Increasing tolls when cost of operations at booths is plummeting

veryangryman

I know they have a link to the CPI to justify increases but to be fair, they operate with skeleton staffs (many unmanned at all during night time)

Are we being taken for a ride here? Other countries have removed tolls as the years pass

munchkin_utd

In France the tolls reduce over time, but arent removed from what i gather. Italy seems to be the same, and in both cases tolls are far higher than in Ireland because nearly all motorways are tolled.

But yea, it is sortof pulling the ps that they are going for the highest possible toll rise , linking to an inflation rate which is largely food and energy related, and not really linked to their ability to cover finance repayments and minimal enough running costs.

Mrs Dempsey

When I pay a toll, presumably it is not to cover the tool booth infrastructure staffing costs alone.

Setting up a booth to pay for the booth seems somewhat a futile cycle.

L1011

Their main maintenance cost is linked to oil prices - asphalt - admittedly.

plodder

Interesting that the state owned road tolls are being increased by 9%, though they have discretion to forego any such rises. It kind of undermines any argument that the state makes where cost increases should be sucked up, and not passed on through higher prices/wages, potentially leading to an inflation spiral. If anything, the state should be taking the lead to avoid that.

https://www.irishtimes.com/transport/2022/11/17/cost-of-tolls-on-irish-road-network-to-rise-to-maximum-allowed-from-january/

Del2005

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119884889#Comment_119884889

When was the last time a tolled road was resurfaced and when is it due again?

The toll rises are a blatant money grab and will result in more costs to the state as more people will avoid the safe motorway and use local roads. In 2018 a fatal crash cost €1.7m and a serious crash was €400k, how many more crashes will result from this increase?

L1011

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119885501#Comment_119885501

Pretty much eternal ongoing maintenance on all of them. They have to kept to a specific standard, much higher than TII enforces on it's own roads, and the entire surface has to be replaced less than 10 years before the end of the contract in most cases.

The m50, which has a maintenance contract, has constant partial overlays of specific lanes as they begin to wear

roadmaster

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119885510#Comment_119885510

Travel the M1 Northroute the surface is RAF in parts for a long time

TipsyMcStagge

It is pure profiteering but they are under no obligation to make it fair.

zg3409

To be fair I would drive less and I moved house closer to work to avoid tolls.

I drive an EV and I get 50-75% off toll prices and about 80% off fuel equivalent costs due to efficient EV, but I still moved closer to work to remove toll and reduce commute and wear and tear on car. I know many don't have the option and some areas have no tolls while others pass through 2 different tolls on the way to work.

They are an inefficient way to collect taxes and waste a lot of time on billing and accounts and letters and staff, they do slightly help reduce unnecessary trips particularly through the port tunnell at peak times.

kravmaga

This is just pure corporate greed, Govt did not see this one coming apparently. Big shock there , they havent a clue whats going on most of the time, lol

What will happen here is motorists and heavier vehicles like rigids, trucks , HGV will not use the by passes and will revert to going through the towns to avoid the tolls.

https://www.rte.ie/news/ireland/2022/1117/1336621-tolls-ireland/

fliball123

We are now being tripled taxed for driving, tax on petrol/diesel, motor tax and tolls all 3 of these have gone up in the last while in our supposed cost of living crisis at what point is the M50 and other roads that are tolled paid for and at what point can we say enough is enough? If there was decent public transport available people would use it but the majority of the country simply has not got it. Where the hell are our taxes going?

Jeremy Sproket

What's wrong with paying a bit towards using what is very good infrastructure? Ireland, to be fair, has a very good motorway infrastructure. It mightn't be that extensive, but what we do have is good. They're one of the few things we did right here.

In saying that, I always believe that the M50 should've been free from the get go. Yes, the operator and organisation that built it had to get paid, but they could've clawed in that money by tolling the city centre roads. It's farcical to build a ring road with the sole intention of alleviating city traffic ..... then charging people to use it, thus forcing people onto the roads that they were trying to declog in the first place. There's little or no reason to bring a private car into the city centre.

Still stihl waters 3

Expect the costs of goods to keep increasing also, 6.40 previously for a lorry to go through most tolls, more cost to companies that will have to be passed onto the consumer

b v

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119887114#Comment_119887114

It’s a paltry increase in the grand scheme. Imagine €6.40 divided between all the goods in the lorry!

In saying that, maybe we should increase tolls for private vehicles and make commercial vehicles free.

Furze99

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119885148#Comment_119885148

The state is one of the biggest hypocrites when it comes to price hikes. Think how many times you hear politicians criticising private enterprises for putting up prices.

Tonesjones

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119886701#Comment_119886701

"Where the hell are our taxes going?"

Public sector pay

Welfare

NGOs

Still stihl waters 3

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119887232#Comment_119887232

True but its another cost to an industry that's pin to the collar already, inevitably all these small increases end up taking money out of workers pockets

b v

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119887367#Comment_119887367

Still what?

It’s a couple of euros increase divided against all of the goods in a huge van or lorry. You’d spend the same amount idling in traffic or going too hard on the accelerator.

Kurooi

I was under the impression that toll pays for the road I'm driving on. That at least being the logical reason as to why I (the active user of it) am paying it rather than it being charged out of general tax base.

And 99% of the cost has been incurred, the ongoing maintenance is a fraction of the cost. So yes hiking that to inflation seems an insult.

We are all just used to being taken for a ride.

DownByTheGarden

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119886701#Comment_119886701

Dont forget VRT :)

Still stihl waters 3

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119887413#Comment_119887413

Death by a thousand cuts

L1011

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119887436#Comment_119887436

The construction cost has been borne but the debt to build it with probably hasn't been paid back yet and has ongoing repayments and interests.

The Waterford bypass will probably never pay its loans back. It isn't covering interest, the opco loses money every year. They're nearly halfway to when they have to hand it back now.

https://thecurrency.news/articles/52677/a-beautiful-burden-why-a-global-pe-giant-and-a-us-investment-bank-have-taken-ownership-of-an-irish-toll-road/

Without checking, I imagine the M1 and M4/M6 are doing well but the others... not so much. The M3 and N18 get some minimum traffic guarantees, pre-COVID the M3's wasn't paying out anymore as they had gone over the minimum - I don't know about now as it won't be in the TII accounts for a year or two.

DPT and M50 are owned by the state and operated under contract, East Link is owned by the Council as it reverted when its contract expired.

fliball123

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119887058#Comment_119887058

We do pay for this infrastructure, we pay income taxes, motor taxes, carbon taxes, VAT, Stamp duty, DiRT, CAT, CGT, Corpo tax, property tax. The issue here is very little money gets ring fenced it goes into one big pot and this year as a population we paid more than our fair fecking share to cover the cost of the M50 and every other toll bridge going. As a citizen I would like to know what exactly is our taxes paying for I see zero benefits from it from where I am if I have to use a state resource it usually costs me more as I use it.

fliball123

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119887232#Comment_119887232

Its not really when calculated on an annual basis and added onto the already over loaded extra expense people have to pay in this country. So can we say lets cut politicians wage to the same amount as its only a paltry cut? Stupid argument the amount is not the issue.

Imeacht gan teacht ort

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119888587#Comment_119888587

Absolutely, glad someone said it.

GSBellew

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119885501#Comment_119885501

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119886630#Comment_119886630

Lots of the M1 has been done recently, the CRG PPP section is from Junction 7 to Junction 18, anything outside of that is nothing to do with the M1 toll.

I drove both ways the other day & can't say I noticed anything bordering on rough.

veryangryman

How long is left on each PPP contract? I wonder if we can lobby our politicians when the time approaches to remove the tolls when they complete

GSBellew

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119889575#Comment_119889575

https://www.tii.ie/roads-tolling/projects-and-improvements/ppp/

L1011

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119889575#Comment_119889575

Most are 30 years from opening. The last to open were the Limerick Tunnel and M7/M8 in 2010.

The M1 from 2003 would be the next to lapse assuming it is 30 also, however that contract was odd in that a different bit of untolled road was built later so it may not be the same

roadmaster

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119889123#Comment_119889123

Its being a while since i was on it but around the toll it was very bad. It will be the 1st of the 2000s PPPs to come back under TII control