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Ireland's defensive frailty exposed by Russian exercise

  • 24-01-2022 12:22pm
    Registered Users Posts: 22,374 ✭✭✭✭

    Looks like once again Ireland's lack of any defensive or reconnaissance capability is being exposed and will be alarming to European neighbors which, after this, may surely reach the point of demands to get our house in order.

    It's not about being able to defeat anyone - it's about making aggressive moves as difficult as possible.

    We occupy a very important geographical area in a European context, particularly our seas, and we are consistently failing to provide a basic sufficient defensive capability to assure our neighbors.

    This is the Swiss approach. They know full well they can be invaded but the point is to make an aggressor think twice before doing it, that it will cost them in the process.

    I can not understand how some Irish people can go on about "neutrality" when we can't even do the basics in terms of defence of that so-called neutrality. We don't have sonar, we don't have proper military radar, we don't have so much as one aircraft capable of pursuit within our own airspace.

    It's all a spoof and it's frankly embarrassing some of the stories in the papers today on this test.

    And it's selfish too.

    What we are basically saying to our neighbors is we want to run down our defence forces, not take our responsibilities to our own country seriously, that puts you at risk, spend nothing because we'd rather pay inflated salaries to our public servants....AND now Simon Coveney wants to raise this with foreign ministers in Brussels. i.e "we want your help"!?

    Don't be surprised if the reaction is both perplexed and frosty.

    We need a serious conversation about defence policy in this country.

    No one is looking for some bloated military, just the basics which we don't have.



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  • Registered Users Posts: 8,583 ✭✭✭ correct horse battery staple

    Hence join NATO and be protected by their missile umbrella

    if there’s ever a nuclear war we are fecked anyways due to proximity of UK

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  • Registered Users Posts: 694 ✭✭✭ CreadanLady

    i don't see why we would need ships with advance defence or offence capability. Against what threat? There is no threat that is reasonable forseeable? And if there is one, then it is likely to be an incident of international significance, so the Royal Navy or another EU navy will step in.

    Basically, we have the naval and airspace protection, but we have it all for free and other countries bear the burden of staffing, equiping and paying for it all. I think our current situation is the cutest and most shrewd of all possible strategies.

    But of course the Walter Mitty wannabe commando boys on Boards get all out of joint because there isn't an aircraft carrier in Haulbowline. Sure we have newish ships and half of them are tied up because no-one in their right mind wants to go on them for the rubbish money they get paid for it.

    The government's unwillingness to pay the defence forces any sort of reasonable wage just reflects their attitude to it - "we don't want or need it so we'll pay them peanuts and hope that most of them fúck off after a while and let the whole thing wither down so that it costs as little as possible"

    They may get their head out of their arse and wise up to what the priorities should be in this country.

    Housing, Healthcare, Climate, and Transport. Defence spending has literally nothing to contribute to any of that.

    The MFV Creadan Lady is a mussel dredger from Dunmore East.

  • Registered Users Posts: 7,927 ✭✭✭ Gregor Samsa

    2% our gdp us probably more than Russia spends on its military

    I'm intrigued by this statement. I would have thought it was blatantly obvious that 2% of our GDP is less than the Russian military budget (and a very quick Google search confirms that). Am I missing something?

  • Registered Users Posts: 694 ✭✭✭ CreadanLady

    To those advocating defence spending....why don't ye run as candidates in the next election. One of yer policies can be defence spending..See how far you get canvasing that on the doorsteps. None of the parties will want to know ye.

    That is the reality of it. And it ain't changing any time soon.

    The MFV Creadan Lady is a mussel dredger from Dunmore East.

  • Posts: 0 ✭✭✭ Rory Wooden Utopia

    The area maked out is in international water not much further from the UK or France than us.

    If they aren't intimidated by their aircraft carriers, fighters, patrol aircraft, subs and nukes why would they be intimated by anything we could field.

    I do believe we should integrate more into the EU defence structures though.

  • Registered Users Posts: 6,270 ✭✭✭ ebbsy

    On the plus side, we would be flooded with Russian beauties?????

  • Registered Users Posts: 8,366 ✭✭✭ Flinty997

    How would any of this stop these exercises.

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  • Registered Users Posts: 8,366 ✭✭✭ Flinty997

    I don't get why people are losing their minds over a very minor exercise.

  • Registered Users Posts: 694 ✭✭✭ CreadanLady

    Absolutely my attitude is to sponge off everyone else. Why should the Irish tax payer pay for it, when we can just not pay for it knowing that others, (who are far more capable militarily on a bad day that we could ever imagine to be) will just step in to fill the gap.

    Ass someone else said, the location was about the same distance from France and the UK as it was to Ireland. Why should we be the ones to do it? Let the Brits do it. If the Brits got a Scud or two shoved up their holes it would be no more than they deserve anyway.

    The MFV Creadan Lady is a mussel dredger from Dunmore East.

  • Registered Users Posts: 172 ✭✭ Glock17

    Tbh, Ireland doesn't have the economy to support a competent military......

    A jet fighter might cost 100m. A warship a billion. The irish taxpayer doesnt have the money for that type of investment....

    What Ireland should do is join NATO and invest in niche capabilities. Maybe something like transport aircraft.

    If you want a serious military youd also have to work hand in hand with the Brits....

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