Should I give up? Advice needed

Bookreader35

Evening everyone,

I've been dating a really nice guy for 6 months + and we had been getting along really well for all of that time. There were no so called red flags that I noticed in the relationship until very recently. All aspects of the relationship had been going really well and I really loved spending time with him. Problems have started to emerge in the last two weeks when I asked him to progress our relationship to meeting my family and attending some family events and also if we could discuss moving in together in the next few months.

The first time I engaged with him about these issues, he refused to meet my family saying that he has made mistakes in his professional working life that have completely broken him emotionally. He wouldn't divulge any more information about the issue other than it is very embarrassing and that he made mistakes but confirmed none of a criminal nature. I wouldn't have stayed in the relationship if things weren't going so well so I'm convinced he has definately feelings for me. I feel like he is punishing himself for whatever mistakes he has made in his professional work life and is condemning himself to a life of being by himself. It appears that he doesn't feel like he deserves to be loved because of the said actions or past performance of whatever happened work wise that has remained buried inside him unresolved to this point.

He is not close to his family; they never travel to see him and he always has to travel to them and help them out a lot. I've met two of his friends at his place and they both seemed decent. Interests are normal, sports related and a very affectionate individual. He said that I was the only person in a very long time that he has confided in about things going on in his life or at least I was until I started discussions about our future. I gave him ultimatums about meeting family, moving in together at some point in the future and since then he has cut me off completely by messages, phone calls etc. I encouraged him to separate out his professional life from his personal life and seek out support with a professional to resolve the outstanding issue that he has even if our relationship didn’t progress that I only wanted the best for him and his future. I have developed very strong feelings for him and wish him well either way going forward so feel very sad over how we have ended things.

 

Anyway it’s been a week today since we last saw each other in person. There has been no contact since from either of us to each other. I just don’t know what to do now! I haven't spoken to nobody about the situation. If I decide to try again with him, how should I speak to him? Any advice much appreciated

At any rate it is at least a yellow / amber flag that he won't meet your family, moreso at your request. A warning light should flash on in your head OP.

Big Bag of Chips

I think you take this as a sign and walk away. What on earth has past bad work decisions got to do with meeting your family? Unless of course he has actually caused your family financial loss through business dealings?

I do think though that 6 months in, not having met each other's families is probably a little too soon to be discussing moving in together.

I'd also be wary of him "confiding" in you but not actually telling you anything. He should either tell you what his work issues are. Or he shouldn't have mentioned them at all. This seems like game playing on his part. And the fact the he has disappeared off the radar should be enough for you to decide that you're not interested in playing whatever game he's playing.

He might be telling the truth, but unless he actually tells you then you can't do anything for him either way. I'd delete his number and move on.

is_that_so

Judging from the OP, the guy needs to get professional help as it sounds like a huge level of personal baggage to deal with. Someone in that situation can't healthily be involved in other relationships until they get to the root of their issues. I might just check in out of friendly concern and offer support but very much conditional on his seeking help to resolve those underlying issues. I might also choose to wait to see if there is any movement from the other side. Ultimately, there is probably too much to entangle to maintain any level of a relationship.

YellowLead

OP I think 6 months is WAAAAAY too soon to discuss moving in together! Each to their own, but I imagine most people would run at that.

Meeting your family shouldn’t be a big deal however - and I don’t understand how that relates to professional mistakes he has made, did he give any detail?

Either way, if he has cut you off completely etc I think you don’t have a choice in the matter and it’s time to accept it and move on. I know it’s tough, as you really liked him. Better 6 months than 2 years though.

bucketybuck

Forget red flag, the work thing is a false flag.

Sounds like the real issue here is that after only 6 months you are pushing him into commitments he doesn't yet want to make. Move in together after only 6 months? I know what my answer would be if I got that ultimatum.

Yes there comes a point you need to commit, but 6 months is no time at all to a lot of people. At the very least its still early enough for these things to only be a discussion, not an ultimatum.

Maybe a little more time and he would have been more open to more commitment, but you forced the question and got your answer as far as I can see.

Bob Harris

Unless you are both in your 80's and haven't much time left then moving in after 6 months is a bit soon.

However, his reasons not to want to discuss moving in or meeting your family are...well..odd.

Sounds like he has commitment issues and an ultimatum was never going to get him to come around to your way of thinking and indeed feeling.

Are you sure this man is not married or has another partner?

Dial Hard

You have two very different issues here and you're conflating them.

First of all, his reasons for not wanting to meet your family are spurious, to put it mildly.

However, you issued him a *massive* - and hugely premature - ultimatum about moving in. Everyone knows what rule #1 about issuing ultimatums is, and you're on the receiving end of that now in that he's called your bluff. I think it's time to cut your losses and move on. And learn your lesson about trying to force people's hand in future.

Tork

I get the feeling that you might not know this guy as well as you thought you did, and that there are some details missing. It goes without saying that his reasons for not meeting your family are batsh*t crazy and make no logical sense. Also, isn't it very convenient that nobody from his family ever seems to travel to visit him? I assume he never talked about you meeting his family at any point? Meeting friends is a different story. Also, are you certain he is single? He seems to be living quite a compartmentalised life. You could read his unwillingness to meet your family/progress the relationship as a lack of commitment. Or they could be the actions of a guy who has been messing around and is running out of wriggle room.

JoChervil

OP, it seems you want completely different things from life. So I am afraid it is over. You can do nothing to have him back. Especially on your conditions. But his are not for you, so what's the point even considering trying it again?

But out of curiosity I wonder, what made you think you would succeed with your ultimatums. How old are you? How much time did you spend together on regular basis. Where?

Your post sounds very sterile, with no emotions. And knowing nothing about his "issue", you rushed to excuse him. Codependent people tend to do it. So it made me wonder, if he is not dependant on something. Such people usually attract codependent people.

His family is not visiting him. It might be true or it might be his version to keep you away from them. Maybe to prevent you from learning something? He is hiding someone or something in my opinion.

It seems you know very little about him, yet you were willing to commit. And you wanted to force him to do it. It seems you want very much to be in a committed relationship but with whom it doesn't matter much. It is not the best reason to do it.

I would move on.

Bookreader35

Thanks everyone so much for your insight!!! I just want to clarify that the ultimatum was totally unacceptable on my part but it was only related to him making an effort to meet my family and friends. I also just wanted to know how he felt things were progressing between us and did he feel that it was moving into something long-term and if so could we talk more about the future. I live out on my own so our time was being shared equally in both homes. I wasn't asking him for us to move in together now but maybe 12-18 months down the line.

He had been asked on two occasions if he would like to visit my parent for a nice introduction but he refused. I am a warm, independent and considerate person, not controlling or dominant in any way.

Jequ0n

This sounds exhausting to say the least, because you were obviously both not fully trusting each other, and you both knew it too.

JoChervil

OP, I think you were unhappy with things as they were between you.

You wanted to force him to get closer to you because you very likely didn't feel he was close enough after 6 months. Why do you prefer to trust someone's words instead of your feelings? Actions speak louder than words and you felt it was odd, that he didn't want to meet your family and friends.

My question was more about, if it was a public display of your relationship or did you spend most of your time at homes. I wanted to exclude the situation, that you were only his "guilty pleasure".

I am afraid that you developed strong feelings for your illusion about him, not for real him. The more secretive the person is, the more good qualities we can imagine about them, but it might be only our wishful thinking.

People usually give ultimatums, when they are unhappy and tired and want to end things one way or the other. Usually subconsciously, we want just to get out of the situation and ultimatum gives us a good excuse, that we "tried". Maybe it was in your case?

Anyway I don't see any hope for this relation.

Skibunny77

Op - after six months it is perfectly legitimate to ask someone if they view living together as a shared goal in the next 12-18 months.

I think this guy gave you the best that he could and for most people, that would not be anywhere near enough. He has given you some of the emotional barriers which prevent him carrying out normal & usual events in an adult relationship - meeting family, honest discussions about the future but he has not given you a shred of evidence that he is interested in addressing these barriers.

It is unsurprising that when you expressed your views & hopes for the relationship, he has completely withdrawn. This isn't anything you did, this is about what he simply cannot do at this point in time. This is work for him to do, likely over prolonged period of time.

Stick to your views & hopes & goals for a relationship. They are very fair and reasonable.

Best of luck.

OP, I think you need take a step back. Giving anyone an ultimatum comes across as bullying. You’re asking for too much at once. Back off. Concentrate on one thing at a time. Say, meeting families. Then, if that’s successful, consider the living together.

bitofabind

You showed your cards and he's retreated. Which I think tells you everything you need to know about him - he's not up for commitment, he doesn't want to move things forward and meet your family and make future plans. He's now gone silent. So I think the writing's on the wall here - you're not compatible.

Better to know that now than 2-3 years in, and I wouldn't fault you at all - you need clarity on whether this is the right person for you, or if he's going to back off when you start the future conversations. You now have it, as painful as it may be.

Salient Verb

After 6 months, its normal to wonder where the relationship is going and lay your cards on the table. Most women know that in a few years time, they will be getting accused of getting on a bit and if you want a fully formed relationship rather than something casual, then it does need to progress towards things like meeting each others' families and thoughts about moving in together at some point. I think his refusal to meet your family, etc has pushed you towards the ultimatums as some way of breaking through his intransigence.

I think you have to ditch this guy. The big mystery about his professional life that he won't talk about is a bit of a red flag but the ignoring you for the past week and refusal to meet your family are even worse red flags. This is just a normal social life. Is he even single? You've met 2 of his friends but they could be in on any secret too. I don't find the "doesn't deserve to be loved" spiel that convincing - it the sort of thing guilty people come out with to make themselves seem like a victim.

"He is not close to his family; they never travel to see him and he always has to travel to them and help them out a lot." I wouldn't really be surprised if this "family" he doesn't want you to meet that he travels to and helps out a lot isn't actually a wife. He wouldn't be the first...

spontindeed

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/2058253056/should-i-give-up-advice-needed

He may leave you if you try to pressure him into meeting your family or moving in together. Men don't like being pressured. Parental approval can be a scary thought for most men in the early stages of a relationship because men secretly worry what the woman's parents might say about him behind his back. Men worry they will be called creeps or weirdos in view of the increasingly anti-male bias in society which has reached alarming proportions (the latest phenomenon of 'consent' which has been opaquely weaponized into a wider anti-male narrative in society). It's getting much harder to find a decent guy because men are avoiding relationships with these new consent laws.

He may fear moving in together because men are fiercely independent and men worry that they will become trapped in a relationship. Basically, it's still too early for him to move in with you. I know this because I would feel that way if a woman asked me to move in after 6 months. Guys need to be sure that they're ready for this.

You didn't mention the age category you are both in so your situation is hard to call but stay in contact with him - even if you think it's over. You never know he may be still taking his time. You certainly come across as a nurturing person who really cares about her man and that's something a man always appreciates - he just mightn't say it. But he strongly appreciates it deep down.

TheadoreT

You've brought that weird agenda to 2 threads Spontindeed. I don't know a single man who's avoiding women due to consent issues, you seem to have a very grim view of women.

And there isn't an "anti men bias" in society, just more accountability for genuinely problematic behaviours were there wasn't much before. If you're in any way normal you've nothing to worry about.

Anyway it may be worth counselling as you're hitting incel levels with the way you're posting.

spontindeed

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119402695#Comment_119402695

New laws on Consent will only make it harder to find a guy. There is already a man shortage and women should be concerned about this. Anyone who doesn't know what I'm talking about should read the book "Men on Strike".

Instead of patronizing others, would you like to make an effort to help the OP?

TheadoreT

I'm helping her by telling her to disregard your nonsense. And I wouldn't even Google that book in fear of my algorithm thinking I'm into that rubbish.

And if you're interpreting changes in laws as being bad for men instead good for women (when there's currently a tragically low conviction rate for rape or sexual abuse) I really do repeat your need for help.

spontindeed

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119403428#Comment_119403428

You are completely incorrect. Over 92% of all rape trials result in a conviction. Hardly a 'tragically low' rate by international standards. But don't let that get in the way of your own insults. This is no place for political battles or personal insults.

The OP is in a dilemma and she needs general advice. She has been with someone for 6 months and she clearly does value him so I think we should be helping her and remain cool headed.

--------------------------------------------------

@spontindeed I don't know where you're getting your figures from but they are wrong. Please do not post uninformed opinion such as the above in the Personal Issues forum again. This is a heavily moderated forum due to the sensitive nature of the posts here.

**Do not post in this thread again**

Big Bag of Chips

@spontindeed you have posted broad generalisations in a number of threads recently. This is against The Forum Charter and adds nothing by way of advice to the poster who looks for it.

Also Personal Issues is not a discussion forum. It is an advice forum so general chat is also irrelevant.

Please do not post in this thread again, and please familiarise yourself with the rules of the forum before posting here again.

Moving in together is not something everyone wants out of a relationship, and I have a relative who is very much in love with their partner & vice versa, but both enjoying having their own residences for the main part.

However, hiding from a partner’s relatives because of personal embarrassment is an issue at this stage. Have you gone about finding out what the work-related baggage may have been, given that he hasn’t been forthcoming. Non-illegal issues tend to stem from losing major amounts of money, in particularly other oriole’s money, gambling issues, having had a no-no affair that caused ripples, or past alcohol defence. Or it could have been immature behaviour or “revenge” tactics on a past work colleague. Also I’d be sniffing out to ensure he doesn’t have a wife somewhere.

I do hope things work out for your future happiness.

Dial Hard

Wrong thread.

But seeing as I'm here, given the OP hasn't been back in almost a month and the thread had been dormant for weeks til it was resurrected for reasons beyond me, I'm not really sure what leaving it open is going to achieve.

Bookreader35

I just wanted to give posters an update on how everything has progressed since my original posts. The comments posted by everyone prompted me to evaluate and question everything about the relationship and what learning I could take from it going forward again whenever I moved on about my own behaviour and how I can improve my communication.

As difficult as it was at the time I gave up, I didn’t contact him and after a short time I deleted his number from my phone.

 

After a few weeks, he messaged me to apologise for his behaviour of blanking me saying that I didn’t deserve to be treated that way and would I interested in meeting up for a chat to discuss his work issue problem that he described as being very embarrassing. I agreed to meet with him and I didn’t know what he was going to say. I speculated that it could be workplace bullying, fraud, gambling problem etc but it has transpired that he lost his job and has been suffering with low self-esteem and has gotten stuck in a rut akin to a kind of depression that he is staying in bed and not pursuing new job opportunities.

I avoided coming across as being condescending with him saying that he needed to do this, needed to do that, snap out of your current predicament as I know that would be wholly disrespectful and judgemental so all I did was listen and reassured him that I enjoyed meeting up with him again. I didn’t want to probe into the reasons for the job loss or ask too many questions.

 

I just feel at a loss about how to support him now and handle the situation better this time round. What do I say to him? How can I support?

Thank you to everyone who has given up their time to post messages that I know only serve to try and help the situation.

YellowLead

I don’t see how the explanation for the work thing changes anything - you still want to move in together and that seemed to be a dealbreaker for you because you issued an ultimatum.

unless you’ve done some thinking and realised that was unreasonable and too much pressure too soon?

But, on the supporting side - listening is a good step, maybe encouraging him to see a therapist if he’s stuck.

Bookreader35

Yes I agree that I was unreasonable Yellowlead at the time to have given an ultimatum on meeting family/ moving in together. I wanted him to attend family events but only wanted to talk about the future about moving in together in 12/18 months.

I will make a concerted effort to listen more going forward. I'm not sure how to broach the idea of a therapist.

YellowLead

I don’t think it’s too difficult a subject to broach if somebody has actually admitted that they feel depressed - it’s not an unreasonable suggestion to make. And it wouldn’t be telling him to do it, just asking if he’d thought about speaking to somebody, or what his next step is. There’s a way to do it as to not he condescending/interfering.

Big Bag of Chips

Whether or not you are a support to him depends totally on whether or not you are a couple. Has that been discussed? Are you (getting) back together? You said you met to discuss his workplace problem, but did you discuss you, as a couple? I think you need to talk to him - about more than just him. I don't want to be dismissive of the man's issues but, you were together a relatively short time. Taking on him and his mental health is not really your responsibility at this point. Especially if he finds it so easy to walk away and ignore you.

You need to take a step back and think about what kind of life you want. Because the life you've had up to this point is representative of the type of life you are likely to have with him. HIs depression isn't going to magically disappear now that he's told you about it. It will always be there. And if he won't deal with it, or you feel uncomfortable discussing it with him, then what does that mean for your future?

Pissy Missy

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119290993#Comment_119290993

That's what I was thinking

cuttingtimber22

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119416670#Comment_119416670

From his perspective, he just lost his job and he was being asked to attend a family event (where work and career would no doubt come up) and to make a long term commitment (financial and emotional).

I would say important to find out why his job did not work out (May be multiple reasons including bullying or an error and not necessarily something suspicious).

You like him and he likes you. Probably worth seeing can you work this through. Every relationship has ups and downs and perhaps he is just front loading some of these.

good luck.

Jequ0n

Sorry OP, but if someone can’t tell you that they lost their job, and has to come up with weird excuses as a consequence, you have a problem on your hands.

Give it another shot by all means, but I doubt this will be the last pitiful story you will hear. I think you know yourself that something isn’t right here but I wish you the best of luck.

Bookreader35

@Yellowlead. Thanks so much for your response. I am going to ask him what his next steps are and ask him what would help him in this situation to move forward ie. Talking to a therapist for talking therapies CBT.

@Big bag of chips. Thank you so much for your reply. You’ve given me serious food for thought and insight that I am very grateful for especially the part about the kind of life/future that I’m envisioning for myself and I really appreciate your input saying that. No we didn’t speak about getting back together or the relationship when we met up. We kept conversation about everything in general. In terms of his depression, I didn’t really see it during our time together. He never complained much and wasn’t in bad form that often that I can recall. Never lazy or appeared to be unmotivated. We were always busy doing things together at the weekends and he seemed keen to be physically active with sports like hiking, swimming, running and also he plays football as well. However, I am not denying that he is clearly in a depressive state with his work situation when I’m not there that he is staying in bed, not applying for jobs but again I need to get more information on what happened. I’m going to think on a lot of the points that you’ve mentioned.

 

@Pissy Missy: Thanks as well. No, he is not married and no partner.

Count Dracula

I find it remarkable that you were not aware that he was struggling with his career? Given that you had established relationship deadlines concerning when you were moving in together ( 6 whole months ? Easy there Tiger ) and when he was going to meet your folks etc. Did you not show any interest in his working life and what it encompassed? It is crazy to think that you had notions of moving in with someone who you barely even knew.

The next time you meet someone you like I suggest you let any relationship that develops do just that, develop. Putting time parameters and enforcing expectations on a relationship, before it is even allowed to blossom, is very unromantic altogether. Unromantic relationships are a waste of time, pointless. Try not to spoil your love life by demanding too much out of it, particularly irrelevant details such as meeting your parents after a handful of months, who in their right minds would be interested in going through that torture? Meeting your partners parents is a head melt, particularly if you have never met them before.

You seem like a really nice person, don't forget that. But I would try to avoid getting too bogged down with this loser. You are already saying that he has mental issues, you are his girlfriend, not his therapist? You only "know" this guy 6 months, that is not long enough to have any notion of what he is really like. Do you really want to set the dynamic in your relationship that you are somehow his saviour and that you managed, single handedly, to drag him out of whatever crisis he is struggling with? Don't bother, the first year of any relationship is supposed to be the honeymoon period, not a prequel to its' seven year itch. Dump him now while you still can, he sounds potentially as crippling as were your initial notions about the direction and tempo of your relationship, it does not bode well for a happy future, move on.

the_syco

Would show his picture to friends & family if you've not done so already. I'm guessing he has either screwed over a mutual friend and/or one of your family, or had sexual relations with one of them.

It is also possible that someone in your family/friend circle has sacked him, and he doesn't want the reason known (red flag, tbh).

TheadoreT

Im not sure what you're getting out of this OP, even taking him at his word for why he silenced you for weeks It's not the greatest pointer to his character is it.

This is a man you may have kids with in the future. Would you like that person to absolutely crumble every time when faced with the inevitable adversities life throws at us? To hide truths from you? To ignore you for weeks? To hold all his self worth in work success?

Even in the best case scenario he'll need a lot of help to work through his issues(which may or may not work). You'll have to compromise on all your own wants like moving in or relationship progression ect.

Your focus seems to be solely on him, but you can't have felt good in these passed weeks. Its still essentially early days in the relationship, are you prepared for potentially years of that personal mental strain for a guy that's not nearly as considerate about you?

Pissy Missy

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119417485#Comment_119417485

https://www2.hse.ie/services/mental-health-supports-and-services/

This is a link to free mental health services that you could share with him if you feel it may help.

I'm sorry you've been experiencing this OP, it sounds like you care for him a lot and are really supportive.

Hopefully he gets the help that he needs but definitely prioritise you. He's obviously going through a rough time but cutting contact with you like that, it just makes me think he could do it again to you which isn't fair on you. Wishing you the best of luck with this situation, and remember he's lucky to have someone as caring as you so don't undervalue yourself. You deserve the best.

laoisgem

This is bringing back memories to me of my ex husband. He could get the best of jobs but only last a few months before he inevitably started failing to show up for work and getting fired. The first I heard of it was after we split up and were living separately but still in constant contact. I received a phone call from his employer as he had failed to show up to work and wouldn't answer the phone, because I was next of kin they contacted me and then the Gardaí to do a welfare check on him. It happened pretty constant after that and he would disappear off the radar even from me, and we share a child together, only to turn up again a few months later.

I wish I was given the warning signs as early as you have been OP. Take care of yourself first and foremost, you can't fix everyone.