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RTE news : Ex-TD expresses concern over handgun licences

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  • Registered Users Posts: 15,022 ✭✭✭✭Grizzly 45


    Was watching Ian Mc Collum[Gun Jesus] of Forgotten weapons fame, having a chat with two Slovenian lads who founded Polynar Tactical on YT, about firearms laws in the EU and Slovenia. they made some very interesting points about licensing[who would want to screw it up personally,once you have gone thru all the hoops and loops?], and govts introducing gun laws, and who objected the most to gun law changes and silencer ownership in Slovenia [Old school senior police officers], and on how EU legislation will affect firearms ownership... Y'know...we all sorta have the same problems EU wide. Some of us just handle it better.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S21LZiESWCU&t=3s

    "If you want to keep someone away from your house, Just fire the shotgun through the door."

    Vice President [and former lawyer] Joe Biden Field& Stream Magazine interview Feb 2013 "



  • Registered Users Posts: 15,022 ✭✭✭✭Grizzly 45


    I don't think any new legislation is being considered with criminality in mind, criminals will do what criminals will do. It's ordinary everyday people, legal firearms owners snapping one day out of the blue and going on a rampage that concerns the state. 


    It NEVER is concerned about criminality or mass shooting for that matter. If it is about such. Then it is an OUTRAGE that we, as law-abiding citizens should be held to ransom and made accountable for the actions of criminals and law breakers or the insane, in deciding what we may own or use.

    Even that creep Aherne said so himself while he was blathering on about "American gun culture in Ireland" It's about control of the population. From the UN arms control,[International Small Arms Control Standard 03.30 document National Regulation of civilian access to small arms and light weapons] which has influenced the EU directives,[As few weapons as possible in EU citizens hands] to the Irish govt even saying in the oughties in a written statement from DOJ that the fundamental reason of gun control in Ireland is the protection of the state.

    Simply put and without sounding cliched, free men keep arms...

    "If you want to keep someone away from your house, Just fire the shotgun through the door."

    Vice President [and former lawyer] Joe Biden Field& Stream Magazine interview Feb 2013 "



  • Registered Users Posts: 371 ✭✭dc99


    ”Speaking to RTÉ's Today with Claire Byrne, Mr Deasy said there had been a handgun ban in the State since the 1970s but that due to legal action, the law was loosened and by 2008 there were 1,800 handguns in the general population.”


    Correct me if I’m wrong - but there never a BAN in the 1970’s. What happened was AGS just stopped issuing licenses and refused licenses for short firearms. There was no basis in law for them to have done that.

    The legal case was to challenge that. And from memory on the steps of courts they issued the licence and opened the “flood Gates”



  • Registered Users Posts: 15,022 ✭✭✭✭Grizzly 45


    Correct...There was the Temp custody order of 1972,and also correct in that statement ,more or less,that aGS refused to issue liscenses.After 18 years post IRA ceasefire there was no good reason to keep this refusal in place and it was challenged.

    1800 handguns in the state...WOW!! Benn in gun stores in the EU that have had that in stock. Pity we never get the chance to point out the minutae of these numbers from our side.

    "If you want to keep someone away from your house, Just fire the shotgun through the door."

    Vice President [and former lawyer] Joe Biden Field& Stream Magazine interview Feb 2013 "



  • Registered Users Posts: 265 ✭✭judestynes


    "It NEVER is concerned about criminality or mass shooting for that matter. If it is about such. Then it is an OUTRAGE that we, as law-abiding citizens should be held to ransom and made accountable for the actions of criminals and law breakers or the insane, in deciding what we may own or use"

    That's my point, and the states. People are law abiding and sane, until they're not , for the reasons I mentioned. In the case of mass shooters, some of them are turned that way over time fed a constant stream of hatred from which ever news source they listen to, tends to be right wing and others just snap, it rained too many days in a row, there's no strawberry milk in the fridge or what ever pushes them over the edge that day so I get it. I get why they're worried. What I don't get is why steam rolling a bunch of what will most likely be ill informed or uninformed legislation is plan A because none of that will stop anyone flipping their lid, they'll just find some other way of venting that frustration.



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  • Registered Users Posts: 570 ✭✭✭JP22


     ...................but I suppose it's easier just to ban guns than do all that hard work.


    Its always been easier for those in power to do a runner, do nothing, stick their heads in the sand or to ban whatever than do the right thing, like make proper laws, rules, etc....... fit for a modern society.



  • Registered Users Posts: 265 ✭✭judestynes


    I always maintained banning something only means they haven't the skill or the smarts to legislate for it.



  • Registered Users Posts: 15,022 ✭✭✭✭Grizzly 45


    In the case of mass shooters, some of them are turned that way over time fed a constant stream of hatred from which ever news source they listen to, tends to be right wing and others just snap, it rained too many days in a row, there's no strawberry milk in the fridge or whatever pushes them over the edge that day 

    You missed one point,or two actually. There have been just as many Democrat voters and liberals involved in mass shootings as there have been card-carrying racists and Republicans. So politics is not a deciding factor.Or skin colour or religion.Been Jewish,Muslim and other religious mass shootings

    However, strange that 90plus % of mass shooters have been on,or off medication.Usually a Lithium-based [Valium] med. Huberty, the San Ysidro Mc Donalds shooter had mental problems and knew he wasn't right in the head was on prescribed meds. Harris& Klebold of Littleton Co were both on meds for "teenage problems" Klebolds medical records are sealed due to the "sensitive commercial nature" of whatever he was being fed in toxins. The trouble is in the US is there is a pill for everything..Just watch their TV adverts. There is stuff that is being sold ,that is prescription only in Europe,over the counter in the US The average American must rattle these days with all the meds they take on a daily basis.

    So self-medicating America has a cocktail of drugs in its system that no doubt is going to cause someone to blow their fuse.

    I would say big pharma with its 200 million dollars a YEAR in lobbying money,which puts the entire US "gun lobby" of 200 million dollars lobbying money since 2010 in the utter CHUMP CHANGE league in Washington DC.Has a lot more to answer for mass shootings than the gunowners of the US.

    It would be interesting to see also were any mass shooters here in the EU, were also on prescribed meds at the time they went off the rails,or did they have a history of using prescribed meds?

    "If you want to keep someone away from your house, Just fire the shotgun through the door."

    Vice President [and former lawyer] Joe Biden Field& Stream Magazine interview Feb 2013 "



  • Registered Users Posts: 15,022 ✭✭✭✭Grizzly 45


    He said members of the Dáil do not have any information about the guns out there, where they are, who is getting them and who is giving out licenses.

    ANDD Thiss is what happens when you give political clowns like Deasy this information,and something happens that they don't like;What happened in California after the Supreme court ruling in favour of constitutional legal carry

    From the online "The Reload" magazine

    In the wake of the first major Supreme Court Second Amendment ruling in over a decade and the first new federal restrictions on gun ownership in several decades, I thought the news might slow down a bit. That wasn't the case.

    Instead, we broke the news that California leaked the private information of every concealed carry permit holder in the state. And now it turns out the leak was even larger than that encompassing data from dealer sales records, the "assault weapons" registry, and even information on "red flag" orders. The state says it is going to contact everyone who was affected and offer them credit monitoring.

    "If you want to keep someone away from your house, Just fire the shotgun through the door."

    Vice President [and former lawyer] Joe Biden Field& Stream Magazine interview Feb 2013 "



  • Registered Users Posts: 15 mattimahoe


    I listened to the interview and it is so annoying that there was no challenge or request for clarification on any of the stupid comments, so many things that are just not relevant, outright wrong or out of all context. Surely as an interviewer there is a responsibility to understand the subject matter and be able to challenge and probe on some of the absurd comments.

    The really annoying thing for me is, my guns are locked away in a safe and out of sight but I walk into numerous houses where the shotgun is standing in the corner at the back door or in the kitchen and there are far more shooting injuries and fatalities with legally held shotguns than handguns, but yet the "problem" is handguns - really?

    https://about.rte.ie/contact/complaints/ is where you get info on how to make a complaint or provide feedback, I have opted for the Feedback route but I think we all need to be heard on this.



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  • Registered Users Posts: 15,022 ✭✭✭✭Grizzly 45


    This is where they will catch you and not uphold the complaint

    b) the broadcast treatment of current affairs, including matters which are either of public controversy or the subject of current public debate, is fair to all interests concerned and that the broadcast matter is presented in an objective and impartial manner and without any expression of his or her own views, except that should it prove impracticable in relation to a single broadcast to apply this paragraph, two or more related broadcasts may be considered as a whole if the broadcasts are transmitted within a reasonable period of each other.

    This is not to say don't waste your time doing this but what the more than likely outcome will be.

    IOW if the reporter was agreeing totally with what Deasy was saying on air. Then we have a case. But if she was just let Deasy spout BS on air, so long as he isn't saying anything abusive about us as a whole,[and yes group defamation is now becoming a thing under Irish defamation law, which has replaced /updated the libel and slander law]

    The other problem is that nowadays the MSM doesn't work under a code of balanced reporting anymore, and hasn't since the 1980s.IOW, they don't have to get an opposing opinion to balance the report or article. We all apparently have "the right to reply", but as you can see it can be ignored, edited, chopped or otherwise perverted to make your complaint not worth an inch of column space.

    This is why we need our own alternative media platform for shooting globally.It's why everyone is doing podcasts and YT and other channels,as they know they will never get a hearing from MSM.imagine the NRA etc having to rely on CNN/NBC/ NYT for a fair reply on US TV? Its why they have NRA TV so they can get their side of the story out.

    "If you want to keep someone away from your house, Just fire the shotgun through the door."

    Vice President [and former lawyer] Joe Biden Field& Stream Magazine interview Feb 2013 "



  • Registered Users Posts: 105 ✭✭17hmr1


    What's the story with him all of a sudden getting on the media with this subject.Why is it any of his business,he's just an ex TD so why are they taking any notice of him.

    Did he ever care enough to bring this to cabinet when he was a TD or is it he is now looking for a way back into politics and he's using the "guns bad "memo to try garner attention for himself.

    Other than him being a bit of an attention seeker the media are absolutely terrible on seeing if he's talking bull or challenging him on his statements.But I suppose the general population hate guns so why would the media bother arguing for them(unless we are not sending any to Ukraine, then guns are good and everyone in the country should have 1).Last bit is a bit tongue in cheek but it rings true.

    Post edited by 17hmr1 on


  • Registered Users Posts: 15,022 ✭✭✭✭Grizzly 45


    He was the most obvious figure that they can remember from back then that said anything on this topic, has an "American connection to Congress" and was threatened by some emails ostensibly from some nasty gun owners back then, that he had to seek Garda protection. Big Baby! 🤣

    Otherwise like most of yesterday's men in the political world like Bertie, or the most forgettable UK PM ever, John Major, or Biffo, they are wheeled out occasionally to mumble about things they were involved in the media and then shoved back into senile retirement to enjoy their loot. Which in Deasy's case is 2 million USD. If he thinks that's a vote-grabbing topic as to who owns handguns in Ireland, when we are looking at either eating or putting petrol in the car to get to work, to fill the petrol tank. Or whether we can afford to put the immersion or the heating on once a month this Winter, he is utterly deluded as to what is going on with the Irish citizens' concern.

    "If you want to keep someone away from your house, Just fire the shotgun through the door."

    Vice President [and former lawyer] Joe Biden Field& Stream Magazine interview Feb 2013 "



  • Registered Users Posts: 15,022 ✭✭✭✭Grizzly 45


    And 0.000001% of the population has died from an incident involving either CF pistols or SACF rifles or restricted shotguns in the time frame of 2006 to the present day.

    Like anything if people took time to actually analyse quoted figures by politicians or other sources. Like Eamon Ryan claiming 1,400 people die from wood or turf smoke or "air pollution"every year.[non-specified]1,400 people in a population of now close to 5 million is what? 0.0000 something

    So even 1800 handguns in the population is minuscule.

    "If you want to keep someone away from your house, Just fire the shotgun through the door."

    Vice President [and former lawyer] Joe Biden Field& Stream Magazine interview Feb 2013 "



  • Registered Users Posts: 553 ✭✭✭Munsterlad102


    I wasn't aware that there were any cases, apart from the illegal stuff of course, and those were only pistols.



  • Registered Users Posts: 15,022 ✭✭✭✭Grizzly 45


    Annnddd...Yup....In the case of the Danish mall shooter on Sunday. Full of anti-depressents namely Quetiapine.Used for severe depression, drug rehab, bipolar affective disorder, and schizophrenia.

    Now there is a study that Ireland is starting to prescribe anti-depressents to kids as young as 11.

    This is exactly what the US did 35 to 40 years ago when mass shootings started to become in vogue.Quick mental fixes instead of counselling. And before we get a pithy response "of well we don't have as many guns in the US,so we won't have as many shootings!" Maybe keep an eye then on how many Irish teens will start taking their own lives without guns. As that is utterly alarming as it is at the moment for Ireland,what will it be like once they are on meds?

    "If you want to keep someone away from your house, Just fire the shotgun through the door."

    Vice President [and former lawyer] Joe Biden Field& Stream Magazine interview Feb 2013 "



  • Registered Users Posts: 802 ✭✭✭tonysopprano


    Wonder will Deasy make a complaint about O'Cuiv's illegal importation of a handgun into Ireland? and his illegal possession of same?

    If you can do the job, do it. If you can't do the job, just teach it. If you really suck at it, just become a union executive or politician.



  • Registered Users Posts: 15,022 ✭✭✭✭Grizzly 45


    Like politicans anywhere in the world.The law applies to US peasants, not them!

    "If you want to keep someone away from your house, Just fire the shotgun through the door."

    Vice President [and former lawyer] Joe Biden Field& Stream Magazine interview Feb 2013 "



  • Registered Users Posts: 348 ✭✭delboythedub


    Grizzly45 I think you hit the nail on the head with the above post. Back in 50s, 60,70, 80s and 90s you could buy a gun in the USA by mail order and it would be delivered by post, you could even buy a gun through private sale and back then there was no mass shootings. Today in USA with all the regulations regards firearms sales / background check AND gun free areas I think your post Grizzly puts some light on this situation . Some churches ( and Starbucks) over there are now allowing carry & conseal permit holders to bring their pistol to church on mass days so if there is a problem it can be sorted out quickly. Stats have shown that these mass shooters only pick areas like Shopping Malls and I dare say Schools where people have no way of defending themselves. Think that school teachers are being asked to carry a gun in the class room??.



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  • Registered Users Posts: 15,022 ✭✭✭✭Grizzly 45


    It is the one common denominator in the majority of the school shootings since the 1984 Mc Donalds shooting in San Diego. Huberty knew he wasn't right in the head, he had tried to check himself into a mental health facility two days before he decided on a Big Mac with a side order of 9mm. Mental health, depression and the inability of people to deal anymore with the pressures of life in the US,[an utter and total rat race that puts our life on a relatively easy-going pace] and the lack of treatment or meds or over subscription or self-medication in pill-popping America of meds that you would need a prescription to buy here in the EU.

    So imagine your average "troubled teen" being given this because their parents can't cope or don't want to or can't or they have the normal teen problems of life back then, but it's all sortable with a pill...And you have been on this stuff for months...

    As I said,it would be interesting to see is there a correlation over here in Europe between shootings and prescribed meds? Even here in Ireland with the tragedies down in Cork last year?

    "If you want to keep someone away from your house, Just fire the shotgun through the door."

    Vice President [and former lawyer] Joe Biden Field& Stream Magazine interview Feb 2013 "



  • Registered Users Posts: 473 ✭✭jb88


    Dont say it hasnt happened it has, and you would be amazed by whom, it would send shock waves around this group, but its well known in my part of the country.



  • Registered Users Posts: 15,022 ✭✭✭✭Grizzly 45


    It seems our old pal EX TD Finian Mc Grath was sounding off in the Daily S[cu]N on about how we are on the brink of massacring high schools in Ireland with legally held firearms!!!🙄🙄. Remember this is the utter CLOWN who used a Northern Ireland road sign that was shot up with birdshot to claim this was common in his Dublin constituency!!! 🤣

    He was also the opposition to William Egan the NARGC Solr in RTE's Primetime bait&switch interview in 2015 on gun ownership in Ireland when the Garda Rep whom Egan was supposed to debate was pulled and Mc Grath was let loose. Something a good MEDIA /PR REP wouldn't have let happen...

    Just waiting now on the NZ firearms expert Sen Grace O Sullivan to chime in on Irish legislation, because she is well up on it for being a crew member on shore leave when the green Peas ship was sunk by the French.[Should make her an Underwater Demolitions Team Expert as well] Going by how the Irish MSM choose their people of expertise for their story hook.🙄

    In fairness,once you do get past the typical Red top hyperbole and pearl clutching and Mc Grath drivel, It's not too bad an article on facts and balance.I've seen worse from them.

    https://www.thesun.ie/news/9090230/ireland-trigger-warning-guns-shock-school-shooting-warning/

    "If you want to keep someone away from your house, Just fire the shotgun through the door."

    Vice President [and former lawyer] Joe Biden Field& Stream Magazine interview Feb 2013 "



  • Registered Users Posts: 2,448 ✭✭✭garrettod


    Ah Grizz,

    I can't believe you've linked to that rag of a so-called newspaper. 😒

    Thanks,

    G.



  • Registered Users Posts: 15,022 ✭✭✭✭Grizzly 45


    In my defence.

    I was sent that link, by another member here who shall remain nameless. Sometimes you just have to get the waders on and dig thru the shtpile,so others are spared the same fate.🤣

    "If you want to keep someone away from your house, Just fire the shotgun through the door."

    Vice President [and former lawyer] Joe Biden Field& Stream Magazine interview Feb 2013 "



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