Sock-Puppetting and the Current Affairs Forum

Chips Lovell

I think it's important to not get carried away here. Having modded the Politics Cafe and more recently Politics, I can assure people that sockpuppeting is incredibly rare. Of the many ways people choose to act the maggot, this is very low down on the list. If you use this incident to conclude that any case of multiple posters adopting the same viewpoint is evidence of sockpuppeting, then you're making the wrong inference. One swallow doesn't make a summer.

EmmetSpiceland

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118433850#Comment_118433850

General wariness is too “broad”. The focus now should be on new members coming in and suppprting SF to the hilt, or old, dormant, accounts suddenly waking up and mobilising under the SF banner.

As I’ve said previously, this has tainted the SF “argument” on here. No one will be interested in arguing with, potential, sock puppets swarming threads.

The idea that other, more normal, parties are using sock puppets on here just doesn’t “stack up”. The numbers just aren’t there.

Obviously, shinners will argue otherwise but the fundamental “problem”, there, is that they view anyone who doesn’t agree with SF as FG supporters, or FFG at least.

FrancieBrady

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118434016#Comment_118434016

The only people I view/or call out as FG or FF supporters are those who broach zero criticism of them.

I have been first on here to criticise SF on several issues and only defend them on the broader republican issues and some policy issues and as the best chance we have to effect a change to the power swap.

Yet I endured the pile-on yesterday about being a shinnerbot,(no doubt in my mind that will be trawled up again just like other slurs) a supporter of children killers and abusers etc etc etc. Routine pile-ons here from people who again, broach no criticism of either FG or FF or both nor the present coalition government.

Two mods have now said that sock puppeting is incredibly rare but we have a cohort calling the troops in to enact a strategy. Gas altogether and spells a further downward spiral of these forums if allowed to carry on.

CrookedJack

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118434150#Comment_118434150

So on one hand we should be generally wary because all political parties might be sock puppets, but also we shouldn't worry about the pro-SF sock-puppets as mods say it's incredibly rare? That's just logically inconsistent.

The fact that mods say sock-puppeting is incredibly rare undercuts your point that other political entities are doing it. Again the only evidence we have of sock-puppeting in support of a political party is this one and it's for Sinn Fein. A refusal to properly acknowledge this, to turn it into an "All sides do it" argument or to somehow imply that the concern is that other pro-sf posters will be tarred with the same brush, just completely removes any moral validity to points being made.

CrookedJack

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118433882#Comment_118433882

Reasonable point, on rereading it seems like i'm directing mods i've removed that bit.

FrancieBrady

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118434275#Comment_118434275

Sock puttery has not been proven to be promoted by any 'party' here. Individuals have had sock puppet accounts.

If you know anymore then tell us and back it up.

Of course we should be generally wary, that is best practice.

Setting up a nice handy little deflection campaign is the issue here. And there are those here trying to call in the troops to do that. Some of the same cohort that got me investigated yesterday. If that is going to be tolerated everytime this cohort fancy and is the future - then we might as well shut down CA and boards now.

Phoebas

"Two mods have now said that sock puppeting is incredibly rare but we have a cohort calling the troops in to enact a strategy. Gas altogether and spells a further downward spiral of these forums if allowed to carry on."

McMurphy was a prolific poster on here for upwards of 10 years in different guises. Maybe we are to accept that the c. 10 accounts that were associated with him were relatively new and that prior to those accounts being operated, McMurphy was operating strictly according to the rules. That seems unlikely to me.

It's more likely that sock puppeting is just difficult to detect, or isn't proactively investigated. It's hard to accept a claim that it's' incredibly rare' when it went undetected by this poster for so long.

EmmetSpiceland

CA can’t be shut down, it would destroy After Hours. There’s already a number of CA “staging posts” in the forum, as well a number of unsavoury posters, but, for the most part, CA draws most of them away.

FrancieBrady

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118434337#Comment_118434337

Do we know when the 2nd account was opened and how long it was going on? Didn't see that mentioned but I could be wrong

Chips Lovell

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118434337#Comment_118434337

He was a serial troublemaker who was probably lucky not to get sitebanned before this. But that's not to say he was a serial sockpuppeteer. It's never been that hard to uncover. It's likely more a case that he thought he could get away with it now given the disruption caused by migrating from one platform to another. He didn't.

Fionn1952

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118434302#Comment_118434302

Fair enough, I'll put the handbags away!

blanch152

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118434275#Comment_118434275

Don't expect logic in the arguments put forward by SF supporters.

You are correct. The only incidence of sock-puppetry that is known is one directed towards favouring the interests of Sinn Fein. The mods says that it is incredibly rate, meaning the likelihood is that SF is the only party to have benefitted on here from it.

What I would surmise though is that the person or entity behind the McMurphy sock-puppetting won't go away too easily. Over ten years invested in the good fight is such that they are likely to try again. EmmetSpiceland is correct to state that the focus now should be on new members coming in and suppprting SF to the hilt, or old, dormant, accounts suddenly waking up and mobilising under the SF banner. That is where the risk of the resurrection of McMurphy presents.

If there is a deflection campaign on here, it is one designed to reduce the embarrassment caused to Sinn Fein and deflect away from what has happened. Those who try and tar others with the sins of a SF-supporting poster should be ashamed of themselves, especially those who claim to be a victim of such tarring.

FrancieBrady

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118434659#Comment_118434659

The 'focus' should be left to the mods and not a cohort who support FG to the hilt.

Needs a direction now from Mods on what is allowed going forward. You guys would happily make the place intolerable, god knows how many times the 'shinnerbot' nonsense has been used by you up to now to deflect and tar.

I'll leave it with the mods now.

blanch152

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118434713#Comment_118434713

The poster making allegations of others possibly being up to sock-puppetting is you:

We should be just as suspicious of pile-ons from parties that have endorsed/suggested anonymous accounts to promote their party.

General wariness is required from mods therefore.

Hiding your accusations in a veiled generalisation is all you are doing.

Facts are that a SF-supporting sock-puppetting operation has been outed. That requires wariness for a repeat as it is probable, given the duration and extent of the operation, that another attempt by the person/entity behind it will be made. End of.

blanch152

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118433958#Comment_118433958

So there weren't identical calls for activism by other political parties. Thanks for acknowledging that you were wrong.

FrancieBrady

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118434751#Comment_118434751

A search for sock puppeting shows that sock puppeting takes place across the site. It happens everywhere on forums and social media blanch.

FrancieBrady

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118434758#Comment_118434758

Yes I was wrong. One is more sinister than the other, the anonymous one.

There is nothing wrong in openly calling your 'supporters' to engage in online activism. It's no different to asking them to go out canvassing for the party.

ohnonotgmail

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118434778#Comment_118434778

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118433958#Comment_118433958

all posters here are anonymous so what is the difference between the two in the case of boards.ie?

FrancieBrady

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118434823#Comment_118434823

There is a difference between anonymous accounts and sock puppets, sock puppetry is deceit. There is a difference in requesting people to open anonymous accounts to support a party and requesting supporters to openly campaign for a party.

FrancieBrady

I've said my piece on this.

I think it is essential that there is a mod ruling on what is allowed going forward. The tedious 'shinnerbot' gatling gun will only get worse if there isn't.

If people have suspicions it should never be allowed on thread...report the poster and leave it to the mods.

blanch152

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118434915#Comment_118434915

You are once again attempting to shut down discussion of a real life event.

There was a sock-puppetry issue involving a person/entity that supported Sinn Fein. That is a fact. There is a danger of it being repeated and we need to be wary, that is the logic for future activity.

Deflection from that concern is your objective. Patently transparent.

As someone who was recently the victim of a mistaken sock-puppetry allegation, you trying to spread similar generalised allegations against other posters who support other political parties in the absence of any evidence at all is particularly despicable.

CrookedJack

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118434915#Comment_118434915

What specifically do you want the mods to rule upon?

Because it seems like you're trying to get mods to say it should be against the rules to raise the suspicion of pro-SF sock-puppets. Which seems bizarre on a thread confirming that there are pro-SF sock-puppets on boards.ie.

I beleive last page or so,should end any doubts as to the real reason behind this thread

Not happy with beasty reply(which is among best/most complete i ever seen from 'office' side of the site),

the OP has taken to outright badgering almost to point of being abusive,someone for simply preceiving them as supporting a different "side" to them

EmmetSpiceland

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118434996#Comment_118434996

Pay no attention to the man behind the curtain!

FrancieBrady

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118434996#Comment_118434996

Sorry...clarification required.

Zero issue with wariness (I have recommended it several times now)

Zero issues with raising concerns, but not on threads.

padd b1975

The infamous "whiff of sulphur" lingers on.

CrookedJack

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118435044#Comment_118435044

Well i certainly agree that there's no value going around calling people out as sock-puppets or shinnerbots, it would be impossible to have any meaningful discussion then. Suspicious should instead be raised to mods as with any other infraction. I feel that this should not mean we pretend sock puppets do not exist here or be forbidden from mentioning them or the this specific pro-SF case.

I also feel it would go a long way towards making the above more possible if you and other strongly pro-SF posters would not refrain from deflecting away from or minimising the existence of this pro-SF sock-puppet. which is what has clearly happened on this thread.

FrancieBrady

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118435099#Comment_118435099

FFS where did I deflect away from or 'minimise' it?

This is the kind of rubbish that goes on here with you guys. Somebody debates you and you start this crap.

Several times I have said this was wrong and sock puppetry was wrong EVEN when people were adamant they had discovered me doing same.

I have said that people will use this to deflect and make snide remarks and the post before yours proves the fecking case.

Quite simply what will happen under your suggestion is that certain posters will raise the issue when it suits them and then claim they were just saying...blah blah blah. You are talking to a poster who has been here a long time. It's a charter to further ruin CA.

SF are the richest political party in Europe and do have 200 employees so it’s not exactly outside the bounds of reality to imagine they’d have a few lads operating on the old World Wide Web.

Unbelievable

The thread about proven SF fuckery has been hijacked from the start by the SF cru to complain about how terrible it is that SF should be accused of what they were caught at

Unbelievable