Former bus driver here, cyclists at traffic lights.

AndrewJRenko

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119743032#Comment_119743032

Yes, it's definitely the cyclists we should be teaching about how to use the roads safely.

https://twitter.com/crowleystephen/status/1580536922023546880?s=20&t=hngw_Y0fPo6yq0syGgDo9g

spurious

If EVERYONE sticks to the rules it is safer. Cars, bikes, scooters, lighting up, stay in your lane, obey red lights, indicate/hand signal, obey yellow boxes, a bit of courtesy on occasion if needed. There really are not a lot of rules to follow.

It is quite simple.

Core6

I am a cyclist commuter myself and obey traffic lights. I live near a cross roads junction which has traffic lights with pedestrian lights. When walking across the junction when the pedestrian crossing light is green, you have to keep a really careful eye out for cyclists (electric scooters, delivery ebikes, etc.) going straight through the junction at speed.

I know of at least one incident where a cyclist went through the lights, knocked down a young girl and then just continued on!

Flinty997

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119743272#Comment_119743272

That wasn't because he ignored the lights. That was because he wasn't paying attention to what was ahead.

Grolschevik

I grew up in the North when every primary school ran cycling proficiency courses (with a test and shiny badge that was coveted) that taught basic cycling road skills and the rules of the road etc.

Always thought it was a great way not only to make kids, and later, adults, safer and better road users, whatever the mode of transport.

Mundo7976

What perplexes me are the lights where the pedestrian & cycle lights are activated at the same time. While care should be taken by all, a cyclist barrelling through when a pedestrian steps out isn't going to end well. & that's after contending with the amount of motorists that gun the red lights first.

Flinty997

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119743330#Comment_119743330

This is why there are fixed penalty fines for dangerous cycling.

Flinty997

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119743302#Comment_119743302

There is a primary school program for cyclists. I forget the name.

magicbastarder

i hope they teach you how to wheelie as part of that.

Flinty997

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119742695#Comment_119742695

Depending on the junction it might be safer to go early depending on the lights. Not always. Some simply don't stop regardless.

The OP posting history seems perfectly credible. Too often people post at length about cycling when they haven't tried it in years, (probably since childhood) and assume it's the same as driving. It isn't. Lots of learn from a new cyclists perspective on their experiences.

My memory was being amazed how it shortened so many journeys. It rained a lot less than I thought. Always seem to be against the wind.

AndrewJRenko

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119743302#Comment_119743302

Something like this, perhaps?

https://www.cycleright.ie/

Maybe we need something to teach drivers to obey speed limits and put their phones away?

Grolschevik

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119743472#Comment_119743472

Is it free? Is it heavily promoted in schools? Does it happen during the school day? Do children aspire to do it? Do the vast majority of every cohort do it? Is it seen as the done thing?

My point was that it could make us better all round road users, drivers included.

AndrewJRenko

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119743576#Comment_119743576

There’s certainly a few yes answers to your questions, but if you want more answers, feel free to contact those involved in the scheme.

My point would be that we’ve spent years faffing around with education and urging drivers to stop killing people. It doesn’t work.

We need to start serious enforcement of traffic laws.

Grolschevik

I don't disagree. And the impact of the early road training in that scheme should make itself felt in a few years, if it is going to at all.

Flinty997

In fairness drivers have all this training, and tests.

The issue is a lack of enforcement.

downtheroad

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119741451#Comment_119741451

You are some nitpicker.

If advanced boxes are frequently ignored by motorists I'd expect advance lights to be treated the same. Green light for a bike, sure I'll just drive my car/van through

Macy0161

I went to school in Britain and did the ROSPA Cycling Proficiency Test in primary school, and I'd have no problem saying something along those lines should be part of national school, and/ or perhaps TY classes.

However, in the context of a road safety discussion, it's way down the list of actions the State could and should take.

How Soon Is Now

I cycle from Citywest into the city centre and back three or four days a week for work then usually go for a random ride around on a Saturday or Sunday and its fairly obvious especially during peak times that most drivers don't have any respect for cyclists.

There's obviously some kind of magnetic force that brings so many cars into the cycle lanes especially at the most awkward sections of the road where its much harder for someone on a normal bike to keep pace with lights / busy traffic! Cars just love the cycle lanes in general to be honest the amount of them that cant help parking in them on busy streets is crazy.

I find most of the cyclists constantly breaking red lights are the ones dressed from head to toe in black on electric bikes and of course the lovely scooters. The one and only time I will break a red light is when the road is pretty much empty and there is absolutely no traffic around me. I've gotten so used to cars breaking lights at crossings and nearly hitting me that I just get off the bike half of the time and cross with the pedestrians.

There are arseholes in every form of transport on the road but the average cyclist who try's to stick by the rules and keeps in his lane or to side of the road out of the way is put at unnecessary risk on nearly every journey.

John_Rambo

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119743576#Comment_119743576

But why insist on training for the proven safest & most responsible of all road users? Would you not be more concerned with the ones that are causing injuries and deaths every week on the roads?

Tenzor07

Cycling in and around Dublin city centres congested streets will lead to some sort of conflict with a Bus driver, there's probably not one single person who's used a bicycle in the city who hasn't had issues with Bus drivers....

This is a interesting statement from a senior DB exec: "Ray Coyne, former CEO of Dublin Bus said in a 2020 tweet, in response to a suggestion that drivers go out on bikes to experience a bus rushing past them in real life, that the activity wouldn’t pass a safety audit."

Sad facts are that I wouldn't recommend any close relative of mine to cycle in Dublin city, or use an eScooter, and if so they should ensure they have amazing health insurance and their Wills made...

Flinty997

eScooters aren't legal anyway.

Cycling the dangers are over stated. Over stating the dangers actually contributes to making it more dangerous.

breezy1985

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119744633#Comment_119744633

Funny in London I had the exact opposite experience with bus drivers. I found them to be by far the safest road users in relation to bicycles.

Firstly it's about attitude and culture.

And secondly that will only change through enforcement.

BabysCoffee

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/2058267354/former-bus-driver-here-cyclists-at-traffic-lights

Seems like a good idea and I've seen it at some junctions in Dublin.

Additional to this, waht about legalising "roll and go" for cyclist where they can slow down at red lights and then continue to go through if safe to do so, particularly if taking a left turn?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Idaho_stop

Flinty997

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119744864#Comment_119744864

You've also got turn on red in places like Paris.

But I don't think Irish Road users ready for such enlightenment.

Idleater

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119744008#Comment_119744008

Strangely, I don't encounter many (maybe one since spring) where the vehicle at the top of the queue went on bicycle green instead of main green.

On the other hand it's rare that vehicles _don't_ go through the red turn filter when green only for straight at the lights at St John's road.

bikeman1

In fairness, I find the bus drivers some of the best on the road. Buses give far more space than the typical car / SUV despite being a multiple of their size.

I don’t see an issue with it OP- I think the big challenge around Dublin at least is narrow roads that weren’t built for 21st century traffic- I mean like, if you were going to design a town today to cater for busses cars lorries artic trucks pedestrians and cyclists, you wouldn’t put forward a design like Dublin is right now 😂

Theres lots of examples of where this idea is needed- especially anywhere a large (wide) road is approaching a more narrow road- Kevin st junction for example or Stephen’s Green heading towards Wexford st etc- you’ve large volumes of traffic all adapting to an ever narrowing space as they move forward.

Education a bit of empathy and good road manners would also help though- I’ve seen many a cyclist through the years bang on the side of a bus as they were being cut off the road- mainly always the bus drivers fault but there’s also some cyclists that do crazy things too and don’t have an appreciation that when moving at lightening speed and weaving in and out of traffic, motorists don’t always have the opportunity to see you and react and respond appropriately

MakersMark

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119741500#Comment_119741500

Until an amber gambler flattens you from the right

Tenzor07

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119744799#Comment_119744799

There's plenty of low and high powered eScooters and eBikes around the city centre every day, legal or not I've never seen any stopped by Gards...

Only saying it's dangerous cos it is, mixing a pedal cyclist with a 12++ ton bus at 50 or 60kph on the same small roads isn't safe...

Thelonious Monk

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119752497#Comment_119752497

if it was that dangerous there'd be people dying in Dublin and elsewhere every day on bikes though