Yet another young woman attacked by a male. When will it end?

standardg60

Nothing of the sort.

It seems that some people who have never been attacked are getting angry with the fact that their plight of being in fear of such does not take precedent over those who have been, and anyone who suggests the discussion needs to be about violence against everyone has something wrong with them.

Empathy shouldn't be selective, which is what to seem to be suggesting

Mad_maxx

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118578267#Comment_118578267

" empathy " is a term progressives like to trot out frequently.

It costs them nothing, makes them look good but in the main delivers nothing either which sums the WOKE up really

olestoepoke

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118577543#Comment_118577543

You forgot the time he punched a pensioner off his bicycle in an unprovoked attack, knocked him out cold. A nasty piece of work.

Billy Mays

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118578474#Comment_118578474

You should try going one day without typing the word 'WOKE' in a post 😂👍🏻

Ash.J.Williams

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118577230#Comment_118577230

Point taken, and agreed that’s the kind of behaviour friends should look out for and stop

SEPT 23 1989

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118577214#Comment_118577214

There was serious vetting years ago but unfortunately the older gentleman who made the final decision on their “stories”retired

God only knows who makes the decisions now

but you can imagine

MarkEadie

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118578561#Comment_118578561

I'm surprised he didn't throw in MARXIST and SNOWFLAKE. They usually like to put those words together with WOKE. Missed opportunity there.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118577591#Comment_118577591

Plenty of suggestions were put forward on other recent threads, one example of such was not whistling at women in the street because the vast majority of women don't enjoy that kind of attention, aren't flattered by it, and can feel intimidated by it.

And what happened? Shot down as ridiculous, because women shouldn't feel intimidated by "lads being lads" and should take their (unwanted and uninvited attentions) as a compliment.

A perfect example of women telling you (generic you) something that will make them feel safer, but that message isn't being listened to.

"Men do need to do more".

I don't think anyone is expecting men to throw themselves into life threatening situations against complete strangers in defence of some unknown woman, (I know I don't). Nor would I personally expect a man to cross the street to avoid me, or any woman.

But there are small things they can do. For example, if you're out with your mates and one of them starts getting handsy with a girl or whistles at one, have a quiet word and tell them it's not okay.

Whose example do you think young lads growing up will follow? Who do they listen to? Women? Not so much. Young men look to the older men in their lives to see how to behave, and its often where they learn how to treat women too. Their fathers, older brothers, uncles. Male teachers. Other men.

Aren't we lucky mcentee is going to ignore minor convictions and take serious convictions 'into account ' with her amnesty.

Will she be blamed when some criminal nut from a foreign male chauvinistic society attacks or murders one of the citizens of the country that gave them amnesty....or will men be blamed? What's more likely?

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118578375#Comment_118578375

If we are going to punish those who should be keeping this kid under control can we also punish the garda commissioners and ministers for justice for the last 20 years along with the parents?

blanch152

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118579049#Comment_118579049

Why? The garda commissioners and ministers for justice aren't responsible for raising a 13-year old thug.

AyeGer

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118578476#Comment_118578476

Why is someone like that not in jail for a very long time? Big changes needed in our court system. If we think about it what do we owe this guy, why is he being given chance after chance after chance x 78. If he was sent down for 30 years would it not be better for society? I certainly think so. I don't understand why the focus seems to be on his potential rehabilitation which after 78 convictions is clearly not happening. I don't care about this guys life, i care about the victims of his crimes, like that poor old guy traumatized by being knocked out cold off his bike.

SEPT 23 1989

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118579127#Comment_118579127

2.5 million euro to keep him inside for thirty years at your and mine expense

far cheaper solutions for men like that who will never contribute anything to society

AyeGer

Id say by the time you add up his legal aid bill and any medical costs for some of his 78 victims along with some of the time and resources wasted on rehabilitation and counselling programs he was likely sent to. He is already costing this state a fortune. Deportation would be the ideal answer but as he arrived so young that will not be possible. Criminals like him are a massive problem.

stellamere

AngeloArgue

Ethics, virtues and values have be turned on their head. Society has been conditioned to have contempt for them. We refuse to have an agreed framework of what's right or wrong.

stellamere

stellamere

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118571761#Comment_118571761

What white irish males are you talking about here? White Irish males are quite a diverse bunch. Are you referring to white males from Sligo or maybe white males with one testicle? Perhaps the white males from the inner city, working 2 jobs to keep the show on the road. Maybe even the white males who get to see their kids once every 2 weeks because thats the value that the courts system attributes to fatherhood or even those in hospital after having been half beaten to death by luas hopping junkies.

So you might be a bit more specific as to exactly which of those "white males" you are casually dismissing by reason of their gender and skin colour.

This "white males privilege" bu11shite is laughable, even a students union candidate with white makeup and blue hair would be embarrassed to come out with that nonsense. If you have an inferiority complex about being white and Irish, that's your business and you can even continue wagging you finger for all I care, but I thought we had correctly moved away from putting people into different groups to treating everyone as bring an individual.

And to the lady who started this thread and others who would seek to attribute some guilt or blame to the "white Irish males " of this world, I would like you to ask yourselves what if your hair or eye colour is the same as that of the perpetrator? What if you are the same height or weight as the perpetrator? Do you and the perpetrator have bad breath?

If so, your annoyance and indignation at these attacks is misplaced, as you too shall join us men in a communion of shame and guilt, by virtue of these shared arbitrary characteristics.

Strumms

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118579372#Comment_118579372

People who perpetrate crime have their wellbeing and interests prioritised ahead of their victims…now in Ireland..

The way things are going next we’ll hear a judge chastising a person for being well dressed or driving a nice car… accusing them of inciting their attacker…

Jequ0n

So there are people here who seriously argue that you need empathy to be able to discuss the topic? Like seriously?

Talk about letting emotions rule over objectivity.

maestroamado

Are you joking... When did you ever see a person jailed for assault in Ireland... Suspended sentence if guilty... Appeal and conviction quashed on payment if 1k to charity... There an article today where 2 high profile person's are complaining that they are victims after being convicted by the court... This is the second case of this nature in same area in a short time... Surely if this the norm Court system needs urgent reform... Conviction for crime against person should be done with proper judge...

foxsake

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118576500#Comment_118576500

I'm sure you'd be cheesed off if you were labelled something you were not. It's not some bar stool drunk having a go . It's people with media access in NGOs and government ministers framing a narrative that is not true for the vast vast majority

Ultra feminist Leo was in the sun yest spouting utter cringe playing the identity politics bingo..

I do listen , but to the women in my life not some shrill feminist type with an axe to grind.

anewme

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118578561#Comment_118578561

It’s very distracting. also uses various other forms of WOKE as well.

There's a drinking game in there somewhere...😆

WrenBoy

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118576771#Comment_118576771

OOOOOOOOOOOPPSS !!!!

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118576996#Comment_118576996

I got it from the media, and the range of policies implemented by governments over the last decade, and no it's not all in my head...

I never said that women were conspiring in any shape or form. I referred to feminism, which does not represent all women, considering how many women have stated that they are not nor support modern feminism.

Once again, you're responding to things that weren't said. More thought police attempts. Projecting beliefs and then seeking to counter those projections rather than deal with what was expressed.

rightmove

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/2058230989/yet-another-young-woman-attacked-by-a-male-when-will-it-end

Did you not give all your opinions on the previous threads. I did notice you never responded to my questions. you just dont like men ...we get it.

Billy Mays

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118579676#Comment_118579676

When did you ever see a person jailed for assault in Ireland

3 days ago

‘We’re underage’, teen mugger taunted battered victim - Independent.ie

RobbieTheRobber

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118579978#Comment_118579978

Klaz

Once again, you're responding to things that weren't said. More thought police attempts. Projecting beliefs and then seeking to counter those projections rather than deal with what was expressed.

Also Klaz

However, posters can discuss the reports involved, and the motivations behind those reports if they wish, without it needing to be any attempt to convince others that they should accept those discussions as being fact.

🤣🤣🤣

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118578943#Comment_118578943

Plenty of suggestions were put forward on other recent threads, one example of such was not whistling at women in the street because the vast majority of women don't enjoy that kind of attention, aren't flattered by it, and can feel intimidated by it.

And what happened? Shot down as ridiculous, because women shouldn't feel intimidated by "lads being lads" and should take their (unwanted and uninvited attentions) as a compliment.

It was shot down because most male posters pointed out that they don't engage in such behaviour. That's been the case with most suggestions to help the situation.. referring to the behaviour of assholes and suggesting that it's a common occurrence that most men are going to be able to influence. Which they're not... Most men don't whistle at women, because they already know it's inappropriate behaviour.

A perfect example of women telling you (generic you) something that will make them feel safer, but that message isn't being listened to.

You're right it is a perfect example, but rather for expecting men to change something that they have no ability to change. Think on this. I don't whistle at women, so then, the expectation is that I should intervene when I see other men whistle at women, but in all honesty, I haven't seen anyone do it for years, but if I do notice it happening, I should intervene with, likely a group of men who will shift their attention to me instead of the woman. Grand. The woman walks away, but I'm left with the aggression of the group of men, because I've just challenged them, and as a group confronting another man, it will likely become more aggressive, and possibly lead to violence. However, the woman has walked away and is clear of the trouble, so that's alright.

The problem here is that female posters aren't listening to what male posters say. We understand what happens when one man confronts a group of guys or even the kind of guy who wolf-whistles at women. We understand that such a confrontation will escalate, and likely lead to violence, The risk is real not because of "male culture" but the testosterone that exists in the male body, leading to aggressiveness when two or more men face off. And in all honesty, regardless of who comes out the winner, my confronting the other guy(s) probably won't change their views, and they'll continue behaving that way towards women.

That is why such suggestions are meeting resistance. They're not practical, rely on placing men at risk, and won't change anything.

But there are small things they can do. For example, if you're out with your mates and one of them starts getting handsy with a girl or whistles at one, have a quiet word and tell them it's not okay.

A lot of us already would do that.. I don't have friends who behave that way, because I'm not that way myself. We tend to make friends with people who reflect our own values.. so, the expectation comes back to policing other men and their behaviour..

Approaching strangers to stop them behaving that way, runs the risks that I described above. You said that you don't expect men to put themselves into danger, but every fight carries massive risks in terms of head trauma.. most of us know of people who had fights outside of nightclubs, were knocked down, and suffered a head injury resulting in death or permanent damage.

Also, TBH I tend to associate getting handsy of a girl, harassment, etc with young men, or teenagers, because they're still learning what's the right way to behave, often confused by the mixes signals they get from different girls. That's not excusing their behaviour... but there is a learning process involved, and many women/girls are not.. similar in what they want from a guy. Most "men" I know would have gotten over that kind of attitude or behaviour by their mid-20s. So, perhaps we should consider where these activities occur, and what kind of environment the learning takes place? Perhaps consider that we might want to teach both males/females how to behave together, so that they avoid picking up bad habits, in the mistaken belief that they're acceptable (there are a lot of habits that women adopt when they're young which are rather nasty too).

Whose example do you think young lads growing up will follow? Who do they listen to? Women? Not so much. Young men look to the older men in their lives to see how to behave, and its often where they learn how to treat women too. Their fathers, older brothers, uncles. Male teachers. Other men.

That's not true and a total cop out. I know many men who were greatly influenced by their mothers, myself included. Most children spend far more time with their mothers, than their fathers (It's been the complaint from women's rights groups that society still expects mothers to raise children while the men work.. a gender stereotype or role stereotype that continues for many families)

Also a significant percentage of all teachers in formal education are female, and yet, somehow it is other men who influence all boys in their path. It's a cop out. Yes, fathers and other men do influence us, but for many of us, we actually end up spending more time with women than men. So. perhaps it's worth considering what boys are learning from women, than simply passing the buck on to men. And no, that's not blaming women... it's merely that we should consider all influencers in a childs development rather than repeating the tired out sentiment of traditional gender roles.

There are problems in modern society, and we need to spend time looking at all the components that influence those problems. There's a tendency to give the influence of women in society a free pass, except when it relates to something positive. Just as you have done above, but if we really want to resolve these problems we need to look at the underlying causes, and that means looking at both genders without bias. And that's not a dig at "women"... As with "Men" they don't have much actual influence over how society develops...

Thelonious Monk

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118579395#Comment_118579395

If you read the post I was responding to, the poster was complaining that if he went to Lagos, Nigeria, and people were shouting things at him because he was white, no one would care, boohoo. People like him think they are persecuted because they are male and white and everyone else has it much easier, which just isn't true.

Ash.J.Williams

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118578943#Comment_118578943

People still whistle ?

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118580231#Comment_118580231

I didn't read it like that at all. I think he was highlighting that sexism/racism against white men is given little credence by people who assume they have some imagined privilege.

I don't think that they believe men are being persecuted or that others have it easier. It's just some refuse to believe that men (white men in this case) can have it as hard as anyone else.

Thelonious Monk

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118580258#Comment_118580258

of course they can have it as hard as anyone else but generally speaking, certainly on a global scale, you've already got a leg up in life if you're white and male

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118578211#Comment_118578211

Maybe we'll live in a world one day where that opinion would be common sense but sadly we don't.

Id lock him up in a centre indefinitely and only allow him to leave once he agrees to a one way ticket out of the country.

TomTomTim

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118580231#Comment_118580231

The irony being that you'd attack no other group in the same way, which at least helps support the point that white males aren't some sort of protected, "privileged" group.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118580274#Comment_118580274

I do not agree with that line of thinking and I think its a dangerous and somewhat offensive generalisation.

TomTomTim

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118580274#Comment_118580274

And surely this applies to white women too?

thefallingman

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118580295#Comment_118580295

personally i don't see the point of this person being allowed to live anymore, i certainly wouldn't be allowing him any education or tv's or playstations or visits in jail at the very least, like that scum who killed Ashling, that animal should be stuck in the smallest cell on his own for the rest of his life. Why does he deserve human rights ?

Thelonious Monk

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118580311#Comment_118580311

Yes of course

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118580274#Comment_118580274

The same can easily be said if you're white and female, especially in Western nations. There are always going to be disadvantages/advantages of being a particular gender.

Although, the truth is that being white of any gender can be a distinct disadvantage in a variety of nations around the world, but yes, generally it's a good thing.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118580179#Comment_118580179

What that whole post is, is a total cop out, and a complete dig at women, despite your claim otherwise.

Its a tick-box of excuses why you think men can't shouldn't have to do anything to help bring about change, while attempting to shift a larger proportion of blame for young men's behaviour onto women's shoulders - their mothers, female teachers.

Do you seriously think boys and young men are learning how to disrespect women and act violently towards both other men and women, at their mother's knee? Give me a break.

If men are unwilling to call out other men - not strangers, but their own friends on bad behaviour (which was the specific example i gave) then how do you expect a woman to do so? In particular, a woman on her own?

How much more intimidating do you think it is for her to stand up to a man in a situation like that, if grown men are afraid to do so because of the fear of retaliatory "male aggression".

And if that is the case, why are some men still questioning "why are women so afraid?" when it can be taken from what you're saying that they are afraid themselves.

Where do you actually expect change to come from? Ultimately, I have to conclude that you don't expect anything to change - and its not that you're unable to do anything, its that you're unwilling to do anything. Which is very disappointing.

TomTomTim

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118580503#Comment_118580503

If men are unwilling to out other men - not strangers, but their own friends on bad behaviour (which was the specific example i gave) then how do you expect a woman to do so? In particular, a woman on her own

See this is the problem, you assume we've had these experiences in the first place, when most of us haven't, because we aren't friends with the types of people who do stuff like that. This applies to most male groups, which is the point, the types who engage in this stuff are a minority, a minority we aren't friends with. You assume we see this all the time, yet do nothing, which says far more about your views of average male behavior. What you think is average isn't, which is why people are incensed by your claims, because they aren't relevant to most of us, and are out of touch with reality. You're asking us to fix problems we simply don't see.

WrenBoy

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118580503#Comment_118580503

Of course have a part to play in the shaping of their society, both the positives are influenced by men and the negatives are also influenced by men as well as both are influenced by women. This is just another post laying the blame at the feet of Irish men and demanding they agree with this collective guilt or be "part of the problem"

Do women have no impact on the rearing and moulding of their male children ? They are raised by the evil men only, in isolation and taught the ways of oppression and violence and girls are being raised by their mothers, thats not accurate imo. When will we see the threads decrying the recent spate of foreign born men attacking women ? Or is that particular generalisation uncomfortable or a degree too specific perhaps ?

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118580503#Comment_118580503

The poster you responded to said he would call out friends who engage in poor behaviour and wouldn't associate with people who do engage in that behaviour.

I'm not sure how you could hand-on-heart see that post as a dig at women. The only way you could possibly think that is if you genuinely believe that it is only men who are responsible for children growing up with bad attitudes and behaviour.

And if that is the case, you are wrong.

erlichbachman

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118577895#Comment_118577895

He's mentally ill, and as such should be processed through a treatment facility.

Locking up a mentally ill person, then releasing them back into society and expecting them to have improved their behaviour is insane.

It's a never ending merry-go-round, and will continue as long a society keeps punishing rather than treating.

Ash.J.Williams

is it a silly thread title? the answer is never

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118580667#Comment_118580667

It is silly.

It is framed to make it look like an epidemic of violence tailored towards a certain gender.

But putting up "another violent attack happened today. When will it end?" wouldn't get the usual footfall.

CreadanLady

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118576938#Comment_118576938

No-one is against it. But what are the vast majority of men supposed to do to prevent the actions of a small minority of mentally deranged and hopeless cases with complex behavioural and substance abuse issues?

Most normal every-day men don't even associate with these types, or hardly even know such people personally. So there is litterally very very little that "men" as collective can do in a practical sense.

If you witness an attack, sure they could summon help or try to intervene or call the Gardai, but direct intervention is as likely to get you stabbed or beaten as not, it is very risky. What's more, a large portion of these attacks are fairly opportunistic and random in nature and happen in quiet areas or at quiet times, so there is no-one there to intervene. Granted, the Tullamore and Stephen's green cases are in busy areas, but the thing is, these incidents all happen in a matter of seconds too, so it isn't realistically possible to intervene - it is usually over within a matter of seconds in the case of random punch assaults by loopers.

In my opinion a lot of it can be put into 4 categories.....

1. Psychopathic creeps and perverts. Cunning and will engineer the situation to do whatever it is to a woman, in the hopes of getting away with it. Think the likes of Larry Murphy, Graham Dwyer, Michael O'Donoghue, David Masterson, big Joe O'Reilly et al. Psychopathic monsters who are driven to do what they do by their inherent evilness.
2. Mentally deranged loopers. Fellas who will sexually assault, rape, assault or even kill someone in broad daylight because they are nutty in the head or schizo but the, mental health services being what they are in this country, these nut cases are allowed walk the streets unabated. (just this morning I saw some head-banger of a fella in a park across the street roaring shíte talk into the sky - a looper who should be in some sort of institution for his own good, if nothing else)
3. Petty harassers and delinquent youths, feral scum who harass passers by be they women or men, young or old with the objective of looking like the big hardman in front of their friends. Pack mentality.
4. Cat callers, wolfwhistlers, arse slappers, and the like. Think of stereotypical builders on scaffolding shouting after a woman on the street, or the likes of the character Chris Finch from the Uk version of The Office. Obnoxious and annoying tossers, but probably unlikely to rape or kill someone. But they still cause distress and trouble and shouldn't be tolerated.

For 1 and 2, normal every day men cannot do anything about it because these fellas are simply either bad or mad. Inherently mentally defective and that is the source of their offending. For these it is a matter for the mental health services and Gardai to identify these individuals and deal with them effectively before they become an issue.

For 3 the only realistic way I can see that "men" could aid the cause would be for their fathers or male relatives to be parents and role models and sharply punish such behaviour and opinions from their sons. The problem there is that these are often disadvantaged demographics and their fathers/uncles are either non-existent or if they are they may be misogynistic violent tossers themselves, and it is a case of monkey see monkey do. For a regular man walking the street to challenge a group of youths like this would be extremely dangerous and foolish as he would be likely to be beaten up or even stabbed. In the first instance it realistically is a matter for the Gardai to challenge and the courts to punish, but we all know the legal system is beyond a soft touch here. it needs reform, badly. Community leaders, schools, and social services have a role to play in changing the culture and diverting youths away from this sort of petty criminality.

With 4, this is probably the only area where the average man on the street could challenge such behaviour without putting themselves at risk. Having the balls to challenge and denounce such behaviour on the spot when you see it. "would you say that to your sister, or mother? Cop yourself on and grow up". Men who are managers in the workplace, or in other positions of authority can and should challenge this behaviour by taking complaints seriously and pursuing and investigating them vigorously when they are brought to their attention. Gardai and courts might need to be involved in this process as well.

So, it is not as simple as just saying "oh men should do something". It is not that simple. That appoach is like expecting a white knight to gallop in on a horse at the moment some incident kicks off.

it is more complex than that, as my analysis above would show. In many cases regular men have no influence or contact with agressors, in other cases it would be highly dangerous and foolish to intervene directly in an incident. But in other cases they can influence things and change the culture, but it is limited to the areas in which they have influence, such as within the family or community organisations, or the workplace.

jmayo

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118577543#Comment_118577543

Can anyone of our migrant asylum seeker welcomers please give us one good reason why this scrot is still in our country ?????

All we hear is how people from certain countries deserve asylum, but we never hear what we the Irish people deserve ?

I guess it isn't safety.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118580554#Comment_118580554

There is a difference between "not seeing" something and "turning a blind eye" to it, which I think might be closer to the truth.

I've read posts from men here over the years who admitted to saying nothing about laddish behaviour they've encountered in their friend groups, both in person, or on social media, whatsapp groups, etc because they didn't want to be the one to rock the boat and call it out.

Time to start rocking the boat.