Black Monday 2022 - NFL Coaching Carousel

adrian522

Thread to discuss the coaches and GM's that are out, new hires, promotions etc.

Vacancies:

Jacksonville - Head Coach

Las Vegas - Head Coach (TBC)

Denver - Head Coach

Miami - Head Coach

Minnesota - Head Coach/GM

Chicago - Head Coach/GM

NY Giants - Head Coach/GM

Houston - Head Coach

NO Saints - Head Coach

Hot Seat:

Matt Rhule - Carolina

Pete Carroll - Seattle (?)

I think Zimmer and Fangio will both be back as DC's if fired, I'm not sure if Carroll and Rhule get fired, would seem strange but this is the NFL.

Oat23

Fangio confirmed as fired.

https://twitter.com/RapSheet/status/1480196850036748294?t=6o6-SiZk1qdiBBW2yFjRwg&s=19

Oat23

In Chicago, Matt Nagy is almost certainly gone.

I don't see Pace continuing as GM myself but it's still possible. He could also be "promoted" to a role like head of football ops/president. The McCaskeys really like him and he's had a big input in off the field stuff like the redevelopment of Halas Hall.

Dream pairing for me would be Harbaugh & Fangio. Both have history with Chicago and the Bears drafted Harbaugh in the 1st round back in the 80s.

el Fenomeno

Zimmer and Spielman the first coach/GM duo to get the chop.

el Fenomeno

And Nagy is now officially gone.

boccy23

Brian Flores out in Miami as well.

adrian522

The Flores one is surprising to be honest. Thought he was a good coach hampered by poor QB play.

Interesting to see if Chicago look to replace Pace as GM and also if the Raiders stick or twist with their interim coach given they made the playoffs.

Oat23

Pace has also been fired along with Nagy. There was a bad report from Schrager saying he was safe 2 minutes before the report he was fired from Schefter.

letowski

Yeah Flores was 10-6 and 9-7 in his last two seasons. Surprising one.

Oat23

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118449850#Comment_118449850

Dolphins owner is a Michigan alum/doner and has tried to land Harbaugh in the past. Perhaps there's something going to happen there.

edit: nevermind 😆

https://twitter.com/jeffdarlington/status/1480549782565310464?s=21

KrustyUCC

Flores will get another job quickly I'd say

cosatron

flores would be a good fit at Jacksonville

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118449850#Comment_118449850

The Dolphins also choked badly both seasons when they had a chance to reach the play-offs

Last season, they went into the last game of the season against a second string Bills team, needing a win to get into the Play-offs, and took a hiding

This season, lost 7 games in a row, including losses to Jacksonville and Atlanta. But still had a chance going into the game against the Titans, and then got demolished.

Flores definitely helped improve the Dolphins, but I think they've come as far as he could take them. They are now a bang average team.

If a better coach is available, then I think they've made the right decision to move on

Oat23

Joe Judge staying according to Josina Anderson. Mad.

https://twitter.com/JosinaAnderson/status/1480586103719702533?t=H46jTURgqzFBvgIQ0zqpSQ&s=19

Realt Dearg Sec

I'd be alright with Flores in Chicago. Not sure how they'll go about hiring a coach, presume any good gm would want to be in the decision making process, so that could slow them down. Or they'll just hire a terrible GM following standard operating procedure.

Jolly Red Giant

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118449850#Comment_118449850

Like all of the BB clones - Flores is a control freak and his ego was too big for the Dolphins to put up with anymore.

Jolly Red Giant

The Broncos are casting a wide net - the one person I am surprised is not on their interview list so far is Dennis Allen (who was done over with the Raiders in his first stint as HC).

I expect that Dan Quinn is the favourite - he has history with Paton (they were poised to become a HC/GM combo with the Bears in 2015 but Paton chose to stay in Minnesota and Quinn went on to take the job in Atlanta).

If Quinn gets it - look for the Broncos to bring in an OC from the Shanahan/Kubiak tree - possibly Klint Kubiak now that Zimmer has been sacked by the Vikings - or Mike McDaniel who is OC in SF in name only.

Oat23

Good news for Giants fans. Judge is gone.

https://twitter.com/RapSheet/status/1481030287073193994?t=8Kmm3AO0-CTeVcgGA_t3dg&s=19

KrustyUCC

Had to be done really

He showed no progress this year

Foxtrol

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118456931#Comment_118456931

Would be very surprised if McDaniel had any interest in joining the Broncos as an OC.

He is already getting offers for interviews for HC from being the OC of the 49ers and it would be a huge risk to go to Denver as just an OC when they do not have a viable QB or a clear path to get one and have a history of making OCs sacrificial, just ask McDaniel's friend Scangarello what happened when he made a similar move a few years 49ers to be the OC in Denver.

Lance will likely open up the 49ers run game even more next year which will make McDaniel even more attractive a candidate for teams as a HC. Not sure he is necessarily HC material but a risky lateral move doesn't make any sense.

Jolly Red Giant

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118463322#Comment_118463322

If I am not mistaken he has one interview so far for a HC job - Miami - he may get another one or two but if he does it is likely to sound him out as an OC (technically as an Assistant HC).

The problem for McDaniel is that he is OC in SF in name only - Shanahan does the game planning and calls the plays. He is in a similar situation as Bieniemy in KC and Leftwich in TB - OC in name only and it is part of the reason that Bieniemy hasn't got a HC gig yet despite being touted as a potential HC for the past couple of years. It should also be remembered that McDaniel started his coaching career in Denver - then spent three years in Houston with Gary Kubiak before joining Mike Shanahan in Washington - and then spent time with Dan Quinn in Atlanta behind Kyle Shanahan. Now - McDaniel might decide to stay in SF with Shanahan - but he does have strong connections with Denver, has connections with the HC candidate who will likely get the job and would be the play-caller on offence in Denver if he was to take the job (with the prospect of having Wilson as his QB).

You are also inaccurate about Devner making OCs sacrificial - you mention Scangs who was sacked after one season - that was Fangio's decision because there was a clear personality clash (and the Scangs hiring was an after-thought - Kubiak was supposed to return as OC but he wanted Dennison as OL coach and Elway had already hired Munchak). The reality is that the opposite has been the case - Pat Shurmur should have been sacked a year ago - he wasn't. Before him Bill Musgrave was OC for 18 months (after McCoy got canned after a run of six defeats when the offence couldn't score) - before that was Rick Dennision with Kubiak as HC - before that was Adam Gase who went the the Bears with Fox - before that McCoy was OC for 4 years before he got the Chargers gig. Have a look and see how many other teams have changed OC less than the Broncos (they are few and far between - and the Broncos have been sh*te on offence for six years now).

Lance has the potential to be very good - but it is still only potential - and either way Shanahan will still be running the offence. In contrast - Denver will be major players if any of the franchose QBs move this off-season. The two top candidates are Quinn and Hackett - Quinn will probably get the job if the Broncos trade for Wilson (Quinn spent time as DC in Seattle) - Hackett will only get the job if Rodgers is coming to Denver. If Hackett is the pick then his OC will likely be Getsy (GB's QB coach) - if it is Quinn the OC will likely be McDaniel or Klint Kubiak. If the Broncos don't get either Wilson or Rodgers then I expect Quinn to get the HC job and Kubiak will come in as OC with the Broncos making a trade for Cousins.

Now - none of this might happen - a candidate might come out of left-field and the Broncos might end up rolling with Lock next season. But Paton's tenure in Denver will be determined by the decisions he makes over the next few weeks and I suspect that he is not going to go with the off the wall choice - but will pick someone who brings more than just his CV to the job - and that indicates that it is between Quinn and Hackett. The Broncos roster has a lot of good young talent - they have a stack of draft picks and they have a lot of cap room. Getting Wilson or Rodgers would make the team instant SB contenders - even Cousins would be a massive step up from anything the Broncos have had over the past six years. The right decisions in the next few weeks will determine the future of the team for the next 5/6 years.

paulie21

The Texans have fired David Culley

paulie21

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118470137#Comment_118470137

Jerod Mayo has emerged as a leading contender for the job

Jolly Red Giant

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118470832#Comment_118470832

The Patriot way again - the Texans have learned nothing.

Big Pussy Bonpensiero

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118479392#Comment_118479392

Him being a Patriot way doesn't mean it's going to be a success, nor does it mean he's going to be a failure. The reasons for either of those happening are many, but him being a former Patriot will have little to do with it.

Foxtrol

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118465290#Comment_118465290

A lot of fair points there but I disagree with a few key elements which leads me to the opposite opinion.

McDaniel has previously been interviewed by Browns and his reputation will only increase over time - his personality in interviews doesn't come across as someone that jumps out as HC candidate so even as a successful playcalling OC I don't see him being quickly in high demand as a HC.

Fully agree that he'd be in the shop window more as a true OC but you seem to be putting the cart before the horse regarding knowing what the QB situation will look like before the decision will be made on the HC and OC hire. The HC/OC who are hired may have their own preference of which QB they'd like to be brought in and their presence might facilitate a trade for certain QBs but when the HC and OC sign on they won't know who their QB will be when training camp begins. HC and coordinator hires generally occur well before any QB trades.

I wasn't saying Denver are the only team to make OCs sacrificial lambs, it happens with most defensive focused HCs when the team struggles and they are trying to save themselves by shifting blame. Fans similarly are much quicker to turn on OCs than HCs, I think your comments about Shurmur are a good example - it is hard to be an OC when you have a bottom tier QB. If McDaniel wants to be a playcalling OC elsewhere it makes much more sense to only jump when he knows he is going to a team that has a sure thing at QB rather than risking his future chances that he ends dealing being hamstrung by a poor QB, in Denver's case Lock.

This isn't a purely Denver thing, I'd say the same about him going to be an OC anywhere that didn't already have in place either a franchise QB or a young QB with high upside (being seen as a young QB 'whisperer' basically guarantees you a HC shot). I can see why'd you want McDaniel but similar to your previous claims that Kyle Shanahan would have definitely joined Denver as a HC I don't think you're looking at the cons of the opportunity at Denver.

If I was you I'd be keeping away from Quinn. His success with the Falcons was built on the back of Shanahan and with DC coaches becoming HCs even if he brings in a successful one they'll be out the door each next offseason and the bottom could fall out again. Add to that the Cowboys defense seems built somewhat on sand, reliant on things that aren't sticky and against a lot of poor teams, I'd be going other directions

Foxtrol

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118480278#Comment_118480278

At this point there is more than enough data out there of failures time and time again to be skeptical of how Patriot coaches transition into being HCs. Even in the regular world, if you kept hiring candidates from the same competitor and they kept failing once they left their old company then people would learn from their mistakes eventually and be more cautious in repeating the mistake.

Even ignoring the Watson situation, the racist owner, Easterby being a nut job, and how they treated Culley, I simply do not know how a decent HC would want to work for a GM like Caserio, who wants to continue to be on the headset giving his input to the coach during each game. Seems like Belichick is the only one that can keep these lunatics in check.

Big Pussy Bonpensiero

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118480991#Comment_118480991

If they hire him because he's a Patriot that's idiotic. But if they hire him because they think he's a potentially competent HC well then that's another thing entirely. I'm sure they have taken into account all the previous failures and I'd be fairly confident there would be some people in that organisation absolutely opposed to any more Patriot coaching signings. If they have taken that all into account, and they still believe he is the best man for the job, then they should hire him.

Itssoeasy

not really a coaching change but been reported by the usual people that Mike Mayock is out as raiders GM which may or may not be good news for the interim coach. You’d assume not good because a new GM would want their own HC zone there.

adrian522

They need a new GM/coach combo, and should ire both together, Mayock didn't seem to have a whole lot of power there, it was all Gruden so not surprising to see him gone.

paulie21

Rumour mill has Sean Payton stepping away for a year. Possibly another vacancy opening up

Mr. Guappa

Yep, Rapoport confirms Payton is stepping away.

Itssoeasy

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118532282#Comment_118532282

Well the fact that there had been no indication as to what he was doing for next season and the owner saying that she’d no idea what was happening seemed to confirm something was up.

Oat23

Chiefs player personnel guy Ryan Poles is the new Bears GM. He will conduct interviews with Jim Caldwell, Dan Quinn and Matt Eberflus tomorrow but it might not be one of them who gets the job.

Sounds like we threw Ryan Pace and Nick Foles into a cauldron and out came Ryan Poles.

https://twitter.com/RapSheet/status/1486038717500428296

Foxtrol

Sean Payton stepping away from coaching.

Saints are in a terrible place now with a new coach and a cap mess. The NFC South has turned into one of the weakest in the NFC - will likely get there if Brady retires (though this retirement might be an incentive for him to stay another year to stroll through the regular season)

Itssoeasy

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118532358#Comment_118532358

Well it’s certainly a challenging time for the team that within twelve months have lost their franchise QB and head coach who both came to the organisation in 2006. Since the news broke I went and found the saints season by season record prior to brees and Payton arriving and if I’m right from 1967-2005 the saints had only seven winning seasons.

Big Pussy Bonpensiero

Interesting about Payton. I wonder is he eyeing up a franchise that are in win-now mode or is there another motivation for his decision. He's only 58 so he would've had plenty of time to rebuild with the Saints. I suppose he'll be linked with the Cowboys again until he gets another gig.

Foxtrol

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118532709#Comment_118532709

Anyone else would have to trade for him - easier to push through if he is out of coaching for a year or two.

Given how players act when they want a trade, imagine a coach 'holding in', just showing up to meetings and sitting there until they are released.

Jolly Red Giant

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118480278#Comment_118480278

And which one of the Patriot cast-offs has been a success as a HC?

Jolly Red Giant

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118480903#Comment_118480903

You make a lot of valid points -

Quinn did a decent job at Atlanta - if was his first trip round the block and he made a lot of mistakes. While Shanahan had a big influence it would be a mistake to suggest that Quinn had little input. The big question is whether Quinn has learned from his previous experiences e.g. his poor (but not as bad as Fangio) game management. There is no doubt that Quinn will be in demand - and he likely will have more than one offer to pick from. The big question is who he intends to bring in as his coordinators - rumours out of Denver have indicated Darrell Bevell as OC and Al Harris as DC - if that was the case I wouldn't touch him with a bargepole.

As regards Denver - their intent is to move back to the Shanahan/Kubiak branch of the WCO (part of the reason why Getsy got an interview). Trading for Rodgers is clearly Plan A - indeed today there are rumours out of Denver that a package is being negotiated for a trade for both Rodgers and Adams in exchange for Lock, Sutton, Fant and a couple of 1st rounders. while I would prefer Wilson (because of age) it appears he has a preference for the East Coast (although Denver is one of his four indicated preferences). The back-up plan appears to be Cousins who it looks like will cost a 2nd rounder and a conditional pick the following year - with the Vikes eating part of his salary. The possibility of Cousins is keeping Klint Kubiak in the mix as OC for the Broncos.

Despite the supposed close relationship between Paton and Quinn - I think Hackett is probably favourite - with Getsy as OC and a possibility of keeping a lot of the defensive coaches in place to continue to implement Fangio's scheme (Donatell has a long history with the Broncos so there is a possibility that he would stay in Denver as DC rather than move somewhere with Fangio). However, the fact that Paton has not made an appointment yet - he is waiting for a second interview with Kevin O'Connell, which can't happen until after this weekends games. It wouldn't surprise me to see O'Connell end up as HC, Donatell stay as DC, Kubiak come in as OC and Cousins end up as the QB - and while Cousins isn't in the Mahomes, Herbert etc league - he is a major step up from anything that the Broncos have had for the past 6 years. Cousins has the perfect skill-set for the WCO (indeed Mike Shanahan didn't want RG3 in Washington - Cousins was his plan all along - and he picked him in the 3rd round because he knew RG3 would not pan out).

All this being said - McDaniel is still very much in the mix for the OC job in Denver - I agree about him wanting to know the QB, but Denver will have a QB upgrade (Paton cannot afford to fail in those stakes) - and it would set McDaniel up to display his talents to the league.

Big Pussy Bonpensiero

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118537087#Comment_118537087

Good to see the obsession with the Patriots is still as strong as ever, if I didn't know any better I'd say you secretly admire them :)

Why not focus on the pros and cons of the actual person, rather than the organisation he has been attached to?

adrian522

Looks like a Denver hire is imminent:

https://www.espn.com/nfl/story/_/id/33157981/denver-broncos-hire-nathaniel-hackett-new-head-coach-sources-say

cosatron

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118537225#Comment_118537225

if that's true about the trade between GB and Denver, Brian Gutekunst should take it and go with love next year and apparently the 2023 draft has allot QB talent so it could be win win situation. The biggest problem we have is we are 34m over the cap and its going to be a disaster to get under that and Rodgers arrogance won't take a Tom Brady 25m restructure deal.

paulie21

Colts DC, Matt Eberflus is going to be the new head coach for the Bears.

eagle eye

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118537087#Comment_118537087

McDaniels did a good job at Denver before Elway poked his nose in and made a mess of it.

Jolly Red Giant

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118543245#Comment_118543245

ROTFLMFAO

McDaniels was fired at the beginning of December 2010 - Elway was hired as GM in January 2011.

Foxtrol

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118537906#Comment_118537906

As we touched on earlier, you can't completely divorce a coach from the organisation he is coming from. Sure most coaches only get their HC jobs because they are part of a successful organisation - the Jags linebacker coach could be the best in the world and no team would interview him for a HC role.

I agree that we should focus on the pros and cons of the person in question but a significant con is if they are coming from an organisation that from all evidence either does not prepare their coaches to succeed outside of their building or they play such a minimal or specific part of the success of the team that it has never translated into a HC role.

eagle eye

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118545339#Comment_118545339

He expressed interest in getting involved and then McDaniels was fired.

I'm pretty confident that McDaniels would have turned things around and turned the Broncos into a consistently successful franchise if he got another season.

Everything he's done before and since suggests that.

MileHighGuy

Not to dredge up a part of Denver history we would all rather forget, but the McDaniel years were a total dumpster fire. You don't get a consensus often on much in the NFL, but this is as close as you will get.

I do agree he was a great OC in New England before and again after, and maybe he will be a good HC some day (not in Indianapolis or Denver) but I would bet my bottom dollar he will never be a good head coach. To be honest, the Indianapolis debacle was probably worse for his prospects.

Elway was not involved in his firing (nor the org at that point) and a combination of poor late season collapses, questionable roster building decisions, and taping the 49ers at Wembley all contributed to the end of his tenure. I can assure you there was not a single Bronco fan that was sad to see him go, make of that what you will.

Itssoeasy

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118547065#Comment_118547065

Did elway draft tebow and then go 3-9 ? No he didn’t that was josh McDaniel and you can blame John elway for a lot of the broncos mess in recent years but you can’t pin the josh McDaniels cluster of him.

Oat23

It looks like McDaniels is actually going to leave this time. Really surprised as I expected him to stay put where he was comfortable and take over from BB whenever he decides to retire.

The "patriot way" thing does not travel. It might work in New England, but if he goes into Vegas with that attitude like he did Denver I don't see it working. Since the Colts debacle I've thought his only real chance of being a success as HC would be with the Pats where that culture already exists and players would already respect him.

I remember Cutler telling the story on the radio years ago about when he met McDaniels in Denver for the first time. He thought it was going to be a quick hello over some coffee, but McDaniels started by reading off his list of accomplishments that led up to him being named the HC and then had tape of every bad throw Cutler made from the season just finished in which he was a pro bowler. He sat there berating him for half an hour then left. Cutler took out his phone, called Bus Cook and told him he didn't care what he had to do but get him out of Denver 😂.