Salary much lower than new colleague with same work background

sura28

I recently found out that my new colleague who started 2 months ago is on much higher salary than me so I would like to get some advice on how to approach this.

A bit of background. I’ve been in this job for nearly a year. I’ve excellent appraisal by my line manager and other managers and staff I work with.

I am very overworked doing 2 people’s job and regularly stay longer to finish work which is unpaid. I do this because the team was short handed and staffs salaries depend on us, so There is a high level of responsibility but the pay is low.

The team and my manager are very good. We get on very well and help each other when needed and able to do so. I have the busiest and more complex areas under my responsibility and this is known and acknowledged by my manager.

Yesterday by chance I found out that my new colleague with very similar background, the same job description and responsibilities is being paid much higher salary than me. We are both female but she’s Irish and I’m not. This has happened to me throughout my 15 years working in Ireland and it’s something that makes me upset.

What upsets me most is the fact that I have great respect for my manager and she is a very good person so it’s not something that I would expect being done on purpose.

I would like to approach this with my manager but don’t know how to do it and don’t want to sound petty. I do not mind staff getting high salaries, quite the opposite I believe we should all earn good salaries if it can be afforded.

With the cost of living raising, being in my forties with a young family and in renting accommodation, we are finding hard to stay in low pay jobs. We have no family for support and can’t afford me staying in low pay jobs forever. I love my current job and the team and I am hesitant to move because of this.

Is there any way I could approach my manager without sounding petty? I’m the only mother in the team and I have to think about my children’s future first.

Should I start looking for another job? Or should I try to first approach my manager about this?

Sorry about the long thread and thanks for reading.

jrosen

The starting salaries may have changed in the last year since you took the job, perhaps the other person was more aggressive when it came to speaking about money and pushed for more. She also could simply be a better candidate than you and did a better interview. Im paid more than some of my colleagues.

You should speak to your manager about a salary increase. The decisions on pay wouldnt be made by her.

JamBur

If I was in your shoes, I wouldn't feel any necessity to be delicate about it. It's an employee's market currently.

Tell your manager that you found out accidently that you are underpaid relative to your colleague. Let them know that you like the job, people, company and don't want to leave, but that you have to do what is best for you and your family.

Don't sit and dwell on this. Be proactive, do it today. I say this as someone who did similar last month. They got back to me with a figure higher then I was going to ask for.

Good luck

theres absolutely nothing petty about it

can i ask whether it would be awkward to let the manager know youve seen your colleagues salary- is you having found out likely to be an issue?

oisinog

First of all I think you are overthinking the nationality thing. More that likely the new member of your team was able to negotiate a better salary when starting. That is not uncommon in the current climate.

 

I would hold a meeting with your line manager and bring in allthe evidence of what you do and where you have went above and beyond in your role and ask for a pay rise to bring you in line with the rest of the team. If they are not willing to move you need to be willing to move.

sura28

Hi, thanks for your reply. Salary scales have not changed for the last 3 years.

My manager has been having a hard time getting applicants for all the jobs we advertise and I know this is an issue.

I do not blame my colleague at all. It’s just that the 2 lowest paid in the team are non Irish and have similar backgrounds so that got me thinking since it’s a recurrence in most jobs I had.

it’s a candidate’s market at the moment and out team is core to the organization and all previous team members left in the last year so it would make sense we are encouraged to stay.

sura28

I will do this. Have a meeting with my manager. Just need to gather the courage.

sura28

Yes, it would be awkward to mention colleagues salary. I have access to all staffs salaries but on a need to know basis. It’s confidential and not something to discuss about.

it was honestly by chance that I found out, I could have checked when she started but I didn’t since it’s not my place to do so. I don’t think it would look good to mention this to my manager. That’s why I’m hesitant on how to approach this.

Thanks

Diceicle

I'd be less inclined to start off from the 'she's paid more than me' angle.

Arrange the meeting with your manager. If you're more comfotable coming at it from a cost of living perspective maybe start there. Have some examples in mind of teh effort and improvements you've made since joining the company.

I think the above is a more professional way of going about it.

However, if I were to get pushback from the manager or finance then I would use the 'its come to may attention that I am being underpaid for the role and how can we close that gap'.

HerrKuehn

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118892546#Comment_118892546

You hit on precisely the issue here. The market is very tight at the moment so they might be desperate and have to pay up a bit. You should speak to your manager about it in my opinion, it isn't petty, rude or whatever to talk about money. You are doing a job in exchange for remuneration, it isn't a charity. If you don't ask, generally speaking you won't get. Some companies can be good and increase wages with the market, I have had this experience, but I wouldn't say it is common.

It would probably be best to speak to recruiters first so you have a good idea of the availability of positions and potential salaries. Just go an speak to your manager in a respectful way, definitely don't go in angry. Of course a lot depends on the personality of the manager and also how they perceive your contribution.

jrosen

I would also hold off on speaking about another persons wage. Her wage does not mean you automatically should be paid the same. There is individual merit involved. I would approach it based on what you bring to the team, that you feel you are underpaid as per the current market and see where you get. Keep the other salary in your back pocket.

JimmyVik

Always found it easier to just leave and get a better paying job than trying to argue that with a company. That would be colleagues experiences too.

Then when you tell them you are leaving they usually make offers. Ask for double what you used to want to to stay and see if they bite. They sometimes do. Otherwise just go to the new job as planned.

notAMember

Absolutely bring this up. Is there an annual review, or process in place where it is appropriate to talk about it?

Unless there is some notable difference between you, you should be paid a comparable amount.

RedXIV

Would you find it easy to find another job tomorrow? If so, I suggest start looking and have that as a backup. Some places won't pay more outside of merit cycles etc unless you're genuinely threatening to leave (which is ridiculous and a whole other issue) so if you ask the question and don't get the answer you want, don't be afraid to take the plunge elsewhere.

As many have said, its very much an employees market out there at the moment

OP you're not being petty and it's a bit of a messy market.

In my company we have reviews and it's a 2-5% pay increase. Last year apparently it was fairly well split. This year everyone got at least 5%. At the same time the new starters all through last year likely started at a higher point than earlier entrants.

My advice would be have a word, test the waters and get your CV brushed off and start looking. A friend got an almost 50% increase in another company (he had them by the balls though, he was one of 3, one of the others had handed in noticed and the other was talking 2 of the following 3 months off. Bit of an extreme example but he had to play the game and get an offer from somewhere else to force their hand.

sura28

My manager is a very good and understanding person so I will have an open and hones conversation with her.

The cost of living is a big issue for us and we are trying to buy a property at the minute but the amount we can borrow is so low that we can’t afford anything. Mortgage advisor told us we need new jobs with higher incomes.

As a family with kids we need to think about their future and this is my main priority at the moment. I believe that although is a difficult talk, it’s better than doing nothing and if I don’t ask I will never know If I can get it.

this has been eating me the last couple of days so need to get it out of my chest and rather do this that feel unhappy in the job.

thanks so much for all the replies and advice. It is greatly appreciated.

28064212

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118892567#Comment_118892567

Do not, under any circumstances, say to your manager that you're using confidential information you found in the course of your job to negotiate a raise.

If you feel you're being underpaid, absolutely request a review discussion. But refer to what value you are bringing to the business, and what the market rate for your position is.

sura28

Won’t mention my colleague salary. Will focus the conversation on my job and my performance.

Thanks

Augme

Definitely bring it up.

My approach would be to look at similar jobs advertised and seeing if they list a starting salary and if so have those written down and noted for reference during the meeting. Tell about the additional work you do and unpaid overtime.

I wouldn't specifically mention the new person's salary, it will bring in potential gdpr issues and whether you would be in breach of gdpr of you were to mention it.

If the discussions are going too well or you are at the point of discussing what raise you would like I would simply ask the question - "what is salary of the new entrant compared to mine? Or we being paid comparative rates given our roles are identical?" They will probably know you know how much they are getting paid but the important thing is you've not said it out loud.

bucketybuck

Firstly, petty doesn't come into this. Salary is the very reason you are there at all, there is nothing petty about salary matters.

Secondly I wouldn't take it personal. We are in exactly the same position, I don't want to give new entrants higher salary than people who have done a lot of good work for us, but I also cannot get people in the door if I don't, its catch 22. Do I automatically raise every salary every time I make a new hire? No, that would be madness and probably destroy the business, so I end up with a balancing act.

One thing I disagree with is going in to discuss things in terms of a "review". Its not a review and treating it as such is going to make things worse for you. You say its a big difference in salary, pretending its a simple review will not bridge that gap and even with an increase you will walk away still feeling demotivated because the new hire is still on a much higher salary despite you doing the extra work.

You have to make clear that you have benchmarked the salary. Obviously you cannot reveal that you checked confidential information, but your manager needs to know that you know the figures involved. Frankly the easiest thing is to lie and say that you were told it in conversation, which isn't exactly rare to be honest, don't understand it myself but have known lots of staff who seemingly couldn't care less who knew their salary information.

You can't be shy here, you need to inform your manager that you were told the new hires salary and that it is a lot more than yours, and that you cannot accept the implications of this.

sura28

Thanks so much to everyone for your inputs and advice. I take everything on board.

I have asked my manager for a meeting in the morning and I’m going to bring this up. I’m not sure If I’ll get any pay increase but at least I’ll feel relieved to get this out of my chest. I believe this will give me clear options and I won’t be afraid to make a decision to move on if needed.

I always get attached with the jobs when I feel comfortable and find it hard to leave.

Thanks again everyone for your time.

Sheep Shagger

Unfortunately some people are in the right place at the right time regarding commanding a higher salary if their skills are in demand at the time of being recruited.

Doubt you'll get salary matched....you'll need to leave to get that.

Dr. Greenthumb

A method I have used in the past when you are aware you are underpaid in comparison to your peers is to say you were contacted by a recruiter. You can say a recruiter reached out to you and said they would be able to get you x amount at another company for your role and experience. You say in your meeting you enjoy working at your current company and have no real interest in leaving, but it's hard to ignore the figure given due to cost of living increases etc., and can they do a salary review for you.

This allows you to state a figure, show you're willing to work with your bosses on coming to an agreement, and not just jumping ship for more money. Obviously use a different figure than your colleague is getting paid. You'll have to have a figure in mind going into the meeting and be willing to share that figure also.

sura28

I have been checking jobs and lower level than mine get paid more than me so It’s an argument I’m going to use.

I have been offered higher paid jobs soon after I started here and refused them out of loyalty. I need to put my family first.

thanks

sura28

I’ll see. I hope this is not the case. I do like the job and the team. The volume of work it’s ridiculous so It will be hard for them if I leave now, specially with most of the team being new and needing training. Hopefully I’m right. If not I’ll keep looking for something else.

thanks

0ph0rce0

No idea why people work two peoples jobs and stay late getting unpaid.

No promotion is worth that brown nose bollocks.

Loyalty means nothing also. You're a number and that's it, no matter how much anyone thinks.

No offence to you but it's stupidity at its highest. Stressing for nothing. You say people depend on it. But you can be guaranteed nobody would give you two thoughts if it was the other way round. If you keep doing it it's expected of you going forward.

Been there done that and **** all ever comes of it and the next person walks in on double, go in on time, leave on time and look for something else.

Sheep Shagger

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118895481#Comment_118895481

No offence but are you young?

If so, you'll soon learn that loyalty means nothing. If cut backs are ever required it means nothing either.

Look after number one as nobody else will and who cares if there there's lots of work to be done or training new people in - it's not your problem. Get paid what you are worth by moving on once you get something better.

The rest is your bosses problem, not yours.

Degag

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118895521#Comment_118895521

I don't think it's a bad thing to have some pride in the job you do and sometimes working a bit extra, even if unpaid is part and parcel of it.

One does in general expect something in return for it, at some stage, whether it be a simple thank you or some future pay rise, promotion perhaps. I definitely wouldn't view it as brown-nosing.

At the same time though, it's not something that should happen regularly. It should be an irregular occurrence and if your job is 9-5, that's generally what you should do.

I wouldn't say that loyalty means nothing but perhaps it means little. Total inflexibility on an employee's behalf is unlikely to get them many places either.

OP, definitely don't mention that you know your co-workers salary. Even if you only got it by accident, the fact that you can access salaries will not look good for you.

sura28

I’m not young, I’m in my early forties but my colleagues are all mid 20s.

I took over part of 2 staffs work when they left to cover for few months until their replacement was hired. I barely had capacity to do my own work due to the volume of it.

We get plenty of thank yous and our manager is supportive and appreciative of the work that we do but that’s it. I had crazy year end period working unpaid overtime most of December and my manager is aware of this but there was never mention of extra pay. Must say the team is very nice and supportive and that’s what has kept me in the job. I also do like my manager very much but I believe that when one is in a different situation and getting well paid it can be hard to see things from another point of view. So I believe my chat with her will be a positive thing even If I don’t get a pay increase.

We are all overworked in the team incl my manager who is very hands on, but I feel that since I started this job I have no time or energy to do anything else but work. It is affecting my family life. I’m dreading every time I take a day off since I come back to a full mailbox and the work keeps pulling. I get an average of 27-40 new emails when I take a day off and all need to be actioned. It’s absolutely mad!

Thanks again to everyone for your advice. I’ve taken notes and will discuss these on my meeting today.

Mundo7976

"it's affecting my family life"

"I'm dreading taking time off"

Thats enough to change company in its own right, no amount of pay rise money will get that time back.

sura28

I know. But I do like my job and the team so I want to give it a chance. I also have the fear of what’s out there.

we are trying to buy a house and can’t afford anything on my salary but I have a permanent job and I’m mortgage approved so that is a positive thing that I may lose if I leave the job.

I also trust my manager and believe that I need to have an open and honest conversation with her before making any decisions. This will make it easier for me since I’ll have more clarity on where I’m standing.

Thanks

pjdarcy

Good luck in the meeting this morning OP. If you don't get the result you want, don't be afraid to move jobs. Moving jobs is the easiest way to get a really significant pay increase and you never know, you might love the new job even more (and maybe be able to afford that house you're looking for).

lintdrummer

How did it go @sura28 ? Are you celebrating a promotion/pay rise?

You say in your OP you are with this company nearly a year. Are you still on probation? If you're less than a year in your job, say nothing until your probation is passed.

Then raise it with your manager. I'm not sure how you'd approach how you found out about your colleague's salary, as that could be seen as a data breach if you saw it when you weren't supposed to. That's not good.

HildaOgdenx

It's been said upthread but just to reiterate, avoid discussion of colleagues, be it their salary, performance or anything else in one to ones with management.

If you have already spoken to your manager, OP, hopefully all went well. If you have yet to approach, talk about your own salary and expectations only, is my advice.

jmayo

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/2058240653/salary-much-lower-than-new-colleague-with-same-work-background

Ok for starters stop doing unpaid extra work, especially staying doing work without overtime.

Oh and "thank yous" don't put food on the table or increase the chances of you getting a decent mortgage.

I hope the talk with your boss went well.

You need to lay out exactly with evidence how much you are doing and be honest that you can't afford to stay on current salary.

It is not being petty.

Also update your CV.

But I think by the sounds of it you are probably not going to bridge the gap to your colleague and they don't probably don't really care how much extra work they shove your way.

They have probably twigged that you are willing to do it so why change a good thing.

It is a job seekers market at the moment, but that won't last long with good chance of recession coming.

Squatman

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118892567#Comment_118892567

Hi Manager, I really like working here, and offer an excellent support to the team, however, i am finding it increasing less affordable to continue working on my current salary. Could we discuss options for increasing my salary. I feel i have a wonderful future within this company, and would like to continue my career path, and see myself progress to x role. would you be able to support my financial needs?

Squatman

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118909740#Comment_118909740

also, as you said let them know that you are looking to settle in the area permanently and looking to commit to the company by purchasing a house locally

eimaj18

I'd been following this thread for a little bit - I'd nothing really to add, but I found it interesting. Hopefully it worked out for her, and she can give us all an update - waiting here with baited breath 🤣

sura28

Hi all

Apologies I haven’t updated you all on how things went.

I had a call with my manager where we discussed my current workload and salary in a positive way. I think it was a surprise to her that I asked for my salary to be reviewed but she thanked me for being honest and bringing it to her attention.

She will hopefully have an answer for me next week. I am not sure If I’ll get a pay increase but at least I’ll get clarity and will be able to make an informed decision once I hear back from her.

I know that if my salary is not increased I will start looking for another job. I do hope my salary is matched because I would like to stay but this will be a deal breaker for me.

Thanks everyone for your support and advice. I took notes of what was said on the thread and used them to prepare for the meeting.

n0minus1

I think it would be useful to specify more details of both your roles. It's quite possible that you colleague actually has more qualifications and /OR more relevant experience that perhaps you really aren't aware of as you were not part of the hiring process.

Probably best to really understand that first before jumping to conclusions

By all means ask for a raise if you feel that you deserve it, but make it about you and what you can and are bringing to the table and less about a possible perception issue with you colleague in particular. She could be more capable than what you give her credit for

Best of luck with it

sura28

Hi

As part of my role I have full overview of the recruitment process and job description and applicants for the role.

We both have the same job description, similar qualifications, years of experience and responsibilities. I’ve been doing part of her job which I’m doing a handover. In fact she’s being trained by me and is having a nice pace handover. I was thrown in the deep end when I first started.

There are 3 of us doing the same role and I am responsible for the most ‘difficult’ areas which my manager handed to me due to trusting my experience and abilities.

There is no reason whatsoever to have different salaries and I don’t think my colleagues should get a lower salary, quite the opposite. The roles are very busy and fast paced. We are all qualified and underpaid. The team is lovely and we look after each other.

I know my manager was struggling to recruit for the role and that is why probably the salary on offer was higher.

Thanks

"I know my manager was struggling to recruit for the role and that is why probably the salary on offer was higher." and exactly the same problem will arise if she needs to replace you! Hence, you hold all of the aces!

So the only thing that you need to do - if she won't increase your salary, or offers you an insultingly low increase - is to be firm in your own mind that you'll immediately give her the necessary notice of your resignation. Alternatively, you could 'acccidentally' leave a copy of your CV on the photocopier or printer!

Seth Brundle

is to be firm in your own mind that you'll immediately give her the necessary notice of your resignation.

Dont hand in your notice until you have secured another job!

thefa

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118940352#Comment_118940352

Would be a hassle for the manager to replace but wouldn’t be wise to overplay the OP’s hand with antics. OP likely plays an important role within the team but the business is unlikely to collapse if they leave, particularly if two others are capable of doing the role to some extent. Quickly could ruin the relationship with the manager and the business by acting out and forget about getting a reference if needed at some stage.

See what the offer is, firmly argue for more if needed and start looking elsewhere if not happy with it. An offer from elsewhere is the strongest bargaining chip you can have in most cases and it’s typically easier to get a job already in one.

Squatman

how did you get on with this one?