Centre fire moderator

tomtucker81

https://www.irishstatutebook.ie/eli/2008/si/21/made/en/print

Just having some light reading here this morning.

Section 4(2)(d) refers to moderators. But mentions only those for rimfire rifles. Does that not make any moderator for a centrefire a restricted firearm in itself?

Or has there been an amendment since this legislation that I've missed?

Cass

You need to read SI 337/2009 which amends SI 21/2008, specifically section 5 of SI 337/2009 which states:

5. Article 4(2) of the Principal Order is amended—

in subparagraph (d) by the deletion of the word “rim-fire”, and

Which means SI21/2008 now reads:

silencers capable of being used only with long rifled firearms

Meaning all suppressors are now unrestricted.

otmmyboy2

No I think you have it right, there are(AFAIK) no later amendments.

I think in practice that the super simply approves a centrefire silencer as part of an application on behalf of the chief, but if you just wanted a centrefire silencer on its own without a firearms certificate then you would have to apply for an authorisation to the chief.

Mind you, that SI also limits the non restricted silencers to one's which could be used only on long rimfire firearms.

I think you'd find it next to impossible to find a rimfire silencer which is capable of being used solely on rifles and not pistols, hence they are legally all restricted firearms.

otmmyboy2

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118488964#Comment_118488964

Would that not mean that all suppressors are restricted, since they would (nearly) all be capable of being used with short firearms as well as long firearms, or is that only referring to silencers licenced for use with long firearms, and therefore in the eyees of the law only capable of being used with those long licenced firearms?

I would presume the former given the wording "silencers capable of being used only with long rifled firearms"?

Cass

Correct.

Only when used on long firearms.

Short firearms are either unrestricted (5 shot, 22lr pistols) or restricted (everything else). If authorisation for a suppressor is granted on an unrestricted firearm it 9the suppressor) is still unrestricted. The suppressor itself is unrestricted and its going on an unrestricted firearm.

Now if you put a suppressor (unrestricted firearm by law) on a restricted firearm then the suppressor does not legally, technically or magically become a restricted firearm. It [the suppressor] still remains as an unrestricted firearm just in use with a restricted firearm (the pistol). Take off the suppressor and you have a restricted firearm (the pistol) and an unrestricted firearm (the suppressor).

Forget about pistols and think in terms of rifles. A 338 is a restricted long firearm. A suppressor is an unrestricted firearm, in law, and putting a suppressor on a restricted long firearm (the 338) does NOT make the suppressor restricted, its just used in conjunction with a restricted firearm.

In short the status of a firearm cannot change the legal definition of a suppressor, nor can it's [the suppressor] use.

Hope that makes sense because I don't want to have to write the word restricted again. 😁

otmmyboy2

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118489761#Comment_118489761

Haha, no that does make sense, cheers Cass.

There is an interesting point, for that 338 example you have a restricted firearm licenced, and on that licence the S allows you to have a non restricted firearm(the silencer), on that restricted licence.

Cass

Works that way with most things, of that nature.

You can load 5 rounds into a restricted pistol (22lr in this example) but it doesn't make the firearm unrestricted but your retricted license covers you for both scenarios of using it as an unrestricted and restricted firearm, however load 6 rounds into an unrestricted firearm and its now restricted but your unrestricted license will not cover you for this use.

IOW a retricted license covers restricted and unrestricted. Unrestricted license only covers unrestricted. Retricted is a "higher" level of licensing (for want of a better description).

By the way thats 14 more times I've had to write that word.

tomtucker81

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118488964#Comment_118488964

Perfect, so 337 of 09 amends it. Figured there had to be an amendment somewhere.

I'll have a look at that now, it makes way more sense. Strictly speaking the 08 Act made moderators on centrefire rifles restricted but 337 of 09 amended it to include them as unrestricted.

Now I hope I'm using restricted and unrestricted correctly here, Cass can help out again if not....

Cass

You have it now.

Mellor

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118489166#Comment_118489166

You are correct in that a strict reading of the law means that all mods should be restricted as they are capable of being used on short firearms. It’s another badly written line in that SI.

But in practise they appear to take to logical approach and defer to the license it relates too - as outlined by Cass.

Unsure if their was and official direction on that or just common sense.

Grizzly 45

Unsure if their was and official direction on that or just common sense.

A blind hen will find a grain of wheat once in awhile.