Staff Shortages in Ireland.

Jinglejangle69

So we have staff shortages in

Doctors

Nurses

Gards

Teachers

Commission of Utilities

Bus Drivers

Plumbers

Electricians

Labourers

Chefs

Hospitality

Taxi Drivers

Childcare

I am sure there is more i am missing. It hasn’t always been like this?

We are constantly told by politicians we are a rich country and extremely lucky.

Why the shortages? Surely it’s not sustainable and we can already see it’s bringing down the standards and reputation of our “first world” country status.

Will things get any better?

Coolcormack1979

Things will get worse in new yr.was talking to a lad the other day doing a job for me and he said he knew of at least 50 people who are emigrating.across all professions from doctors,nurses,teachers and builders.fed up with this country and being taxed to the bollix whilst other get everything for nothing.

also Eamon Ryan’s name got mentioned too as a reason for leaving.stick his green stuff where the sun doesn’t shine

walterking

The job seekers allowance is far too generous as are many social welfare payments.

This is a barrier to work for entry level jobs.

On the professions we need to pull anyone with the relevant skills out of the refugee system and immerse them in English language and get them placed in jobs.

And it has to be made far easier to bring skilled people from other countries - teachers from South Africa are superb but near impossible to bring in

prunudo

Can't attract overseas workers due to the cost of housing and the lack of services. Everything is too expensive here for anyone starting off. No houses, no gp's, no schools, no public transport, expensive car insurance. The list goes on. Ireland just isn't an attractive place to come for people who want to work and make a living here.

Its across the board, through all pay scales, the sums just don't add up to come and live here.

And don't get me started on the excessive time frame caused by red tape to do business here. Plenty of people out there who want to start up or expand buisnesses being held up for ridiculous timelines by government bodies.

Fr Tod Umptious

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120002197#Comment_120002197

Where are they going?

Because in most western countries you are going to get the likes of Eammon Ryan and "green" policies and as tax goes we are far from the worst, in fact because of the budget people will pay less tax come January.

Wezz

You can add social workers and social care workers to that list. The shortages are chronic and there isn’t any indication that it’s going to improve a

Mongfinder General

One Common denominator here appears to be “having to deal with the public”. Most of us don’t want to do this.

Thelonious Monk

Eamon Ryan is a reason people are emigrating lol, I've heard it all now. I hope they're not going to Australia where a pro-Green government got in power not too long ago.

The CSO says more Irish people are coming home rather than leaving at the moment. I know of 2 doctors that will be returning to Ireland soon to work. Most doctors spend some years abroad working but given the high pay in Ireland and family ties etc. most want to return too.

RobbingBandit

Adult disability services are at an extremely vulnerable risk to the point of people in need myself being one such are being turfed out of services.

The service I am/was linked with ran half a dozen recruitment days with no staff recruited for my centre I am now left to fend for myself which isn't good.

SuperBowserWorld

Lots of well paid IT jobs. And a lot of these are ancillary jobs, not actually designing, producing or maintaining any software. Just heads on Zoom calls. So, loads of opportunities in this sector.

I know, I've been working in the industry for 30 years.

Ditto in banking, insurance, ...

A lot of people moving from useful work into less useful work for this reason or emigrating.

A lot of jobs that do not actually produce anything of any value. They will be automated or offshored. They are temporary. Gold rush times.

Not much use if your kid is sick, or needs an education, your plumbing is fucked, you need a house to live in, you need to get to work or a hospital appointment, you are sick ... , the road needs to be repaired, there is a fire, there is not enough police, ...

So, the country needs to decide what we really value and pay the appropriate compensation for these jobs.

There is a huge snobbery in Ireland too. People worship well paid snake oil sales men here.

😛

Edit ..

Housing is the main driver. People are forced to do work, which may not be of value to society, which they don't enjoy or are suitable for, to earn enough money to pay for a roof over their heads.

And, both parents in a family are forced to do this.

Edit 2

And it's FFG who are responsible for this. We got the biggest kick in the arse, lesson learnt as a nation in 2008, and we've gone and done it all over again.

Geuze

Teachers: I'd say the shortages are mainly in Dublin, due to accomm costs?

Doctors: as this occupation has become more and more feminised, then more staff are needed (headcount versus FTE), due to more job sharing, part-time working, etc,

Construction: not enough young people want to get a skilled trade, people are put off by a boom-bust cycle

Oscar_Madison

Cost of Housing is a huge issue.

Lack of rental accommodation is a huge issue

High rents is a huge issue.

You’ll always get people who will want to work in the above roles but are prohibited from doing so due to the cost of just living.

Some of those jobs such as taxi drivers chefs labourers bus drivers were traditionally done by people who had the opportunity to live in a council house for life with low rents, enabling them to have a good working life, raise a family and have a decent level of stability.

There are a lot less council homes relative to the population these days- it’s a different world and those professions just don’t pay enough to enable you to live life.

Thelonious Monk

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120002594#Comment_120002594

No it's not FFFG's fault it's the Greens' fault that people are leaving didn't you read the OP?

SuperBowserWorld

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120002693#Comment_120002693

It's so funny, people blaming the greens for everything.

The reason we have problems is that little Johnny and little Mary are not going to do any useful work when they can earn loads of money opening boxes or playing Minecraft on YouTube or could be a employee diversity director in a company they makes weapons.

Or director of tax avoidance.

Loads of well paid jobs around. Just need to look.

🤣🤣🤣

Thelonious Monk

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120002716#Comment_120002716

I sometimes really wish I had a trade. Are there any schemes to get grown ups into trades I wonder or do they only focus on school leavers?

Frank Bullitt

I’ve always been on the fence about moving back to Ireland, been living in Canada for almost 10 years now and work in software.

Plenty to move back for in terms of family, friends and it being “home”, Vancouver is also very expensive but you can get by with the volume of rentals, that’s a big draw back here with the lack of it. Price wise, it’s about the same but you’ve far more choice.

I’ve one friend who moved back this year and he is planning to move back over to Canada. He just can’t settle here or get going, he also works in construction.

It’s different for everyone of course, the pull and push of Ireland changes everyday. For some in the jobs listed about, who could blame them for wanting a better go at things and heading off.

SuperBowserWorld

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120002722#Comment_120002722

Yep, I'd do plumber and carpenter..and build a house in my garden in case the kids get jobs that'll be automated by robots.

Also, snake oil salesman to squeeze planning application past the council.

blanch152

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120002602#Comment_120002602

In relation to medical staff, an ageing population, a growing population, combined with the long-term effects of previous recruitment moratoriums have combined to create a problem. The capacity of third-level to upscale provision is also an issue, particularly in relation to capital capacity and the sourcing of placements.

whisky_galore

Don't worry, all the techies down in the super-duper Googly Facetube Interweb Quarter will save us all!

waterwelly

Well the people voted in the greens in sufficient numbers to put them in a position of power, so it's not Eamon Ryan's fault.

We have a problem with housing, a major one. Leo was on about a building boom recently but with objections, high costs and shortages of tradespeople etc. this won't happen.

We also have a retirement age that needs to be increased,because we have a huge generation of retired people who want to be served in restaurants, bars, hospitals, taxis etc. They want electricians and plumbers to work on their homes but give them a discount because they are retired.

Then families are getting smaller now so there are proportionally less young people available to work in hospitality to earn college money. Coupled with an expanding retirement cohort it's going the wrong way.

The problems are many and varied but politicians won't deal with them, the retirement age being a biggie.

BattleCorp

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120002577#Comment_120002577

Have you ever seen the application form for joining the HSE? Strange as it sounds, I know several people who were thinking of applying but when they saw the application form they just went nope.

BattleCorp

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120002722#Comment_120002722

Anybody can become an apprentice if you can get a tradesperson to take you on, no matter what your age. But realistically adults can't afford to live on an apprentice's wage. You'd want to be living at home with Mammy and Daddy to be able to survive on a first year's apprentice wage.

Dyr

Still, no shortage of Deliveroo drivers, thank god.

Ham_Sandwich

goverment should be doing more, raise wages and lower taxes.

monseiur

The cost of living especially the cost or rental accommodation in our cities is our downfall. I know of 4 teachers all were teaching in Dublin have moved to the Middle East this year on a 5 year teaching contract. With the astronomical cost of renting they were unable to save enough for a deposit on a house - but the actual rent they were paying would almost pay the monthly mortgage - there sure is something wrong somewhere

timmyntc

Too many bullshít jobs

Theres too much money in bullshít jobs of no real worth, and this draws away people from the jobs society actually needs. A lot of this is related to the advertising bubble too - you can do any aul crap and get paid, not because its useful but because advertisers think that you are doing enough for them to profit.

We are now reaching a point where irish society has a big gulf in the middle, an employment no mans land. There are plenty of immigrants to take advantage of to work in bars, restaurants, deliveroo drivers. There are plenty of people with not so great college degrees working as "associate saas salesforce editor assistant to the regional manager". But there are very few people picking up building trades, taxi drivers, ambulance drivers, school teaching, gardai. Many of these jobs pay reasonably well too, they would not be considered low-end.

But because the barrier for entry is too high for the recent immigrants & language students, and those who do meet the entry requirements can get more money working in a bullshít job, these jobs go unfilled. And society suffers. And it will get much worse.

Polar101

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120003114#Comment_120003114

It's only because Eamon Ryan really likes takeaway food.

Graces7

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120002577#Comment_120002577

Same in eg Canada. Family there are having to leave emergency accommodation after a certain time length after their homes were destroyed in the bad storm earlier this year (Newfoundland) They have literally nowhere to go. I have significant and increasing disability but never involved with services. Just was made to be too complicated. After five years they have suddenly realised and i now get a Lunch Club meal sent in once a week... As someone has posted it is jobs that involves direct contact with people.

Wanderer78

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/2058275990/staff-shortages-in-ireland

wealth is generally presented in the value of assets such as property, so those of us that have been accumulating assets, in all forms in particular in property, are deemed wealthy, but those that dont have assets are screwed, primarily younger generations.... i.e. we re certainly a wealthier nation compared to the past, but not only has overall wealth being growing, so to has wealth inequality, which means we re all screwed, including us asset owners....

many of the jobs and sectors mentioned have been in decline in real terms, in regards pay and conditions, for many years now, to the point, its actually now not possible to survive from the pay and conditions offered, and you may forget about trying to save in order to be able to purchase a property, i.e. an asset, in such jobs, this is in fact one of the main reasons why theres so many vacancies in these professions, but there are many other reasons also....

breezy1985

People can project their personal gripes about the Greens or tax or the dole all they want but it's all bollix.

We need people to move here to fill a lot of jobs but people can't move here because there is hardly anything in the rental market. Never mind too expensive sometimes there is nothing at all.

Mr. CooL ICE

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120003390#Comment_120003390

Apparently, he keeps reordering food if delivered by a car and won't eat anything delivered to him until it arrives via bike. Aaaand he expenses all the uneaten deliveries to the taxpayer.

I know at least 50 people that have been this happen.

SuperBowserWorld

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120002942#Comment_120002942

Were putting our hopes and dreams in TikTok now. 🤣🤣🤣

JustJoe7240

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120003085#Comment_120003085

They’re old rates, first year apprentices are on 8.50 an hour, Including travel time as a lot of companies do, First years and pre apprentices are coming home with around 380 a week, Money is poor, but considering all most lads are fit for is sweeping the floor, it’s not bad at all

Mike3549

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120002722#Comment_120002722

One of the easiest ways of career change would be getting a 'C' drivers license. I don't know how things are now, but 6-9mnths ago there was a massive shortage here, and in uk 1000 times worse. Theres plenty of jobs here in waste recycling companies driving bin trucks or skip trucks, roadsweepers, low loaders, recovery trucks etc

riclad

teachers and nurses are leaving ireland, they can work in other countrys and get paid well and find a place to live.

the average rent in ireland is too high, nurses and teachers cannot afford to buy a house.

i,m not an economist ,some people might say the economy is booming and theres more jobs than people to fill them.

10 years ago a nurse or a garda could buy a house , now they,ll find it hard to find a decent place to rent ,

wages have not gone up in line with the cost of housing

Padre_Pio

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120002594#Comment_120002594

I'd agree with that.

The jobs on the OPs list have one or more of the following in common:

Dealing with Joe public

underpaid

Crap working conditions.

Doctors and nurses have all three.

BorneTobyWilde

People in Ireland tend to be short, staff shortages was bound to happen, must be the diet

Mrs OBumble

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120005203#Comment_120005203

That's about the same as a first year clerical worker for the government.

At least the apprentice has better prospects over time. (If the clerical workers can manage to organise the training courses the apprentice needs).

Faugheen

Roaring laughing at the idea that people are leaving because of Eamon Ryan.

Literally didn’t happen of the year awards.

Or, let’s take it on its merits, and assume that it is because of him. Where are they going to go? Australia?

Ireland's gone through boom-bust-boom cycles and has an economy that's heavily tilted towards a small number of sectors and has a housing shortage, which is largely a hangover from the 2008-12 crash, which isn't that long ago.

FF and FG seem to think that the magic forces of the market will just solve this automatically - doesn't look likely but also it's unrealistic to think it'll be solved quickly. It won't. So I think this is going to be a mess for years.

Economically we've more in common with some of the tech boom cities in the US than with a lot of Europe - rapid booms, with no time for infrastructure to catch up but also with relatively laissez faire attitudes to housing and little or nothing being done in the public side of housing provision.

Also, the funnelling of rent allowances into the private sector, instead of building social housing, has effectively turned into a revenue stream for a lot of people in a way it should never have been.

We plan all of our infrastructure too small, and then have to expand it - health, transport, housing etc too.

Flinty997

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/2058275990/staff-shortages-in-ireland

Why the shortage?

Our economy and population have grown massively over decades.

This is the good times. Well except the housing crisis and the shortages. No time is perfect.

20Wheel

that apprenticeship path looks like bollox.

maybe the reason we lack tradespeople is that theres a learning system which is using the new entrants as cheap labor.

you can go learn theory over 3/4+ years for university science qualifications without actually ever being employed in the field, upon qualifying you'll go and apply your mad scientist level learning to multi million euro industrial output which acutely affects lives.

so why can you not do the same with plumbing, or mechanics. Go to a technical college for 2 years, learn and practice the theory in class. and then out into the field in the same manner as the science graduate ... the scientist who is doing way more complex stuff, with way higher stakes.

is it because the apprenticeship scheme is a handy way to fuk over the young, and make monkeys out of them.

before turning around and saying boo hoo we lack tradespeople, why wont they just be our slaves for a pittance over an extended time.

why are the govt poking their nose in here. if you learn something and pass the exams then you have the knowledge to do the job, why is it ok for one person to be in uni for 4 years (as their own private person) before walking out the gate and taking part responsibility for the production of volatile chemicals or medicines.

yet the other person (doing work with less potential widespread consequences) must be tied to a private business with govt monitoring over 4 years, before being allowed to take responsibility for fixing a leaky radiator.

if its a matter of quality control then fair enough, that can be dealt with, make it 6 months monitoring. 6 months tied to a previously qualified tradesperson, as a post-qualification worker. or even a year.

rather than the current king-servant design, unqualified uneducated young worker providing cheap labor to the established business. all the time under the watchful eye of govt. progressing only at a set speed to a set pattern. its not about your ability, its about your time served. aka your sentence.

Padre_Pio

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120005992#Comment_120005992

Apprentices rotate through phases of classroom training to work experience.

Some university courses are the same where you may spend 6-12 months on work experience.

Apprentices are paid during their training from about 300-500 a week, though it's been a while since I looked at the rates.

A lot of your post is factually incorrect and it seems you have an axe to grind.

CalamariFritti

@20Wheel

Bull

How much do you think a 16 year old who can barely tell a screwdriver from a volt meter, should be paid - a grand a week?

An apprentice is not a cheap worker - well sometime she has to be that too - but someone who is learning a trade for life and getting paid for it. Those rates don't look bad to me at all tbh.

20Wheel

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120006022#Comment_120006022

Theres nothing incorrect in my post.

And I know the system in use. Hence the first fking line.

And yes I have an axe to grind because I could have chosen a trade at several points but didn't because of the meddling restrictive design.

Does someone on a computer science course, or an optometry course have to rotate into a private business? And have govt looking over their shoulder.

I mean they're only going to be dealing with databases and peoples eyeballs.

Its the guy installing pipes we have to watch. And funnily enough ... and this is pure coincidence, I promise. He has to be kept on sht money initially and be beholden to a business owner.

Why is nobody entering the trades. hmm.

20Wheel

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120006045#Comment_120006045

Did I say a grand a week?

If you'd actually fking read you'd see I wasn't suggesting any pay whatsoever. Same as any other course for the most part.

"An apprentice is not a cheap worker - well sometime she has to be that too". Well which is it?

Nonsense post.

Flinty997

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120006054#Comment_120006054

No ones entering it because the industry collapsed after the crash and never recovered. When you consider all the scandals with building standards and regulations and developers. Why would anyone object to some sort of checking on the trades?

purifol0

Some big brain thinking by the OP here. Maybe do a bit of research.

Doctors - a shortage eh, well lets see how many do we train a year? Answer: <200, and half are foreign students who immediately move abroad after their junior doctor stint.

Nurses: actually we have zillions, AND we pay them to train (tough **** every other type of student), the whining of course is because the INMO is the most powerful public sector union in the country.

Not enough Gardai? Well apart from all the desk jockeying the issue is not enough jail spaces for the repeat offenders. And of course state & EU sexist hiring policies meaning Ireland police force is now gender quota-ing its way to having "on the beat" male Gards having to protect their female Garda partners during arrests. As if the physical requirements weren't low enough already FFS.

Plumbers, Electricians, Labourers - Yeah construction & trades, the Irish men needed to build the country were treated so badly during the 2008 recession they left, and were encouraged to do so by the state. Now they are desperately needed again to build houses for a country that insists on pushing expensive university places over trades to its youth, while importing an unlimited no. of refugees, nearly all women and children and thus utterly dependent on state supports.

There are 100,000 men in the construction industry, what % of them are Irish anymore eh?

Hospitality - **** pay, uncertain long term prospects, not public sector so no chance of the govt giving a **** unless you own a hotel.

Taxi Drivers - Over regulated industry to keep fares high. Lots of people own and can drive cars however Taxi drivers have effectively got the govt to over regulate this industry to the point that ordinary folk cannot simply drive for Uber or their many competitors despite the fact the GPS enabled smartphones have reduced the barrier to entry. Imagine having to do a separate license and exam to be a pizza delivery driver??? And of course how long did it take for the state to make pay by card a legal right for the customer eh?

Childcare - boils down to houses being unnaffordable on 1 persons salary and so two parents need to work.

Chefs - Ireland is indeed a rich country and a lot of people (usually women, often retired public sector) love to eat well and eat out. Hence the demand.

purifol0

Teachers - oops left this one out. Pop quiz, why are the teachers that are two a penny like English teachers, paid the same as in demand & far rarer Math & physics teachers???

Surely if theres not enough of them, pay could be raised for those in demand and lowered for those who are surplus....oh right yeah public sector unions would oust any govt that dared improve things for the pupils if it meant their ridiculous pay,pensions & terms & conditions and holidays should ever be changed for the worst. They'll happily take more of your taxes though, and give you the poor mouth whilst doing so.

For as long as public sector workers votes have the same weight at the ballot box as taxpayers votes, this situation will not change.

Is it really democracy when those who pay for everything get the same say as those who take from them?

Would working parents let their dependent children have the same say of the household budget?

Big Gerry

For a lot of low paid jobs people are better off on the dole.

Some people can make 50k a year on the dole tax free if they are claiming multiple benefits.

20Wheel

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120006218#Comment_120006218

Why would the govt constantly involve themselves over the years with someone learning to fit pipes, but not someone learning history or Greek or human resources management, or physiotherapy, or radiography.

Did you hear of the banking scandal? Why would anyone object to finance students being beholden to govt monitoring and private businesses throughout their course.

You go to the classroom and learn to make chemical compounds, why can't I go to the classroom and learn to weld a bumper. Without the need to involve myself with a business for 6 months at a time and have the govt monitoring me.

If you can pass the exams you can do it - be it Greek or Accounting or Carpentry. No need for any monkey business with private employers and govt.