Ad awareness about electricity saving?

Brid Hegarty

We have non-profit ads on TV and radio about spotting sexual harassment in public, about smelling gas on the street, etc. So why can't we have ads about how to save electricity? I know a lot on boards are climate change deniers and that's fair enough, but for those of you who do believe, I have to ask if you think this would be a good idea? It could be something like '5 basic tips for how to save electricity'. And I know people wouldn't like it and you'd get a lot of "they're bringing in data centres and they won't even allow me to make a cup of tea" type comments, but there are a lot of people out there who are either lazy, ignorant, or preoccupied, and it would do the world of good to have them see such reminders. To people who say they're already conscious of all this, then such ads wouldn't be any more annoying than all the other ones you to sit through. 

For example, how many people across the country go to boil a kettle at half time for some important match? Well imagine if they all had just seen a reminder on the tele about how to only boil what you need?! The cumulative effect of that would be massive. There are many other similar energy saving examples as that. Such need only be 5 to 10 seconds long. And if not for the environment, then we should still do it in order to avoid black-outs. Unfortunately the only time you hear talk about the environment is in the news, and the news only talks about stuff like the consequences of the climate change and emission targets, and never actual everyday solutions. You never hear talk about the environment on the street. The only time it's mentioned in ads is when it's some company making bogus or misleading claim that it's helping the environment.

There should also be awareness ads on how to recycle properly and what not flush down the toilet, because most people don't even know.

Ubbquittious

These high electricity costs are a HUGE money spinner for the companies involved and the government. If we all skimped like feck on electricity and kept costs down it would harm the economy.

When have you last seen a public awareness campaign telling people to harm the economy? I have personally never seen one. It's always "spend more!"

Spend 35,000 or 100,000 on upgrading your house. That is the kind of thing they encourage, gotta keep the velocity of money up

freshpopcorn

Most people know how to recycle and how to save electricity but a lot don't care.

ELM327

The problem is that these ads are at the same time they are pushing smart meters which result in increased bills

boombang

Fully agree with the OP and also anticipate plenty of nonsense responses from people giving out Eamonn Ryan. Turning the thermostat down to 20/21 degrees should be another one. If you're not wearing a jumper inside in the winter you have the heating on too high.

Graces7

Ask long term ill/disabled and us pensioners about this. HUGE sigh of relief here at the new allowances. Keeping one room warm etc. Hot water bottles.. And yes, warm clothing.

Ubbquittious

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119770719#Comment_119770719

The allowances are given to you by the same corrupt shower that created the silly Thatcherite electricity market we have now. They are only pumping the money through you so they can give it to their high-flying investment buddies. Hugging you with one arm and punching you with the other.

Dyr

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119771025#Comment_119771025

Its funny that you have the tellycom airin logo as your avatar to remind us of what the pre "thatcherite" utility market was like in Ireland.

I'll take what we have over going back to that.

jackofalltrades

People don't have much faith in the current government.

And what little they had was thoroughly destroyed by:

• The scam that is Smart meters
• Planning restrictions around solar panels that were only lifted recently
• Dragging their feet on FIT(Feed in Tariffs) that make solar panels more financially viable
• Allowing so many Data centers that they're a threat to our grid and reaching are climate target

I feel any government campaign is going to fall on deaf ears because of the above.

I think though there is scope on for showing people which appliances use the most energy, as there does seem to be some misconceptions out there.

L1011

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119771312#Comment_119771312

Telecom Eireann were - by the 90s, after being allowed invest - one of the most technologically advanced telecoms operators in Europe and were fairly normally priced.

It was the privatisation that stopped that stone dead.

The P&T days were dire; but those were ancient history by the time it was privatised.

AndyBoBandy

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119770276#Comment_119770276

I'm particularly irked by those Electric Ireland Smart Meter ads...

"Take Control of your Electricity" - What a load of bullcrap..... people will use what they use, and thats all there is to it.... (they'll just pay more on a smart plan).

And if people don't understand that turning on their electric oven, or dishwasher or washing machine is going to result in a spike on their usage, then smart meters certainly aren't going to save them from higher bills!!

Graces7

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119771025#Comment_119771025

Oh DEAR! Is that really how you see it? Nah! lol

Ubbquittious

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119771403#Comment_119771403

Pretty much. I can see why they'd be tempted to throw free tax payer's money in the direction of renewable energy companies due to the dire state the national grid is in and first giving it to normal people in order to win votes. The likes of Airtricity are cleaning up out of this, I wonder how many millions the right honourable Sir Alastair Philips-Davies Esq. will get next year

Dyr

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119771391#Comment_119771391

LOL I can remember in the late 90s trying to get a phone line changed when I moved house, got absolutely nowhere with Tellycom Eireann, after a few weeks the most was a "we'll get back to sometime" runaround. My mother made a phone call to my uncle who was a big wig in there and suddenly the phone was installed and a line run up to the bedroom for my troubles.

That was how that place worked 😂

Graces7

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119771428#Comment_119771428

Well I do not give a..... whatever the most extreme expression is .... about any of your post or even understand it. What matters right now is that my small home and I are going to be more comfortable and snug this winter. Heartfelt thanks to whoever that is due to. The extra allowances will save lives and help keep old folk safe and well this winter. Last winter was .... best forgotten.

L1011

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119771588#Comment_119771588

If the allowances cover the price difference from last winter, you'll be lucky

Ubbquittious

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119771397#Comment_119771397

I am amazed that when you look at the EirGrid dashboard there seems to be no decrease at all in demand between september and october. Great business to be in, not too many industries can foist a 45% increase on their customers and sell exactly the same

dxhound2005

I'm surprised that anyone with an interest in this area has not come accross the Reduce your Use campaign which has been going since April. I heard one of the radio ads on Today FM this evening.

tjhook

I think the OP has a point. At least for people like me that hadn't put any thought in it before.

Recently I started measuring my power use, and discovered a few simple things around my TV. I have a number of devices, including:

- Virgin Cable box was configured to power down to a state that it was quick to start up again when powered on. I set it to shutdown more completely when powered off, and although it now has a slower (10-sec) startup, it consumes less power when not in use

- AV Receiver was set to pass the TV signal through to the TV, even when on standby. I noticed the receiver was warm to the touch even in standby. Again, a change to the configuration and now it powers down completely.

- I have a media player that was powered on 24/7, so I could transfer content to it over Wifi. Duh. It's powered down now other than when I need it on.

- Subwoofer permanently powered on even though used infrequently. Now powered off except when in use.

Just those simple measures, with no impact on my life, will save over €30 from my 2-monthly bill.

Ubbquittious

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119771968#Comment_119771968

Did not know it existed and I do listen to the radio from time to time

AllForIt

I would suggest going to the fridge and taking out a nice cool beer instead of going for the tea mid match. Emergency legislation needs to be introduced to lower the cost of beer including overturning the minimum alcohol unit pricing and scrap vat on it as well. This can go a long way in saving the planet.

Oh, and I suggest turning off the TV during ad breaks as well for further savings.

Strumms

As hundreds of thousands more people are added to this country, there is more electricity demand and indeed more pollution.

5 days ago more then 500 homes were left without power in Cork.

Primatestown Water Pump Station in Meath had a power failure 2 or so days ago. causing depleted water levels at Windmill Hill Reservoir. Impacted customers in Ratoath, Kilbride, Fairyhouse Road, Skyrne, Painstown, Macetown and surrounding areas were impacted by lower than normal water pressure and in some instances, particularly on higher ground, and some experienced intermittent water outages.

A week ago Castlecomer residents numbering up to 4000 had a power outage.

Laois borders saw 588 properties were without power.

power outages due to demand…

https://www.independent.ie/irish-news/concern-over-power-outages-grows-as-demand-for-electricity-continues-to-rise-42044102.html

the old saying… “ cut your cloth to meet your measure “… but nope…

im in a newish build, super insulation so in case of outages I’ll be grand… central heating is on for about 10% - 15% of the year so that tells you how well insulated… not everyone is as fortunate.

BrianD3

Electric Ireland only stopped charging people extra for not using enough electricity in May 2022 - the Low Usage Standing Charge which was in place for around a decade. I suspect that given what has happened with energy this year and the "climate emergency", EI would prefer to erase that from history. Or try to spin it that anyone paying the normal standing charge was getting a discount while the low usage was the standard.

Utilities want people using/wasting their product as long as they don 't use TOO much of it or use it at the "wrong" time. If Irish Water was charging for water, it would want people using a lot yet still imposing hosepipe bans when it suited.

L1011

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119772215#Comment_119772215

None of those power outages were due to demand, they were due to failures and/or weather. There have been no power outages due to demand - yet.

If those do happen, they'll affect a lot more than 500 premises at a time.

Strumms

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119772887#Comment_119772887

“It says the country will most likely need 37pc extra electricity by 2031, although it could be as high as 50pc more.”

“The look-ahead comes in EirGrid’s annual generation capacity statement (GCS) published today which warns of a “challenging outlook” over the next 10 years.”

the article also mentions capacity and scary quotes from ear grid.

outages not DUE to demand but no capacity to backup…

Graces7

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119771612#Comment_119771612

They more than cover it... I am well in credit and am carefull and very appreciate of the extra allowances.. Maybe look at the amounts? Excellent factual at the Benefits forum.

Also I am through choice and long experience multi fuel. Bottled gas cooker. . solid fuel stove with a back boiler, portable gas heater

I had one bad winter in the past when I was all electric and never again. and with the extra allowances whatever the weather an easier winter ahead.

Still stihl waters 3

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119771372#Comment_119771372

Why are smart meters a scam, I hear people say this all the time but what's behind it

Leg End Reject

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119773448#Comment_119773448

The smart meter tariff is higher than the older day/night rates and they're introducing much higher peak-time rates from 5-7 pm.

Ush1

Savings from turning on and off your telly are surely absolutely tiny compared to leaving them on standby?

Gooser14

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119773448#Comment_119773448

What I don't like about the smart meter is that once you choose a smart tarrif plan you can never revert to a 24 hr tariff. There is also a post on boards which states Electric Ireland advised that from 2024 smart tariffs only will be the only option if you have a smart meter.

L1011

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119773613#Comment_119773613

Depends on the TV. Most appliances made in the last decade or two only use a watt or less in standby but some use more, or go faulty. Most libraries have socket power meters you can borrow to check for this

These can find some serious parasitic draws. I had first gen remote control (dedicated remote, not WiFi) plug sockets in my living room about ten years ago that were taking about 20w each permanently for instance. Providing a bit of background heat I guess!

TheChizler

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119773620#Comment_119773620

I think that's a myth, my mother was on a smart plan a few years ago after the smart meter was installed. Wasn't making sense and she's back on 24h now.

L1011

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119773638#Comment_119773638

No provider will currently let you switch back. Nor are they likely to start doing so again

AndyBoBandy

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119773448#Comment_119773448

Depending on the smart tariff you choose, there might be a window from 2-4am (night boost I think it's called) where the rate per kWh is cheaper than current non smart 24hr rates, but every other hour of the day the smart rate will be more than the current 24hr or day/night rates. Add to that the smart tariff standing charges are also higher than non smart tariff standing charges..

So yes, if you can fit the vast majority of your usage into that 2-4am window, then you probably could end up better off on a smart tariff, but for the vast vast vast vast vast majority of folk, they simply won't be able to do that (unless they install 10-20kWh of batteries that they can charge up in that 2 hour window to then use over the other 22 hours of the day).

In an EV in 2 hours the most you can put in a car is 14kWh, so in or around 20%-25% for most EV's..

Some smart tariff's also offer free electricity on the weekend (there was a couple on the news recently championing this idea), but who in the fcuk wants to sit around the house all weekend washing clothes/dishes..... how sad would you have to be to live that life?

In general, you'll find that folks with Solar PV systems (and maybe also EV's) tend to be a bit more aware, savvy & knowledgable around electricity usage and rates etc..... and the vast vast majority of us care not for smart meters or smart tariff's...... so make of that what you will.

Padraig Mor

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119772141#Comment_119772141

You sure about that? Seems an awful lot for a few low power devices. Would have thought maybe €30 per year.

Still stihl waters 3

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119773868#Comment_119773868

So did this info only become available after the introduction of smart meters or did electric Ireland just not tell us

BrianD3

Re: items on standby, I got an energy monitor recently and most of my items use very little on standby. From < 1 watt to about 3 watts. The ones that surprised me were the broadband modem which uses 7 watts and the sky box which uses about 7 on standby and 8 when on. Apart from those two I'd need to be plugging in and out multiple items to save 20 watts i.e. to save, at most, half a unit per day. I don't think it's worth the hassle and those items on standby are slightly warming the house anyway.

The energy usage of anything using electricity for heating water/air dwarfs any savings from plugging out stuff. The item that annoys me the most is my old style tumble dryer given the amount of heat (money) that goes straight out the vent.

Ubbquittious

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119774632#Comment_119774632

It won't dwarf to the extent you might think because if something is running 24h a day it will add up a lot. Half a unit a day is still 60 quid a year that you could be spending on kebabs or pints or something much healthier

L1011

Anyone who uses the dryer a lot would be well advised to at least look at going for a heatpump dryer now. The cheapest in Powercity is now 400 (and is A++ when some dearer are 'only' A+) - they were nearly 4 figures not terribly long ago.

At current electricity prices they could pay for themselves in two/three years on the electricity savings alone - but they also dump the waste heat in to the room, not outside. You can also seal up the vent hole and improve the insulation of the room / stop draughts through the dryer as could happen before.

They are slower, so maybe not suitable for big families that need them running constantly. But they can do relatively large loads too. You can use a water drain or empty a water cassette every two/three loads.

Mine has an estimate of 176kWH/year for normal use on its energy sticker. A conventional dryer can be about 600! If you use it more than normal, that saving will be higher.

BrianD3

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119774654#Comment_119774654

I'm all for saving money - but plugging in and out many items every day for a year to save 60 quid, not worth it in my view.

Irish households apparently use on average around 4000 units per year and I would presume that heating, cooking, drying and items that can't really get plugged out (e.g. fridges) make up the vast majority of this.

Ubbquittious

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119774675#Comment_119774675

They expect a minimum room temperature though to make the heat-pumping easier for themselves. So no good if your dryer is in de shed

AndyBoBandy

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119774746#Comment_119774746

I know it would semi defeat the purpose (as they also use electricity (but just a lot less)), but loads of those wi-fi smart plugs could help automate this process somewhat... If you know that midweek certain appliances are never used after a certain time at night and not before a certain time the following day, they could be timed to knock off during those hours....

L1011

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119774796#Comment_119774796

True. If you do hammer the use of one it could still be worth trying to find somewhere in the house for a heatpump one now; but clearly not as convenient as just replacing one where it is.

AndrewJRenko

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119771968#Comment_119771968

Available online too

https://www.gov.ie/en/campaigns/6ca43-reduce-your-use/

dxhound2005

I heard the radio ad again on Morning Ireland at around 7.30. It covers a lot of what the OP was looking for, but apparently was not aware of.

AvalonEnaid

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119770522#Comment_119770522

Turning your thermostat down to 20 or 19 is a small part of the overall equation to energy efficiency. You will want to focus on your flow temperature to see good savings.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119773613#Comment_119773613

It depends on the age of the device but in general you are right. My TV uses 0.5W on standby; it will take 83 days before it uses 1 kWh, at €0.4341 cents per kWh comes out to €1.91 for a year on standby. This is assuming it's on standby 24/7, so even less because it will definitely be in use.

The same can be said for lights to some degree, assuming your household are using LED lights; 1 bulb will use €19.03 per year if left on 24/7. Multiply that by the number of bulbs you have in your house and it can start to add up.

My fridge uses 169 kWh/year, at the current elec price, it adds up to €73.37 per year.

Pretty much any device that uses some form of fuel to generate heat is always going to be a households largest expense. To rub salt into the wound, it's exceptionally difficult and a hell of a lot of hassle to limit our use of these devices.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119772141#Comment_119772141

I'm super curious to know what your devices were doing to use €30 every two months because something doesn't add up.

My media player uses €13.32 per year.

Brid Hegarty

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119771397#Comment_119771397

I've heard differently and always found it strange. A quick google search led me to this article, which may have industry backing, but I read it anyway

https://www.realhomes.com/advice/dishwasher-vs-hand-washing

It says that dishwashers use less energy to heat the water than hand washing. It also says that less water is used than when hand washing! Apparently modern dishwashers are more efficient because they don't use your home’s hot water. This doesn't seem to make a whole load of sense if there's plenty of spare hot water in the immersion.

Yet interestingly, all comparisons are made on the assumption that your tap in running during hand washing. But if a "running tap flows at around 2 gallons (9 litres) per minute" then I'd say I'd use 3-4 litres of water to do the wash-up, so that's about 23 seconds to fill the basin. I then leave just a little dribble of cold water for the rinse... which doesn't add up to very much. So if you compare that to a 'modern' dishwasher, which (in one part of the article) they say is 10 litres, well then you don't actually use more! And old dishwashers prior to 2,000 can apparently use up to 25 litres. Funnily, further on in the article it says that if your dishwasher is a highly efficient Energy Star-certified dishwasher, then it uses less than "4.25 (~19 litres!) gallons of water per cycle". So that's kind of a contradiction between '19 litres' and the first mention of 10 litres!

It's impossible to figure out for sure.

L1011

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119775965#Comment_119775965

Taking hot water in means it needs to be cooled down to the correct temperature, which means using more water to do so, more space inside to mix the water or damage to glassware from thermal shock if you do the mixing in the main tub.

Also, a dishwasher washes a lot more than one sink of water does. Try four or five sinks (or ten washing up basins).

Brid Hegarty

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119772386#Comment_119772386

Forgive me, but I'm not sure I follow... "the normal standing charge was getting a discount while the low usage was the standard". I presume if EI said that, then it would be a contradiction we're not supposed to spot.

If EI were to try and spin it that way, what would be the difference between the "normal standing charge" and the low use standing charge?

I must also ask if you happen to recall the justification for bringing in standing charges? And now that they've been taken away by EI, have other companies like Bord Gais had to drop them too?

Brid Hegarty

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119775997#Comment_119775997

So if the immersion is on, the dishwasher takes water from both the cold and hot tap, and mixes them to the right temp, before pumping it into the dishwasher itself? If that is the case, then there'd be no cooling involved. Or does it choose either hot or cold, and then heat/cool dependingly?

Do you agree with the above article that dishwashers are more energy efficient? And do you agree with the waters quantities mentioned?

L1011

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119776281#Comment_119776281

No dishwasher sold in the past thirty years, if ever, has done that. They only take cold. I explained why.

Devices that do have a hot feed (older washing machines, for instance) are unable to perfectly draw in exact amounts of hot water to mix down to the correct temperature; so they need space internally to do so and end up using excess water.

They are more energy efficient - they heat precisely the water they need to precisely the temperature they need. Your immersion is the opposite of that.

I cannot agree with specific figures in articles as I don't have the kit or time to check them. However, your idea that you can do the same amount of dishes as a dishwasher load in 3-4 litres is hugely off, probably by 10x.