but reduces inhibitions.

I had a family member who was a terrible alcoholic but the best thing was he never acted the maggot and he drank excessively at home, weddings, pubs, clubs, on flights Only got a bit more sociable.

Potential-Monke

No. Never. But because drinking is a national pastime, it gets used as an accepted excuse in a lot of situation. If anything, it should garner a worse reaction because the person just did something horrible while drunk, so a horrible person who can't hold their drink, 2 bads, not 1 bad and 1 excuse.

From my time as a Garda, I reckon 90% of incidents had drink involved. It's a horrible drug but there's no legal alternative that does as good or similar a job at making you forget how horrible life is. It's not until you give up drink that you really see how bad it is. I'm not telling or expecting people to give it up, but I find it hilarious the lengths people will go to to partake.

I've had plenty of drunken nights, and me as I am now would not have liked drinking me. Same as most when drunk, loud, obnoxious, never wrong, etc. Cocaine actually made me more bearable I reckon, stopped me getting as drunk! And now that I look back, alcoholic drinks just don't taste nice, we just fool ourselves into thinking it does so we can partake in the national pastime.

But it should never be used as an excuse for anything.

elperello

It's often presented as an excuse but should be treated as an aggravating factor.

walshb

It’s not an exact excuse, but as said, it really affects your cognitive awareness and your judgment, as well as lowers your inhibitions greatly.

cruais

Shouldn't be used as an excuse. Your guard drops under the influence. I'm a firm believer that if someone is always aggravated with drink on them, that deep down they're really like that but know its not acceptable when sober

growleaves

Ctrl+F search for "drunk" and "alcohol" in any story about an arrest or trial that you're reading on an Irish news site.

Donald Trump

It has been well established to be the cause of, and solution to, all of life's problems.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SXyrYMxa-VI

cruais

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120131909#Comment_120131909

True.

If something good happens,have a drink to celebrate.

If something bad happens, have a drink to deal with the shock

walterking

Very easy to just say it's a cause.

In many cases it's the sign of underlying issues and for the past couple of years I've done some work with St Patrick's hospital and it certainly gave me a totally different perspective.

Unfortunately the gardai in the main will simply treat someone with alcohol as a criminal and I believe that all gardai should spend a week in secondment to St Patrick's or similar and they may be able to get a different perspective.

In many cases it's used as a coping medication by people and sometimes as a cry for help.

Talk to them, don't admonish them.

Strumms

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120131930#Comment_120131930

if nothing at all happens, have a drink while you think about making something happen.

Jequ0n

I think there are people who genuinely cannot handle alcohol (or other substances), and whose personalities can change dramatically as a result. I think it’s fair enough to grant them the “excuse” the first few times around, but at some stage they need to own it.

And I am saying this as someone who has frequently used the “I was drunk” excuse just to get out of trouble.

Larbre34

Its never, ever, ever an excuse.

If people cannot handle their drink, they should have the enlightenment to leave it alone.

If they don't, its not the fault of the drink, its their's.

igCorcaigh

Some people react badly to alcohol, it changes their personality and behaviour, to the extent that they need to give it up.

My brother is a nice fella, but turns into an asshole under the influence. I can drink and get merry, but can be a danger to myself if too drunk. I might fall down.

So, it all depends.

But, to your question: I would forgive once or twice, but if it's a pattern then no; own your behaviour and stop blaming the drug.

In my opinion it IS an excuse, but one that means they have to at least cut back on drinking.

I've a friend who could be dreadful when drunk - and had absolutely no recollection the next day, and would be shocked at himself. So he cut back.

Another pal - same story, she was a different person when drunk. So she gave up alcohol.

Mrs OBumble

It explains things. It doesn't excuse them.

Kermit.de.frog

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/2058280392/is-alcohol-an-excuse

Absolutely not. Drinking is a free choice. If you choose it then so be it. You are alone responsible for what happens later. No one else.

AllForIt

Alcohol has never made me aggressive quite the opposite.

I read something recently that alcohol brings out and accentuates the real 'you' i.e. if your naturally aggressive it will bring that out or if your more passive it will bring that out too.

It’s never an excuse, but addiction to it is a horrible phenomenon. people use it in an attempt to suppress negative emotions, but it tends to backfire in this respect and actually magnify those emotions to the extent a person can lose all control over them, and then drinking is continued to try and dampen down the physical response until a sleep or semi-comatose state sets in followed by being in the horrors next day. On the other hand alcohol can feel to be enhancing a positive mood and so is often involved in celebrations. It dampens down inhibitions, temporarily dampens down residual nervousness, so for a short time the happy drinker is life and soul of the party.

It’s such a cultural norm that it’s extremely hard to escape in our country, and a recovering alcoholic must be greatly challenged by its omnipresence, and what is the tedium being in the midst of inebriated people.

When blood alcohol rises abruptly it temporarily shuts off the ability to retain info into memory, leading to the so-called memory black-outs. It’s not only alcoholics are affected by these, but anyone who takes a binge or a glass too many in short sequence, maybe in a rush to down too many rounds towards the end of an evening. A separate issue for long term alcoholics is chronic memory & executive function loss (Korsakoff Syndrome) whether drunk or sober, caused by thiamine deficiency. In some alcoholics thiamine, along with other nutrients, is not properly absorbed from an often poor diet by a disturbed digestive system, and what is absorbed fails to get utilised to protect brain cells.

It’s a very complex picture overall, and Ireland has a relatively high proportion of people affected by full-blown alcoholism, apart from the sporadic binge drinking in another sizeable cohort.

Interestingly, I was on an excursion in Brittany in September, and the local guide compared Breton drinking habits versus the French in general. She described Bretons as having the “wild” streak typical of many other Celts, and that they consume in one night what the French in general consume over a week. “We don’t drink more overall than the French, but we drink it in all one go”.

The DayDream

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120132437#Comment_120132437

I don't believe that at all. When people whose personality changes for the worse on alcohol are confronted with what they've done or said, they're typically horrified. I think the lovely person that you see when they're sober is the real person.

Alcohol is literally a poison. Why anyone would think a poison brings out 'the real you' is beyond me.

Some people it doesn't make them act like complete arseholes, but contrary to what many 'happy drunks' think, I rarely witness any situation where it improves anyone's personality.

Both my parents, my grandfather, 3 of my uncles and my auntie on my mother's side, and two of my father's brother's were alcoholics. Most got sober but it killed me father. I didn't escape it either and it is something that plagued me for along time as a binge drinker who really couldn't handle it. I've woken up in jail cells, hospitals, random houses etc. not knowing how I got there.

People who don't understand it properly think it's just as simple as 'If it doesn't suit you, just don't do it.' Like, wow, why didn't I think of that?

In AA they say alcohol is 'cunning, baffling and powerful.' and it fkin is. It still baffles me why I persisted drinking when it was the cause of literally every major bit of trouble I ever had in my life. The allure of that buzz you get from the first few is very powerful. Unfortunately when you lose your inhibitions you don't just start talking louder and whatnot, you also lose the ability to control your intake.

For a person like me one drink triggers a compulsion to drink more and more. A normal drinker doesn't understand it but I would say don't look down on others just because you were born with the ability to have a few and leave it at that. There is huge pressure to drink in social situations, too, and walking through any town, even the supermarket, means you are basically surrounded all times by 'legal drug dealers.' (yes, booze is a drug).

The cunning bit is when you go off it, it is so easy to forget the horror of your last binge. The headache, dry mouth, diarrhea and nausea isn't even the worst part. The shame, self loathing, regret is crushing. You try to sleep and you can't and when you do you have terrible nightmares.

So when you still go out and do it again, that shows you how strong the addiction is. My uncle who was off it 15 years just went back on it and got a DUI and assaulted the cops. Pretty sure there's nothing about that that is 'the real him'. It's all booze fkin up your brain.

xxxxxxl

If you really want to find out what someone is like talk to them after a skin full.

The DayDream

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120132549#Comment_120132549

Again, complete nonsense IMO. Since kicking booze I've noticed most people are affected by alcohol very similarly. They get louder, sillier, more obstinate, repeat themselves and repeat the same stories, overestimate their ability to dance, their fighting prowess, their wittiness and sexual attractiveness. It doesn't vary that much, even amongst those who would be considered 'happy drunks'. They still get louder and more ridiculous, just not as obnoxious as some others.

But most people when drunk share those characteristics and it isn't 'what they're really like' at all. Most of them are fairly normal, polite, respectful, even shy people. They didn't show 'what they're really like' when drunk, and their inhibitions aren't some phony mask. Your inhibitions are there to protect you from socially unacceptable or harmful behaviour.

A fella I know went to a foreign stag years ago and got so drunk he ended up heading back to the hotel and passing out. When he awoke he found out there had been an awful incident. Somehow in the wee hours the groom to be thought it would be great craic to scale the side of a bridge going through the town. His mates were cheering him. Then the fella jumped into the river and drowned. No joke.

I doubt if either the man who jumped or his mates who thought it was funny are 'really like that.' This man was not suicidal, his friends didn't want him to do something so dangerous. They were inebriated and had lost all sense of what was right and wrong and safe and not.

You don't find out what people are really like after a skinful. Most of the time the things they say would be hard to make much sense out of, or is just idle pub talk, 'Och, sure look it... Blahblahblah'. You rarely gain major insights into their personality or even hear anything memorable whatsoever.

xxxxxxl

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120132558#Comment_120132558

That's a very sad situation Really sorry to hear about the death condolences. I meant on simple stuff like politics Religion stuff most avoid.

Grayson

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/2058280392/is-alcohol-an-excuse

Yes and no. We all say or do stupid things when we're drunk. It's the level of stupidity that matters. If someone does something harmful, they should say sorry. If they continuously do stuff like that they should stop drinking and possibly see a therapist.

igCorcaigh

You speak the truth @The DayDream.

SAMTALK

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120132437#Comment_120132437

I know a fella who is as laid back and easy going as you will get but if he drinks whiskey he shows a completely different side which is not nice! Never once sober has he shown any indication of this

bb1234567

This seems outdated. Tbh it's a very old fashioned to use it as an excuse. I think with a lot of recent feminist movements which aimed to reduce rates of sexual assault in party/club/bar environments have caused alcohol being used as an excuse to go out the window and I rarely see it being accepted as justification any longer unless the bad behaviour was minor and forgettable such as losing your temper a bit. But any sexual behaviour or physical aggression definitely no longer brushed off as alcohols fault

It is a Dunne Deal

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120132558#Comment_120132558

This is the exact truth and really should be the final word in this thread. Happy drunks are people who are just less of a bollocks than others but I found I was a happy drunk until I blacked out then I could be an awful bollocks loud obnoxious repetitive and insulting and I'd wake with the horrendous fear the next day of what I'd said and to whom and genuinely have no memory of it. Thankfully those days are behind me.

To answer the question posed yes alcohol can be an excuse but it is up to the individual to reduce their consumption or stop altogether if it is causing continuous bad behaviour. Everyone has the occasional fcuk up that I don't think should be judged too harshly but when it becomes a patterns it needs stopping.

j2

Not at all, if you tend to get out of control after a few too many then you should stop with the drinking or reign it in. That's not to say I have no sympathy, I don't intend to be aggressive with someone if they messed up after drinking, but no more than I would with other reasons such as going through a tough time and being a jerk behind that. No sense jumping down your someone's throat when they're already having a hard time.

Strumms

Drink I always found a nice relaxant.

never understood why people get aggressive when drunk,

Royale with Cheese

Alcohol is only an excuse when you and your mates are all 16 and are completely new to it. Once you've been at it a few years and know what to expect after a few drinks then using it as an excuse for your behaviour wears pretty thin.

o1s1n

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120131759#Comment_120131759

'Taste' is completely subjective, what 'tastes nice' and 'doesn't taste nice' is influenced by so many factors nobody can make a blanket statement about everyone fooling themselves that alcohol tastes nice.

People drink alcohol for all kinds of reasons. The range goes all the way from alcoholics drinking hand sanitizer in hospitals to get out of it to people spending 15 euro on a crafted cocktail which tastes delicious.

I can only imagine the alcohol related horrors you've seeing as your time as a Garda. However, you have to remember, in a role like that, you are seeing absolute worst of it - in reality, hundreds of thousands of people in Ireland drink alcohol on a regular basis without issue.

I love a good pint. I don't get **** faced, I don't go out clubbing off my face, I don't attack anyone. I do love going to my local with my friends and having a few Guinness, which is completely and utterly harmless.

BaywatchHQ

As an autist not even alcohol can make me normal. If I am drunk I just appear to be better at socialising but still a quiet socially awkward person. I never get to the stage when I am shouting like what normies do. I think when I first got drunk that is when I realised that I must be an autist as it proved to me that my issues weren't simply anxiety. If I just had social anxiety then alcohol would cure that and you would be normal. No, I am a very abnormal person right down to the core.

Potential-Monke

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120134866#Comment_120134866

Fair, and I understand that. I tried out the alcohol free stuff for a while but that's what made me believe we fool ourselves into thinking it's nice, because of the effects. Take that away and you're left with, imo, horrible liquids. Re: the cocktails, even I enjoyed them because you are effectively changing the taste enough to make it palatable, or in most cases completely over-riding the taste of alcohol. I've no doubt more people would be drinking them if they weren't so prohibitively expensive.

And yes, seeing just the negative side for long enough has changed me as a person, and because of my experiences I'm totally against people using alcohol as an excuse, because I've seen the hurt it causes when it's accepted as such. We're too soft on drink here because of our relationship with it, from simple public order to drink driving. And I've nothing against those who do use it as a social event and don't cause hassle or annoyance to others.

But yes, completely subjective. I still think most people fool themselves though.

sporina

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/2058280392/is-alcohol-an-excuse

nah... IMO it brings out the truth in people.. so yeah.. it defo reduces inhibitions...

But, I don't fully follow the 2nd half of our post.. mayb you could clarify?

Aglomerado

I love a few pints now and then but if I have too many I fall asleep. It relaxes me but since COVID I've been drinking a lot less. I lost interest in it and also found some alcohol free beers I like and I buy them most of the time. I'd probably get drunk by sniffing a beermat these day as I haven't been on a good session in over 3 years. I don't miss it.

I had a great friend for several years whose drinking got worse and worse and he would always get suddenly aggressive (verbally only) on a night out and start berating his wife or me. We had words with him about his behaviour when he was sober as did the rest of his family but to no avail, the next day it would be the same thing. He refused therapy or AA.

Eventually I had to sever contact with him just before COVID, I couldn't take it any more. It's sad to lose a friend but the person I became friends with was long gone. Still in touch with his wife who tells me he's not any better, and she has plans for her near future that no longer include him.

Piskin

Alcohol is a dangerous drug for a lot of people

elperello

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120137280#Comment_120137280

And beer, wine and spirits are enjoyed by most people without drama.

slither12

How do people explain those who get shitfaced drunk and don't ever physically/verbally attack anyone?

sporina

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120148342#Comment_120148342

what ever emotion is really going on, deep down in a person, alcohol brings it out (as it lowers inhibitions).. prob other reasons too... its far from black and white

Potential-Monke

Let's legalise cannabis then, because the vast, vast majority of cannabis users enjoy it without any drama.

I think alcohol can be in keeping with who the person is. It's an opinion I have due to years of being around others who are drunk and also myself. The people in my life act absolutely as I would expect them too and that ranges from falling asleep, opening up, being aggressive, and destructive behaviour. None of it is a surprise to me.

The person who quickly dismisses their hardship or others only to then break down in tears after drink? Or the "they wouldn't hurt a fly" only to explode in a rage. Perhaps that is because deep down is the rage? Like the previous example deep down is the hurt?

I don't quite believe that drunken behaviour is so at odds and out of character for the person inebriated.

Graces7

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120148959#Comment_120148959

Agreeing fully with your post. After all people of course in society etc hide any negative or even aggressive feelings. From politeness or the need to be accepted popular That takes control and control is loosened by alcohol with many folk. Inhibitions crumble.

maninasia

It's not harmless to your body, but in the bigger scheme of things I agree.

I really wonder what Ireland would be like without alcohol. I kind of get a glimpse of it with 20 somethings who are getting more health conscious and into fitness.

Graces7

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120149196#Comment_120149196

Now that is quite a thought! Ireland fully sober ... WOW.. Think of the effect on our beleaguered Health Service alone? General and specialised health care would be massively improved; waiting lists decimated Painful illnesses alleviated...

Potential-Monke

Yeah, but we all know miracles don't happen. In fact, and mostly due to 2 years of lockdown, more people are drinking again. Problem with that is, even more people are using it to cope...

Count Dracula

In vino Veritas.

It depletes inhibitions dramatically.

It brings out the person you are and exposes you to everyone.

We should all try it more often.

I once witnessed an alcoholic (didn’t realise they were fully so at the time) who got jealously vexed at me over an inaccurately perceived situation, just went silly altogether in such a way as it’s hard to forget. Claimed to have no memory months/year later, yet next morning made comments such that there was some form of memory.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120153798#Comment_120153798

I’m not so sure about anyone having a “true nature” but I would accept the “default nature” being a person without influence of substances. That can be variable depending on mood, and some people are far more mousy than others. I just think it’s an extremely complex multidimensional area that’s just being uncovered.

Fathom

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/2058280392/is-alcohol-an-excuse

Note individual differences. I know of 3 brothers that are very different when drunk. The oldest wants to fight. The middle falls asleep. And the youngest wants to make love. Just 2 cents for my anecdotal experience...

Count Dracula

Blackouts are terrifying.

Your real person is on full display, you don't even know who that is?

Be careful, when the hiccups start it is time to leave.

The DayDream

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120148342#Comment_120148342

They may not attack anyone but I can guarantee you no person who regularly gets shitfaced drunk just gets away with doing it all the time without causing any harm to themselves or those close to them. They may think it's a good idea to dance on the table and fall and break a bone, they may miss work, lose important possessions etc. I've known plenty people who didn't become aggressive necessarily but their family, partners etc were worried every time they went out until they landed home because of the way they carried on. And in many cases they did actually get pretty cantankerous when confronted about their alcohol abuse but it was behind closed doors so no one would necessarily see it.

I have to say I really envy the people in this thread who are mystified by the way some people react to alcohol because it doesn't affect them the same way at all. Count yourselves lucky. Most people at least have one relative with drink issues but not all I suppose. At the same time it's frustrating at times because such people can sometimes seem to look down on others who can't just drink normally. But they just don't understand it. Whereas I can't under how someone stops after a few drinks. When I try to do it, it is either a) absolute torture and makes drinking kinda pointless or b) and this is by far the most common result: I'm completely unsuccessful and end up, for example, still in the pub at closing time with the loaf of bread and litre of milk I bought in town at 4 pm, minutes before the thought of 'just having one or two' even entered me head.