Trying to force the sale of my house with ex

willdill

Ok guys

The situation is im trying to force a sale of house with my ex(girlfriend not wife).We have lived in it 13 years last few years were posion she had me thrown out barring oders etc whilst she was the one sleeping around.Iv been out the last 18months but know i want it sold so ican move on.She 100% will not agree to sell so i have no option.Question is can i do this on my own and if so what courts do i go to.If not i suppose a solictor will be pretty exspensive so ill have no choice.She hasnt paid one penny of the mortgage and iv all the proof.We have an 11 year old kid which is why iv held back a bit but iv had enough im in a cabin out a back garden and am 45 so running out of time to get a new mortgage.I know havin a kid wont make any diffrence in the sale because were not married i found this out in court when she tried for another order.Plus we both shoud make 100k each from the sale but of course missy doesnt want to down grade from her 4 bed house.Any advice would be really help full guys

Thanks

AnRothar

Ask to have this moved to the legal discussion forum.

You would get a better answer there.

Atlantic Dawn

Are both your names on the mortgage? Are both your names on the deeds of the house? How long is left on the mortgage? Who is paying the mortgage now?

chops018

100% go to a Solicitor. You can make an application to the High Court for the judge to make an order for the sale of the family home. But to be honest it would be a fairly nuanced area of law and most likely a Solicitor would brief a Barrister to draft the pleadings and attend Court etc. So, yes, it wouldn't be cheap, but if there is approx €200k equity in the property you could try negotiate that legal fees are paid from the sale proceeds and you just pay outlay until then e.g. stamp duty on court documents etc.

willdill

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118496799#Comment_118496799

Thanks

willdill

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118496853#Comment_118496853

Yes both names on the mortgage and pretty sure both are on the deeds,Theres 18 years left on it and i pay the full amount she contributes nothing and hasnt for 13 years.She was told by a judge 18 moths ao to pay half also and still has not payed one cent.

willdill

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118496862#Comment_118496862

Cherrs mate,would you have any idea in the region of what it could cost roughly bareing in mind the 200k will be split to 1ook for both parties..

chops018

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118496901#Comment_118496901

Think it's called a "Well Charging Order".

The Solicitors would most likely charge by hour. Barrister the same. Complete guess and ball park figure I'd say it could be near 10k by the time you get your Order. If it's uncontested then you would be looking at a lot less, maybe 2-3k. The Mortgagee (that is the Bank) will also most likely need to be a party to the proceedings as their consent would also be needed for a sale, a judge would also be able to give an order if they withhold consent unreasonably.

Then you will need the Solicitor firm again when selling the house. Most likely they will charge 1% of the sale price plus VAT and outlay. On top of that, your ex will also be required to have a solicitor in the sale to keep the transaction an arm's length transaction and it would be known as a joint carriage of sale, that's more fees from the pot. On top of that again, there will be two sets of estate agents involved who will take fees from the pot too.

Leg End Reject

I've never heard of a solicitor taking a percentage of the sale price for conveyancing. It's usually around the €1500 plus costs ballpark.

If both the OP and their ex have their own estate agent the one who sells the property is the only one to get commission from the sale. This can vary so always check with a few estate agents.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118497339#Comment_118497339

Not sure if you have ever sold a house or used joint selling agents. Though some solicitors do accept a flat fee, many charge 1-1.5% + VAT of selling price. When using joint agents, both want to be paid or they will not agree to act for the sellers.

Op, go see a solicitor, a child in the house complicates this situation in relation to selling the house. You have to consider that you effectively want to evict your child from their home.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118496881#Comment_118496881

You should be going back to court on this and have it registered that she has ignored a court order.

chops018

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118497339#Comment_118497339

I'm a property solicitor. Currently in-house. But when I was in practise (which was only a year ago) we would always calculate the professional fee on the sale of a property by a percentage 0.75-1% usually. So if we had a sale for sale €300k we would quote professional fee as €3,000 on the section 150 letter. Purchases are usually a flat fee alright. But even at that the section 150 letter states if the work involved goes above and beyond we can start charging by the hour. Albeit you'd have to discuss with the client before it got to that stage. Most firms I know do it in a similar way.

Just to add - they are not necessarily taking a "percentage" of the sale so to speak. They just use it as a way of calculating the appropriate fee of the sale of a property. So, if it's a high value property they'd be looking for a higher fee. Again, they won't technically take the fees from the sale proceeds either. They would need consent of the client to do that. If the client wanted all the monies sent to them and then pay the fee separately that could be done also.

highly unlikely any judge will order the house to be sold while you still have a minor child living there.

At least, not until the child is 23 or out of full time education (whichever comes first).

Have a read of the Separation / Divorce board (even if you're not married). Its a common enough situation.

TheWonderLlama

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118496881#Comment_118496881

So, you've already been to court? What does your solicitor say?

Leg End Reject

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118498781#Comment_118498781

It's been a while since I sold one house and bought another but I was quoted a flat fee plus expenses.

@Dav010, my only experience of using a joint agent is hearing from 2 others who did so, each said that only the agent who sold the property earned commission.

Every day is a school day as it seems I was wrong on both counts.

willdill

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118498983#Comment_118498983

I dont have one

CreadanLady

OP,

Forget the idea of selling the house for now. That house is the Irish family home, a concept afforded great protections in irish law. Unless there are some very extenuating and unusual circumstances to force it, no court in the land would order the sale of a family home with children resident.

So basically, you are going to have to put up and make the best of what you have for now. Badmouthing your will achieve nothing and only make you look bad yourself. And fwiw, who or how many people you ex slept with is none of your business whatsoever and of no relevance.

willdill

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118501420#Comment_118501420

I think it is when we were together and living with each other.anyways i couldnt give a **** about that but when your living in a 8x8 cabin with just a bed a tv and paying the full mortgage for your ex and boyfrienfd to live in that is a problem.Read the post she can easily downgrade to an aparment like i will.I have no place to take my kid right now and if both of us have a property then at least i can take him over night..

CreadanLady

You are basically in the same situation as every other separated or divorced man who has a child with ex. So don't feel that you are particularly hard done by here. This setup is par for the course. You have your health and that is the main thing. No-one needs a big house to be a good parent. The worst thing you could be doing now is having a negative bad attitude and having a vendetta for your wife and feeling hard done by. Like everyone else, these things happen and you have to take it on the chin like a man and keep looking at the positives in life and that will help you move forward.

C3PO

From personal experience, if your ex remains in the family home with your child you have very little chance of getting a court to force the sale of the house until formal education is complete. Your best bet imho is to try and persuade your ex to sell the house, perhaps by offering her a larger share of the proceeds. Otherwise she has the ability to tie you up in very expensive knots for years!

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118501611#Comment_118501611

What?

If the op’s partner can afford to pay her half of the mortgage and a Court instructed her to, then I am not in any way surprised that the op feels hard done by.

There currently seems no impediment to the op moving back in, so perhaps his partner should choose, either pay half the mortgage or the op moves back in.

Spanish Eyes

If you cannot sell right now for reasons mentioned above, what exactly stops you from living in the main house as a separated couple? Four bedrooms, two of which are not in use..... it might be awkward, but many have done it. You are paying the full mortgage too.

I am guessing that is why ex is using barring orders to keep you out though. I cannot comment on whether she has due cause to do this, but if there is no barring order in place why not move back in? Seems odd to me that there is a barring order preventing you from entering the family home, but living in a shed in the garden of the same house is ok.

kazamo

Perhaps start by going back to your solicitor regarding the 18 months unpaid portion of the mortgage by your ex.

That’s the first step and it will send a signal to your ex that you want things resolved, not enforcing the original court order weakens your case.

if she pays the shortfall to date and her future payments come out of her own bank account, then your monthly outgoings drop giving more scope for you.

If she doesn’t pay, you have another piece of evidence to show that there is she is defying a court order, which forms part of your case for the house sale.

The more evidence you have the better, as selling a house with a minor in situ won’t be easy.

Good luck op

willdill

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118501771#Comment_118501771

Its not the same house its my mams.I tried to go back to the house and was abused and told to f off at the front door by her and cops were called saying i had came back for trouble.She will do anything just to keep me away and keep the house to herself.Nasty piece of work.

willdill

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118501727#Comment_118501727

Thats the option i gave her sell or i move home.But she just has tunnell vision and thinks i should just walk away and leave her with everything.

willdill

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118501611#Comment_118501611

You are talik **** i cant even take my child for a night coz iv nowhere for him to sleep.You said it exactly she doesnt need a big house sell and both of us can buy 2 apartments problem solved

OP, you need to take a step back. As others have said, the chances of a court advising sale of the family home while there is still a minor child living there, are very slim. You need accept that this situation will not change until the child finishes its education.

She’s not doing herself any favours by defaulting on the mortgage.

Take some time to look at the overall picture, putting your child first. Good luck.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118502076#Comment_118502076

She is living in dream world, time for your solicitor to remind her of the Court’s direction relating to mortgage payments.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118502093#Comment_118502093

Getting angry at posters here for giving you advice is not going to help.

More than one poster now has advised you that the likelihood of a judge ordering the sale of the house while your child is still a minor and/or in full time education is virtually nil.

Your options are to go back to the court that ordered the mother to pay 50% of the mortgage and seek enforcement of that order, or for the judge to order the house to be sold on the grounds that your ex is not complying with the previous order and that this puts an unfair burden on you to make the full payment to preserve your credit rating, leaving you with inadequate funds to provide a suitable place to have access with your child.

Ireland is "no fault" when it comes to relationship breakdown so your ex cheating wont come into it, however if there is a current barring order in place you can't move back in.

Look for a good family law solicitor, as you're going to need one.

JimmyMW

Speak to your solicitor about only paying your portion of the mortgage and compliance with the court order, leave the mortgage go into arrears and the bank will force the sale of the house

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118504660#Comment_118504660

Not while there’s a minor living there.

maestroamado

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118497339#Comment_118497339

I know a lady who sold a house about 2 years ago for €250k solicitor about 1k... she was a former tax inspector in revenue and called a fer solicitors and agreed.... conveyance pretty straightforard if you have the property deeds...

JimmyMW

This whole situation seams mental, two people separate and there is enough equity in the property for both to split and move on with their lives with a reasonable standard of living and this is not seen as the proper way forward by our legal system/state. This country needs a serious overhaul if that is the way this goes.

maestroamado

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118504958#Comment_118504958

What legal system are you referring to... there is not a legal system in this country...

XsApollo

you really need to go to court to let the judge decide that their is enough equity in the house to let both people move on.

the fact she has to pay half the mortgage suggests she isn’t broke.

also to the op.

if I was in your shoes I would stop paying the mortgage and go and set yourself up with somewhere to live and get your life back in order so you can then move on with your child.

get your place and life.

you will then have a cost of your own to live and be in a better position in court.

this woman sounds like she don’t give a crap about you or her child, the fact that she lets the situation go like this suggests she really doesn’t care how her child feels.

stop paying the mortgage get a place of your own and then revisit it in court.

you won’t be made pay what you don’t have.

you need a place to be able to see your child, so go get one.

always remember that your ex could give ye both a good life and happy life for her , yourself and your child if she agreed to sell up so ye could both get a place and have 2 Homes for her and your child to enjoy and have both parents.

she chooses not to and chooses herself.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118504958#Comment_118504958

We only have one side of the story. The only way there’s €200,000 equity in the house is if there was a huge deposit paid or it’s increased by that amount since mortgage was taken out. Otherwise, if the property is only worth €200,000 and say €100,000 still owed on the mortgage, then they’ll only get €50,000 each. That’s not taking the child into consideration and it may need a home for another 10+ years.

JimmyMW

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118505054#Comment_118505054

Both rent, ownership is not a right

TheWonderLlama

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118501376#Comment_118501376

well, there's your problem right there. Get a solicitor right now.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118504660#Comment_118504660

Allowing the mortgage to fall into arrears to force a bank repossession could take years.

And if it does go into arrears, that leads to the question (if anyone can answer it) - will that make it difficult/impossible for the OP to secure another mortgage? How will it affect his credit rating?

The Courts can't order a bank to accept 50% payments from the OP (just like they can't order a bank to remove someone's name from a mortgage).

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118505392#Comment_118505392

No judge will order the home sold, to force them into renting where there is a minor involved.

€100k each wouldn't buy them each a new apartment, (at least, not in Dublin). The cheapest two bed apartment on DAFT at the moment is circa €180k.

We also don't know if the mother is in the position to get another mortgage either. (finance/credit rating).

And before you say "this is all unfair" - yes it is.

But it is what the Judge will consider where there is a child.

spaceHopper

You need to talk to a solicitor, their first meeting might be free or a few hundred euros.

Do not under any circumstances stop paying the mortgage. Get legal advice first but you could look at going interest only for while but the bank needs to agree to this. If you stop paying the mortgage you do two things, you destroy your credit rating and won't easily be able to get a mortgage. You destroy her rating, so now she can't get a mortgage but she is in the house so she will simply stay there and blame you.

You will not solve this without getting legal advice and you will lose much much more the longer you delay getting legal advice.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118504660#Comment_118504660

And if the op applies for another loan?

willdill

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118505054#Comment_118505054

150k owed house worth 350k

JimmyVik

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118527914#Comment_118527914

That kind of equity could give both of you a new start.

Smouse156

Probably best to stop paying the mortgage until she starts to contribute. The risk of the bank trying to repossess would likely get her to pony up

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118533869#Comment_118533869

And wreck his chances of getting another home loan in the process.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118533819#Comment_118533819

Not so simple when there’s a child involved.

JimmyVik

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118534080#Comment_118534080

As the child of a broken home where my mother used us as weapons I thing the best option here is a total split. Obviously the courts will have the child stay with the mother no matter what happens and that may be for the best but seperating the lives of the warring parents is the best thing to do for any child.

To stop the war both must be allowed to move on with their lives. And then they can both concentrate on giving the child some sort of a settled life where the parents arent pitted against each other.

Black Noel

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118498116#Comment_118498116

The child should be left were s/he is and the parents can stay in the house on a week on, week off basis.

That'll be a bit of a shock for herself 😃

Black Noel

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118505509#Comment_118505509

Lol, solicitors are wolves looking for sheep to gobble up.

Friend and his sis are at war over property, the only thing any of the solicitors are interested in is selling the property. He's taking the sis to the High Court by himself.

TheWonderLlama

well then, he will fail.

High court judges do not entertain fools, whatever his motivation and by going into court without a solicitor, your mate is a fool.