Can't walk on country roads anymore

magicbastarder

anyway, yes, there are occasions where you probably do find pedestrians doing stupid things on country roads, but there's a very big difference between them doing that and what the original topic of the thread was - pedestrians being stupid on country roads generally have little effect on careful drivers.

drivers being stupid on country roads have a very negative effect on careful pedestrians.

peds aren't able to bully drivers off the road, but drivers are able to scare/bully pedestrians off the road.

zom

"Someone set up a competitor to boards using that word.ie"

Shouls sell domain to Microsoft instead ...

Ubbquittious

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118571260#Comment_118571260

Ireland is only a small backwater to them and a convenient place to set up for tax reasons. They have little to gain from the .ie version of that domain

Seth Brundle

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118571283#Comment_118571283

Plus it is the only decent sized English speaking country within the EU but we're way off topic now.

Back to the original topic: some drivers make rural roads lethal for walkers & cyclists - discuss 😀

saabsaab

If a car is coming fast I usually stand into the ditch as far as possible. Hate playing chicken with a car.

Danno

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118569542#Comment_118569542

No they are not shared spaces, despite how many times you repeat it and try to convince yourself of it. Why are we building cycle lanes and expanding footpaths within villages, towns and cities all across Ireland at a cost of almost €1m per day? Surely it would be far cheaper to tell folks in these areas to plod along the roads instead?

As for your numpty question about how people would cross the road cross the road:

Gosh, that little grass strip is soooo hard to navigate.

No, my views are not warped and selfish - yours are. I want to see rural cycleways and walkways alongside our RXXX and LXXXX routes to keep people safe. You on the other hand want to throw the 80 year old lady venturing to her neighbours under the proverbial bus.

But it's okay - I've come across folks who think like you before. They have an inbuilt hatred for private vehicular transport and anything that is an inconvenience to them is a reason for joy and celebration in your books. €2 litre diesel and ever expanding regulated speed zones and you're beaming it.

Gant21

Better maintenance on the current cycle lanes are needed because the only one using them are insects.

magicbastarder

I want to see rural cycleways and walkways alongside our RXXX and LXXXX routes to keep people safe.

you want to comlpetely re-engineer the entire road network for the country, yet you seem to think spending €1m a day is a lot?

Hurrache

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118574097#Comment_118574097

It's quite obvious that the only reason that you want cycle ways it not because you want to keep others safe, it's that you have this selfish idea that only someone in a car is entitled to use roads. Your own words are evident of that.

AndrewJRenko

Ah sure, "it was clear that this was an accident" so that's all OK then

https://www.independent.ie/irish-news/courts/i-was-not-aware-i-had-killed-someone-i-panicked-disqualified-driver-pleads-guilty-over-fatal-hit-and-run-of-childhood-friend-41305883.html

magicbastarder

the closest i think i've ever come to hitting a pedestrian or a cyclist with my car (discounting an incident in dublin city centre which i in hindsight wouldn't be surprised was a suicide attempt) was nothing to do with light levels or high vis - i approached a roundabout and through a coincidence of my speed, the speed of the cyclist who was on the roundabout, angles, etc., he remained behind the A pillar in terms of my line of sight until i was almost on top of him. i came within, i dunno, less than half a second of hitting him. scared the **** out of me so i can only imagine what it was like for him.

the A pillar in my car is chunky enough, but i've seen far chunkier, so it's something i'm now conscious of myself when judging whether a motorist might have seen me or not.

GandhiwasfromBallyfermot

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118574097#Comment_118574097

In reality that path in the picture you shared would be full of parked cars in most Irish towns and cities.

Even just driving on country roads is getting sketchier. I think part of it is bigger, more comfortable cars. Roads that were easily wide enough for a couple of Cortinas to pass at full speed aren't wide enough for a couple of Touareg to do so, but people aren't taking that into account. If a surface is any way decent then with soundproofing and **** people are just tipping along with no awareness of speed. Just last week I had 2 incidents in half an hour (with witness in car 😅) with an ID4 and a Range Rover, the ID4 tipped through at full speed while I had to dip a wheel in the ditch in 1st with the clutch in. Range Rover made me stop completely while he flew past. I was honestly worried about the cyclists they would be coming across a couple of bends later.

It's all just so unnecessary but I think a complete lack of awareness of speed is a major part of the change.

Tombo2001

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118570260#Comment_118570260

Academic to some degree.

Why is it that people preparing for the driving test stand out a mile on the road. Driving at the correct speed, slowing down appropriately, indicating ahead of time.

Licensed drivers behind them meanwhile getting impatient waiting for a chance to pass them out.

saabsaab

Years ago when I was first driving many walked along the roads in the countryside. I always kept an eye out for pedestrians and had a fear of hitting someone (justified0. Three people I knew of died on the roads as pedestrians (2 hit and run cases). You don't often see walkers on the road nowadays. I guess most people think it's too dangerous.

saabsaab

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118574805#Comment_118574805

That's the way to drive. Why do so many not use indicators? Seems worse since the lockdown ended have people forgotten how to drive properly?

Seth Brundle

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118574097#Comment_118574097

No they are not shared spaces, despite how many times you repeat it and try to convince yourself of it. Why are we building cycle lanes and expanding footpaths within villages, towns and cities all across Ireland at a cost of almost €1m per day? Surely it would be far cheaper to tell folks in these areas to plod along the roads instead?

They are shared spaces no matter how much some drivers feel that they can bully other users off the road.

However, just because they are shared spaces does not mean that they are safe. Many people will not walk or cycle on rural roads because they do not feel it is safe given the speeds some drivers pass at. In urban areas (as you mention) there are efforts at changing this to allow people to feel safe when walking or cycling. This is being reflected in the high numbers of people commuting via active travel. There is many benefits from this - less people driving means more space on the road. This will also help decrease our carbon emissions and therefore any carbon related fines. It also helps reduce pollution levels and at the same time benefits the health of the person.

In terms of the cycle lanes and expanding footpaths in villages, these are IN VILLAGES not rural areas which is what the thread is about (hint: see the thread title). Relating to the works being done in urban areas, the general benchmark for safe cycling infrastructure is to ask if it is safe for say a ten year old child to cycle to school alone. Currently Ireland has next to no safe cycling infrastructure. If it was there then many more people would cycle.

In terms of footpaths, these are not suitable for cycling on. Still some cycle on them simply because the adjacent road is deemed to be dangerous. In fact I tell my teenage son to use the footpath when cycling to the local GAA club simply because drivers tend to drive well above the posted speed limit despite it being an urban area and a school occupying a good deal of the road frontage. Footpaths in some areas have been widened (and some narrowed!) because during lockdown more people were out walking. Whilst this is a good move, I'm not sure how it relates to a discussion about rural roads.

In terms of the current spend on active travel, again you are even saying how this is in towns and villages. So not rural (remember, this is what we're discussing). However, if you disagree with the spend, remind me how much has been spent on road infrastructure construction and maintenance projects in the past ten years?

As for your numpty question about how people would cross the road cross the road:

Gosh, that little grass strip is soooo hard to navigate.

That is not what I was referring to. I was pointing at the stupidity of your proposal to build footpaths and cycle paths parallel to the existing road network around the country. These new foot/cycle paths would not have direct access to peoples homes in rurla areas. So If people use these new routes then they must at some point cross the existing roads. If roads are not shared spaces then how does someone walk across the road to get to their house. As soon as they walk on the road it becomes a shared space. So you either think they are shared or you don't - which is it?

No, my views are not warped and selfish - yours are. I want to see rural cycleways and walkways alongside our RXXX and LXXXX routes to keep people safe. You on the other hand want to throw the 80 year old lady venturing to her neighbours under the proverbial bus.

Your proposal is absolutely nuts. You are suggesting to build a pathway and cycle path parallel to every road and boreen around the country simply because you believe that people sitting in a car should always have priority over everyone else on the road. This is a warped and selfish view - you just can't see it because...

But it's okay - I've come across folks who think like you before. They have an inbuilt hatred for private vehicular transport and anything that is an inconvenience to them is a reason for joy and celebration in your books. €2 litre diesel and ever expanding regulated speed zones and you're beaming it.

I don't have a hatred for vehicular transport at all - if you know me at all you realise know this. I used to have a similar mentality to yourself but I eventually came to recognise that I'm not the centre of the universe. However, this is irrelevant to the discussion. No matter how you or I feel about cars does not mean that driving one gives you carte blanche to drive as you wish and feck anyone on the road who is not in a car.

Jakey Rolling

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118569874#Comment_118569874

+1 Walk/run on the outside of the bend to give traffic from both directions the best opportunity to see you in good time. I've have to explain this to my kids who are told elsewhere to *always* walk on the RHS facing oncoming traffic. Doesn't work out well on a right-hand bend when the car/track/milk lorry can't see you until the last second.

Seth Brundle

True but the walk towards traffic rule is good for straight stretches where you can eyeball a driver into giving you enough space.

selectamatic

"The corpse" was a nice local relatively elderly farmer who happened to die in a tragic accident. His farm runs alongside the road.

The N5 isn't a "country road" and the stretch the accident occurred on is arrow straight, wide enough to be a motorway and at times is busy enough to be one too. This particular accident has zero relevance to this thread in my view.

Poor visability on the evening, heavy traffic in both directions. Driver was in a line of traffic, was found completely blameless and was distraught after. That's the facts of the tragic incident despite what anyone else wants to hypthesise.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118569875#Comment_118569875

eggy81

I’ve been commuting to Dublin for work since 2004 from the midlands. Normally an hour in morning and an hour and a half in the evening. I’ve never seen so many bad drivers as I have since restrictions ended. People not indicating whatsoever on roundabouts is the biggest bug bear I have no matter which exit they plan on using.

Escooter drivers in my experience do tend to forget the hi vis gear. Cyclists and pedestrians in my experience generally seem more visible. More than once I’ve been on top of an escooter in the dimly lit areas around clonee or dunboyne before I’ve seen them.

Wildly Boaring

Running this evening (in lovely RSA hiviz) on this huge straight

https://maps.app.goo.gl/1JTLZSN81kobXbZJ8

A driver came so close I had to jump aside. I yelled and he stopped.

His excuses.....

Did you not see the car coming towards me!

I have a child in the car!

You should have got out of the road!

I couldn't stop, it was too dangerous!

The other 50 cars I met were fine.

saabsaab

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118582611#Comment_118582611

They don't make sense. Especially the 'too dangerous' one i.e. implied it was safer to run you over/off the road? Just another driver that thinks you don't have any right to use the road.

Wildly Boaring

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118582661#Comment_118582661

I decided he was a lost cause once that one came out

magicbastarder

I know this is an attempt to get his client off the hook, but it's kinda tragic that pedestrians even in urban areas are now being blamed for being run over:

Under cross-examination Garda O’Donnell told Philip Sheahan SC, defending, that there was no evidence of the victim wearing “hi-vis” clothing or having a torch.

https://www.thejournal.ie/taxi-driver-denies-driving-carelessly-elderly-woman-5673195-Feb2022/

horse7

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118555178#Comment_118555178

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118555178#Comment_118555178

Dogs are legally required to be kept under control, not let loose,if hit by a car the dog owner is liable for any damages to the car owner. It could cause an accident also by digging up a road,it's vandalism and sheer stupidity.

Lime Tree Farm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118585430#Comment_118585430

The editor of that newspaper has the "comments section" closed as legal proceedings are ongoing.

Another hazard on country roads is the electric car. I was out for my usual walk yesterday, in the wind and light rain. I sensed rather than heard something behind me. A slow moving ecar.

Ave Sodalis

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118585964#Comment_118585964

Yup! I know a blind man who is extremely independent, but has had his independence seriously curbed because of electric cars since most of his land involves crossing or walking on a road to get to.

I was speaking with a handyman that works with a group in Dublin for special needs he said the last six months the panel beater is made up with them. One incident a person was taking a renault traffic bus out of there compound new car was parked beside it took the wing bonnet front bumper off the car.

saabsaab

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118586073#Comment_118586073

They'll need to fit something to make noise.

John_Rambo

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118586073#Comment_118586073

So he can't see them (ever) and he can't hear them only when they're traveling at very low, safe speeds, I presume he's not getting knocked down by them all the time. What's the problem? Or is this just a perceived problem?

Tombo2001

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118585430#Comment_118585430

Were the street lights on and did the car have its (legally required) front lights on?

Ave Sodalis

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118587784#Comment_118587784

He can't hear them majority of the time. Any sort of background noise drowns any little bit of noise the cars make, and he lives near enough to the main road.

Electric cars still aren't that common here but he's had enough close shaves to put him off.

magicbastarder

i suspect the point was that above a certain speed, tyre noise actually becomes louder than engine noise. electric cars are much quieter at slow speeds but not that much quieter at high speeds.

AndrewJRenko

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118587490#Comment_118587490

Let's hope not.

The new calculation includes data that measure exposure to traffic noise and its impact on health related to cardiovascular disease, cognitive impairment in children, sleep disturbance, tinnitus, and annoyance.

From https://www.transportenvironment.org/discover/traffic-noise-health-impacts-second-only-air-pollution-new-who-report-says/

Cal4567

It's the roundabouts that scare me. A lot of drivers just don't know the rules. You just have to be Uber careful.

OP is right. Some driving on country roads is appalling. There's a lot though getting caught by the man in the van. 80 quid fine and 2 penalty points.

I would invest in a few more vans targeting speeding.

magicbastarder

I've always maintained that if you want to get even a hint of how bad some people can be behind the wheel, without exposing yourself on a bike or going out walking, sick an L plate up in your car. When my wife was learning to drive, I'd say the amount of drivers being utter dicks more than doubled; I can only assume it was an 'oh **** it's a learner, I simply have to get past' response.

Easten

imho the fines for speeding or careless driving are far too lenient.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118589518#Comment_118589518

imho fines for speeding are far too lenient 2 penalty points for speeding on a narrow country road is a joke, it should be at least 6, that way the next time they do it they are off the road. Using a mobile phone while driving should be an automatic licence disqualification.

Guards need to start doing there job, if they don't want to Police the roads why don't they just say so

Ave Sodalis

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118588815#Comment_118588815

High speeds being main road and motorway speeds. The average speed around country roads still wouldn't be high enough to produce enough sound to be heard like a car that wasn't electric. Bare in mind that people without sight have a better sense of hearing, so if their heightened sense of hearing isn't enough, then they aren't loud enough.

This guy doesn't want to be restricted, and hasn't let much stop him in the past. He's not the type to sit and whinge about things that could be fixed so if this wasn't a problem, it wouldn't be mentioned. He does 99% of the work around the place on his own. The fact that not only has he mentioned it, but has had to enlist help (something he would very rarely ask for), means it's not just a perceived problem but an actual one.

Gary kk

Never meet garda speed checks on country back roads.

FishOnABike

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118569874#Comment_118569874

If you did that around here you'd spend more time crossing the road then walking along the road.

John_Rambo

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118588439#Comment_118588439

They're just as loud as ICE cars over 30kph. I seriously doubt he's had any more close shaves (if any) than he has had with ICE cars.

older by the day

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118585612#Comment_118585612

Well my friend if you are going so fast that you can't stop when you see a dog. Then you won't be able to stop if a child runs out in front of you. Just because you are in the right, it would be a poor consolation in a fatal accident. And when it comes to you next statement. If people are too stupid to slow down by the gable of a house. Then fukk them. What would slow them. And it's too late to be crying if they hit someone coming out of the yard.

mcburns07

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118555371#Comment_118555371

Coincided with the rise of SUVs... ;)

horse7

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118592554#Comment_118592554

It's not about being in the right, it's the law,and remember that dog could be the cause of a fatal accident.

Ave Sodalis

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118592366#Comment_118592366

And why do you seriously doubt it? You don't become almost entirely independent when completely blind if you are the type of person who makes up obstacles to that independence. You most certainly do not start taking away the same independence you spent your whole life building, based on a minor qualm. He's now at risk of losing his livelihood he built up using sheer stubbornness and unwillingness to admit there's anything wrong. I've known him nearly twenty years now, and I've never once heard him actually tell me about his eyesight until recently, which was to ask for help with animals on the road. Why would he make that up?

elperello

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118592575#Comment_118592575

Maybe there are more SUVs doing it.

I must watch out the next time I'm driving a country road.

John_Rambo

I doubt it because electric cars are just as loud as ICE cars over 30kph and under 30kph is a very very safe speed to drive at.

So unless electric cars are creeping up on him at 29kph or under 29kph and almost knocking him down which is unlikely, there's no danger from them. Also, you claim electric cars are uncommon where he is so it's very very doubtful he's had "enough close shaves" with them in comparison to ICE cars.

Some one's making something up.

magicbastarder

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118592366#Comment_118592366

source?