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Received a letter from PIAB with false claims

  • 06-12-2022 10:22am
    #1
    Registered Users Posts: 8 kevinporter


    Hi, thanks for reading.

    I recently received a letter from the PIAB about a person accusing my dog of jumping on them and injuring them. This never happened and the only thing i can recall is back in July where my dog was briefly playing with another dog in the park and the other dog owner fell over, but wasn't even near either dog. I asked him was he ok and he said yes.

    In the PIAB letter there were injuries noted and a letter from a doctor. There was no proof/evidence of how he got the injuries or that a dog caused them. I am obviously not going to consent here, but what will happen next?

    All replies appreciated.

    Thank you,



«1

Comments

  • Registered Users Posts: 423 ✭✭ AnRothar


    Do you have insurance on your dog?

    Do you have house insurance? Some house insurance policies have clauses regarding pets.

    If yes to either they will need to be advised.



  • Registered Users Posts: 10,978 ✭✭✭✭ elperello


    Consult a solicitor.



  • Registered Users Posts: 8 kevinporter


    Hi, thanks

    No I don't have dog insurance and looks like my home insurance doesn't cover it. I have informed them though but also said this person completely made it up.

    Thanks.



  • Registered Users Posts: 8 kevinporter


    Thank you, Solicitor is working out more expensive than what the claim or damages actually is.



  • Registered Users Posts: 2,625 ✭✭✭ Kaisr Sose


    That sounds mad OP. They are alleging your dog attacked them on x date and you have no knowledge at all of this occurring?

    Do you know the person involved and if not, how did they get your details?



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  • Registered Users Posts: 1,723 ✭✭✭ mumo3


    I'd be more curious as to how a stranger got your name and address!!

    Have you contact the PIAB and told them you've no idea what its about.



  • Registered Users Posts: 413 ✭✭ Garibaldi?


    would there be cctv anywhere which might shed light on the matter? Any possible witnesses. Sounds like someone is taking the proverbial.



  • Registered Users Posts: 8 kevinporter


    yes, they live in the same estate and they have history of doing this. When the incident happened i did not know who they were. I know who they are now, but what i meant in op was that what my dog is accused of never happened.



  • Registered Users Posts: 8 kevinporter


    No, it was a dog park with no cctv around. Their word against mine i guess but doesn't stop me from being worried.



  • Registered Users Posts: 8 kevinporter


    was a stranger at the time, but from the PIAB letter they live across a green from me.



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  • Registered Users Posts: 413 ✭✭ Garibaldi?


    Even if you had insurance it would not be right to allow this proceed uncontested. Your dog does not deserve to get a bad name for no reason.



  • Registered Users Posts: 1,723 ✭✭✭ mumo3


    Cheeky fcking mares if you ask me!! I understand you must be out of your mind with worry about this but just remind yourselves of the below information!!

    "In a civil case, the burden of proof is on the plaintiff or claimant. He must prove, on the balance of probabilities, that the facts alleged by him in his claim, are true. Proof on the balance of probabilities requires that the claimant shows that the facts he alleges are more likely than not to be true."

    Evidence Overview - McMahon Legal Guide



  • Registered Users Posts: 1,723 ✭✭✭ mumo3


    Or worse an order to be destroyed... what is wrong with people!!



  • Registered Users Posts: 2,625 ✭✭✭ Kaisr Sose


    Under PIAB process you do not have to consent to the claim. The claimant then has to go the court route. If they are chancing their arm, this will make them consider whether that's worth the risk and cost. PIAB is a cheap roll of the dice for them in comparison.

    Did you consult a solicitor?

    How do you know what the cost will be of the claim? PIAB do not give a claim or award amount at the outset.

    No offence intended, is this a wind up by you?



  • Registered Users Posts: 323 ✭✭ GavPJ


    Deny, deny deny. Best of luck. I don't think there is a judge in the country that would entertain this.



  • Registered Users Posts: 16,144 ✭✭✭✭ Donald Trump


    PIAB only assess damages for injuries. They don't determine liability.



  • Registered Users Posts: 8 kevinporter


    Thanks for your response.

    No, not a wind up. Wish it was. I never even heard of PIAB before this letter.



  • Registered Users Posts: 24,717 ✭✭✭✭ coylemj


    OP said:

    Solicitor is working out more expensive than what the claim or damages actually is.

    Poster Kaisr Sose asked...

    How do you know what the cost will be of the claim? PIAB do not give a claim or award amount at the outset.

    OP, can you address this issue - did the PIAB letter say how much the claimant is seeking?



  • Registered Users Posts: 228 ✭✭ phildub


    Tell piab you are not consenting to assessment and wait and see what happens. The new PIAB process was introduced to limit costs so a lay litigant cab do it themselves. If PIAB issue an authorisation for claimant to issue court proceedings that is when you need a solicitor.


    Under PIAB rules, and this is just from general reading, not advice, if piab assess an award at a certain amount you, as the respondent will have 30 days to accept or reject OR YOU WILL BE DEEMED TO HAVE ACCEPTED IT. So is important to engage with PIAB. If you are not admitting liability then you do not consent to assessment, if PIAB go ahead and assess then you need to respond and say you are not accepting. Again, not legal advise, this is just from reading.



  • Registered Users Posts: 2,625 ✭✭✭ Kaisr Sose


    Just on the above, and not legal legal advice either. A respondent can refuse PIAB consent at the outset. PIAB will then issue the claimant with an authorisation to proceed via the courts.

    Why consent, even without prejudice to their right to reject an award of damages etc, if they are absolutely certain they have no liability and this never happened?

    OP. Please contact Free Legal Advice centre for your options here. Citizens Information or PIAB websites will give you more information on this. It may be worth checking with your local Garda Station to see if a report was made or with the Dog Warden. The claimant will have to have some evidence this event took place as claimed.

    A claim is only a claim. It has to be proven. Determining liabllity is not the remit of PIAB.



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  • Registered Users Posts: 5,644 ✭✭✭ Red Silurian


    Something similar happened to me a few years ago. Never heard from them again, I didn't recognise the name on the letter or anything so I think it might have been a scam, maybe check the authenticity of the letter before proceeding any further?

    In my case I wasn't worried as I don't and have never owned a dog, hence why I think it was a scam



  • Registered Users Posts: 243 ✭✭ chunkylover4


    As above, refuse assessment asap.



  • Registered Users Posts: 3,728 ✭✭✭ 3DataModem


    Get a solicitor. You want to be sure that if you end up paying a bill, that it is full and final settlement.



  • Registered Users Posts: 2,607 ✭✭✭ Eggs For Dinner


    I would be very surprised if your household insurance doesn't provide cover, as it is a standard extension (excluding certain breeds). If so, insurers retain the right to handle all matters as they see fit. If you take a course of action which prejudices their position, they can refuse to indemnify you. Unlike motor insurance (because it is a compulsory cover) insurers are not obliged to compensate a 3rd party if you are found liable and you will face all associated costs

    In short, check if your household insurance policy covers you and, if so, notify them and leave them to it. If not, contact your solicitor



  • Registered Users Posts: 2,264 ✭✭✭ NUTLEY BOY


    This is very good advice. This is exactly the type of situation that liability insurers are there to deal with.

    Engaging in correspondence with other parties is probably a breach of policy conditions. AFAIK you are supposed to send all correspondence directly to your insurers unacknowledged for them to deal with it and that you are not to deal with it yourself.

    Going to a solicitor was probably a waste of money. The liability insurers should deal with it. They have the resources and knowledge to deal with this sort of matter.

    I don't know if it still exists but insurers used to operate a database of claimants who would be flagged up immediately for previous claims. Has GDPR killed that too ?

    On the limited information to hand I would have thought that a household insurance contract would encompass the circumstances of this claim. There are probably exclusions of claims involving dogs of certain breeds or prohibited types but that will be in the actual policy wording.

    At this stage I would be asking my insurers to confirm that they are dealing with the matter.

    Don't forget that irrespective of the merits of the case the insurers have the right to settle the claim or to contest it. Some insurers will pay up a nuisance type settlement to minimise the risks of legal costs and others will defend especially if they know the plaintiff to be dodgy.



  • Registered Users Posts: 10,513 ✭✭✭✭ BattleCorp


    As has been said already, PIAB don't care if this incident happened or not. They won't do any investigations etc. They are only there to assess the injury and to make an award or else issue a release to go to court.

    There is a €1050 fee payable to PIAB if you consent to them assessing the case and I'm assuming that that's the figure on the letter that you got from PIAB asking if you consent to it being assessed. It used to be €600 before 11th April 2022.

    If you don't consent to PIAB assessing the case, PIAB will issue a release for the other party to take you to court. If they do decide to do that, they'll either drop their case or they'll have to engage a solicitor and take their chances in court. Unfortunately, if they do that, you'll have to engage a solicitor to mount a defence. It could end up costing you a packet eitherways.

    And even if you win the case and have costs awarded to you, there's no guarantee that you'll actually receive any money so you could end up having to pay your own legal costs.



  • Registered Users Posts: 2,625 ✭✭✭ Kaisr Sose


    OP said their insurance does not cover this. I do not know if this is their thinking or they checked with them. I think the former.



  • Registered Users Posts: 24,342 ✭✭✭✭ Mrs OBumble


    Not ASAP.

    You have 30 days. If household insurance really doesn't cover it (double check with the company) then send the refusal on about day 28 (assuming two days is enough for post, allow an extra day if you think it's warranted.).

    You're in no rush.



  • Registered Users Posts: 774 ✭✭✭ Breezy_


    Every single day, I see this shite, I think to myself....a real pandemic or a nice good war wouldn't be such a bad thing.



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