30k speed limits for all urban areas on the way

Akrasia

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119370531#Comment_119370531

Why would you drive at 30kph in top gear???

Lugging is bad for your engine. Drive in the correct gear for your speed

https://www.roadandtrack.com/car-culture/videos/a30431/lugging-bad-for-engine/

Akrasia

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119372918#Comment_119372918

Absolute and utter nonsense. Fluid dynamics is way more complex than that especially when there are forks and bends in the pipes. Have you ever tried to balance a heating system?

Akrasia

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119374810#Comment_119374810

That's a poorly designed experiment. A single vehicle driving slower than the speed limit would likely dis improve traffic flow as it causes a bottleneck. If all cars drive at about 30kph that bottleneck isn't created and flow can potentially improve at junctions.

Every second you spend stationary at a junction means you have to drive much faster to make up that time later on. Reducing the time spent stationary could easily offset the slower top speed which the car is only achieving a small part of the time in urban areas

Akrasia

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119375376#Comment_119375376

Buses may not benefit from the better flow rate as they're driving in less congested lanes. Maybe buses should be exempt from the 30kph limit. (Cat, there's the pigeons)

Akrasia

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119483720#Comment_119483720

Lol. Those murderous cyclists must be stopped!

Akrasia

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119486124#Comment_119486124

I think the lack of a speedometer in 1935 may have been the cause of making speedometers compulsory in 1937. The law was completely unenforceable without a speedometer.

dePeatrick

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119502760#Comment_119502760

You really like telling other people what to do, don’t you, It’s my car I’ll drive it as I like. And I’ll guarantee you I could drive circles around you in whatever eco friendly crate you inhabit.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119502813#Comment_119502813

I'd be curious to know how the cops detected law breakers then too seeing as radar guns weren't invented until the 1950's

Akrasia

Drive behind the car at 30mph if the car is getting farther away, they're speeding. At least that's how I would have done it

magicbastarder

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119503016#Comment_119503016

you were talking about driving at 30km/h in top gear. i suspect if you were driving in circles around anyone at 30km/h in top gear, it'd be fun to watch.

dePeatrick

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119503067#Comment_119503067

Don’t think I can’t do it 👿 😂

Spook_ie

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119503029#Comment_119503029

You measure a distance of 146.7 yards then time the vehicles covering it, if they cover it in less than 10 seconds they are exceeding 30 mph.

65535

More Dublin fanciful Dublin rules for non Dubliners to endure.

The Dept of Transport may make 30k the default for built up areas

https://dublininquirer.com/2022/11/16/foiled-last-year-council-officials-want-to-take-another-crack-at-reducing-city-speed-limits

Seth Brundle

"People will spend time looking at their speedomoters so much that the roads will become more dangerous."

"Cars physically are unable to drive at those speeds"

Do I get points for being the first to post this nonsense this time round?

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119883091#Comment_119883091

There ya go

hairymaryberry

I would bet a weeks pay not a single DB or GAI route will get 1 minutes extra running time when the 30kph limit starts.

So expect even dropped departures, as we know the running time is insufficient to day never mind with these restrictions.

Seth Brundle

I would bet a weeks pay not a single DB or GAI route will get 1 minutes extra running time when the 30kph limit starts.

My take on it is that the proposal is to make roads safer and to enable more people to choose active travel where they may currently choose not to because of the fear from passing drivers.

So expect even dropped departures, as we know the running time is insufficient to day never mind with these restrictions.

Who said it would speed up bus times? However, given that in much of the city council area, busses won't exceed 30km/h anyway, it shoudl make little difference. What it might do is make it a less desirable choice to drive into the city

mikeybhoy

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119885124#Comment_119885124

London buses actually have a device fitted that prevents bus drivers from exceeding the speed limit so say in a 30km zone sensors will read that and bus won't do more than 30km/ph.

https://londonroadsafetycouncil.org.uk/londons-buses-to-be-fitted-with-speed-limiting-technology/

It takes 5 minutes to update so if you go from a 30 zone to 50 zone bus will stay at 30km/ph for the next 5 mins even if the driver absolutely floors it. Only a matter of time before the NTA get this on DB/GAI buses likely on the new electric buses and no doubt won't amend running times to consider this. More grief for bus drivers I expect.

Kurooi

I have never found myself as a pedestrian endangered because cars were driving 50km/h. There is plenty of time for me to notice them and for them to notice me. Drivers who are not fit to drive, drugged up, drunk, speeding, joyriding or texting are a whole other issue not resolved by speed limits. And that's the problem. Want less accidents, take this scum off the road. I regularly witness joy riding and a staggering number of people are actively on their phone while driving - this is the danger.

But this is not a safety measure is it. These measures are all designed to kill traffic. Pedestrianizing areas, closing streets, adding cycle lanes, privatizing public transport, complicating it with transfers. Soon enough we will ban cars, actually we will ban cheap cars, and we can kiss this whole social class mobility good bye. Keep the poor away from jobs, education, services. Stay in your post code.

Amirani

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119885472#Comment_119885472

You haven't found yourself endangered by cars driving at 50km/h, congrats. Many other people have found themselves dead by encountering cars travelling that speed though.

There's quite clear science behind these measures, they're clearly safety measures.

loyatemu

for anyone interested; speed limit consultation in Wicklow: https://www.wicklow.ie/Living/Services/Online-Consultation-Hub/County-Wicklow-Road-Traffic-Special-Speed-Limit-Bye-Laws-of-2022 closing date 25/11/22

just looking at my local area, there's an increase in the number of 30km/h roads, and they seem to be getting rid of the 40km/h limit they have in some places in favour of 30. A lot of built-up residential roads with schools, zebra crossings etc on them still have 50 limits though.

mikeybhoy

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119885747#Comment_119885747

Why you don't drive recklessly or run out in front of traffic don't ya think. Shouldn't be punishing the many for the crimes of a few.

mikeybhoy

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119885177#Comment_119885177

Clearly missed the point the OP quite rightly made which is would the timetables of buses be adjusted accordingly to take into consideration the reduced speed limit?

SeanW

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119885747#Comment_119885747

This has nothing to do with safety. In Ireland there are over 300,000,000 vehicle-kilometres between fatalities. https://etsc.eu/14th-annual-road-safety-performance-index-pin-report/

No-one is endangered strictly by "cars driving at 50km/h" as there is ALWAYS another cause. Either the driver of the car is doing something to create danger (like disobeying a traffic or directional control, failing to yield when required, failing to keep in lane etc) or another road user is doing something to create danger. And I am not aware of any area of life other than motoring where we punish (or propose to punish) the entire group as a collective (2.8 million in the case of drivers in Ireland) for the actions of a tiny minority, some of whom aren't even in the group (in the case of accidents caused by pedestrians/cyclists).

Kurooi

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119885747#Comment_119885747

Over 30% of them were on the drink, 25% were on their phone. Sprinkle extra for other drugs and substance abuse, joy riding, reckless driving, speeding and running lights (quoted as the most common causes of road accidents)

To surmise I don't think most of the people who caused accidents gave a flying one about the speed sign. Only loser common Joe like myself will obey.

buffalo

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119886704#Comment_119886704

Is there another area of life where so many individuals have the power to cause injury, serious bodily harm and death through a moment's inattention?

97% of drivers speed according to RSA figures. 67% admit to using a mobile phone. You can't call law-breaking drivers a 'tiny minority'.

SeanW

There are plenty of endeavours where "a moment's inattention" could have dire consequences (sports shooters, airline pilots to name a few) but so far as my knowledge extends, people doing these things are regulated appropriately, not excessively or punitively.

As to your point about law-breaking drivers, the funny thing about all of this supposed "law-breaking" is that it having basically zero negative effects. I posted absolute road safety statistics above showing that road fatalities were so rare that they barely register by common metrics like fatalities per billion vehicle kilometres among others, but the relative data ranking Ireland against other countries show basically the same story:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_traffic-related_death_rate

So while you might be able to find a country where there is less "law breaking" (and you don't allude to any so this is just speculation) that country probably has a worse road safety record. So when I look at relative road safety as above or the absolute data provided in my last post, I have to ask where is the justification to wallpaper the country with ridiculously low 30kph like some are trying to do. Because from what I see in the data, the case for anything more than tweaks here and there doesn't exist.

buffalo

Ah yes, there are similar amounts of airline pilots, sports shooters and drivers in the world. What an odd comparison.

Those fields are heavily regulated because there are so few of them. I can't imagine every Irish driver requiring a co-driver being a popular move, but if that's what you're suggesting...

SeanW

I'm suggesting that these groups are regulated appropriately, not in a way that is stupid, disproportionate or excessive vis-a-vis what they're doing. I have two follow up questions:

1) Where in the road safety data I provided, is there a case to single out Irish motorists for stupid, excessive, punitive blanket speed limit reductions, such as the 30kph limits that are the topic of this thread?

2) You mentioned all the "law-breaking," can you show me a country where this does not happen, and (assuming it's one of the majority of countries to have such) why its road safety is worse than that of Ireland.